Talk:Neverwinter Nights 2

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This needs some editing. There's no character resizing, the reviews were not 'very' positive, bugs and general community distaste should be mentioned. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 201.11.226.104 (talk • contribs) 18:13, November 11, 2006 (UTC)

Yes, this game is very buggy --Mlaheji 11:05, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

In the features section, it says that players can now ride horses and build strongholds, but from what I've seen, Obsidian decided not to allow horses to be ridden. >:( --Demonesque 15:53, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

Figures. That was the only thing I was really thinking I'd like to see that wasn't available in NWN. There are a lot of third party extensions that approximate this, but none are satisfactory. Hopefully they will include pack animals at the very least. Canonblack 21:52, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
There aren't any horses in the game at all. --Mlaheji 11:05, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

Contents

[edit] Official website

There is an official website for the game, now: http://www.atari.com/nwn2

Added to "Production, promotion and release" and altered "External Links" text to reflect the change. I have it coming online on "March 28, 2006", the date of the "welcome" message from Feargus Urquhart. 68.14.76.141 12:00, 9 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] User Categories associated with NWN

For those who are interested you can now associate yourself with NWN in the following way:

  • Add {{User Neverwinter Nights}} to your user page to indicate you play Neverwinter nights
  • Add {{user nwscript}} if you can use NWScript
  • Add {{user nwscript-1}} if you consider yourself a beginning NWScripter
  • Add {{user nwscript-2}} if you consider yourself a intermediate NWScripter
  • Add {{user nwscript-3}} if you consider yourself a advanced NWScripter
  • Add {{user nwscript04}} if you consider yourself a expert NWScripter

Enigmatical 23:34, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

They're a little over the top; "best game ever"? This isn't a fansite, I think something less hyperbolic would have been more than sufficient. Plus blue text on a black background is a little hard to read. Canonblack 21:55, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
The {{User Neverwinter Nights}} one I didn't do, but how can it be over the top? Its a userbox... obviously you haven't seen many of the other ones out there. But check the authorship and go speak with them. Enigmatical 22:23, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Release Date

There seems to be a little discrepancy surrounding the release date. The article itself cites June of this year, while the information on the right claims it as September. Just thought this should be brought to attention. --Cronodude360 22:29, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

I updated the info with a link. If someone has seen the actual press release, please update the text accordingly. -- Jao 12:42, 16 April 2006 (UTC)
There have been several release dates given by various developers and spokesmen at different times. I was the one that changed it to a June release date after reading an interview; I updated both the infobox and the article, but made it clear that it was not set in stone. Release dates are always frustrating. All we can do is keep the article updated with the latest information. They seem pretty confident about September 2006, so we should leave that. 68.14.76.151 06:24, 21 April 2006 (UTC)
Atari Australia has listed the release date on their website as September 2006 Enigmatical 06:33, 21 April 2006 (UTC)
I've removed a note about the release date being pushed back to October. The Official Site, as well as numerous posts on the official forums, have made it clear that the game is on track for a September release. DarkMasterBob 06:26, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
At least, someone in an official position believes that Atari has made this decision. I wouldn't think he would say this without checking the facts. http://nwn2forums.bioware.com/forums/viewtopic.html?topic=489181&forum=95&sp=105 -- also see http://nwvault.ign.com/fullstory.php?id=19459 which claims to have an official source. The notoriously poorly updated official site is a completely different matter... -- Jao 10:03, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
DarkMasterBob, you're mistaken. Atari has announced the new release date of October. [1] -- Alec Usticke 05:29, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] New engine uses DirectX?

Says so in the article but I would like to see a source since I was searching for this on the internet and this was the only page I found that had an answer. Sucks for Mac and Linux gamers if its true.

[2] States that it is using Directx 9.0, I still would like to see a source stating that no mac or linux version is planned.

Read 'em and weep. Frankie
^That's not a official word on the linux/mac port. Thing is, Atari haven't given any official word about NWN2 port, except for bioware who said there would be no linux client, unless told otherwise by atari.
^There is a thread on atariforum where people are signing for a mac/linux port, this thread is very active, mainly users who post a few notes stating they will not support the game unless ports are made available. I have signed there myself as I am using Linux and Mac exclusively and loved NWN. --Skippern 00:45, 16 November 2006 (UTC)
[3]

[edit] Ferret Specifics

"Resigned" is a very loaded word with no official source stating that is indeed the case. They parted ways but if it was by choice or not has not been said publicly in a official capacity by either Obsidian or Ferret.

Considering he is now working for Bioware I would say "resigned" is the most appropriate term to use. When an employee no longer wishes to work for a company, they hand in a resignation. No company in their right mind would fire the lead designer before the project is finished and all indications (go look at the official forums and NWN 2 News) were that it was his choice. Enigmatical 22:30, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
"Resigned" implies he left under his own free will/choice. There are NO public records/comments to confirm that is the case. You do not know the specifics of why he left and thus only guessing. The FACTS are we do not know if he was terminated or indeed resigned by choice. -SM
Perhaps then we should use "ceased employment" as it seems to be the only way of putting it to be completely apolitical. I would have to get the post, but I remember ferret himself talking about leaving. It still doesn't indicate the facts but then I dont think Obisidan want people to ever know the facts in this case. Bottom line is he doesn't work there any more right? Enigmatical 23:02, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
You could always ask him: [4]. -- Alec Usticke 05:48, 3 August 2006 (UTC)
LOL... and I am sure that his confidentiality agreement upon leaving will allow him to tell you. When the truth causes nobody harm there is no reason not to say it, so while not factual I think you can imply from the lack of information that we will never know the reality of it. Enigmatical 06:16, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Removal of "Design your own modules to distribute to others or host on the Internet for online play"

I am not sure why the following line was removed (no valid edit summary was given):

Design your own modules to distribute to others or host on the Internet for online play

FYI, the designing of your own modules is definately available, distribution to others is absolutely still available and hosting them on the internet for online play is most assuredly available, though it has been said that you may have to download the walkmeshes seperately (which they are looking into encrypting).

If you beleive this comment should be removed completely, please use this talk page to discuss the reasons why. If it could be modified to read better then by all means go ahead, but removing information about creating your own modules and distributing them is incorrect. Enigmatical 23:17, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] External Links is not a webring

There are hundreds of fan web sites for every piece of major label software ever made. The External Links section does not need to contain your personal pet site. Yes, I am referring to you, and also those other dozen guys doing the same. Frankie

[edit] eberronmod.com

Help me understand what I'm missing here, Yare. WarCry.com is a reasonably famous website in itself, yes, but it doesn't establish notability for something posted in the forums. Eberron Mod is unofficial by its own admittance. A Google PageRank of 3 may just mean it's part of a lot of webrings; I am not seeing the inherent notability of this site, and the value of including it, versus having a strong criteria for external links on this page. I do see, however, that you are Technical Director for Eberron Mod, and thus shouldn't be adding links yourself due to a conflict of interest. As we have plenty of external links, I am removing the French language link as well per WP:EL#Foreign_language_links. Sorry. -- nae'blis 20:46, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

Community plays a large part in Neverwinter Nights (far more than other mainstream titles). We're trying to run a project and a community site. I'll not waste text here defending it, but I see when checking my site analytics that we've been receiving some 50 unique hits from this article each day. While that is a small amount of hits compared to what we receive from sites like Warcry, the Vault, and Wizards.com, I believe it is evidence that the people reading the Neverwinter Nights 2 wikipedia entry see the information as relevant and useful. If relevant and useful information isn't appropriate for a small inclusion at the very end of a wikipedia article, what is? Yare 21:25, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedia is a reference of things that are, not things that may be in the future. The Eberron Mod is, at the moment, wishful thinking. It doesn't exist yet. It may never exist. Assuming it does eventually list, it may not be significant enough to warrent inclusion. If we listed planned mods, or even limited it to mods that shipped, the Neverwinter Nights page would be an out of control list of mods. Wikipedia is not a link directory. When the Eberron Mod exists, try again.

Secondly, you are linking to your own site. The "Technical Directory" for this mod is listed as "Yare", I think it's reasonable to conclude that you're the same person. I appreciate that you didn't try to hide this connection. Still, it's a general Wikipedia rule that you shouldn't write about yourself and your own work. Let others do so. It eliminates potential concerns that you're just advertising for yourself.

(On a related note, I wouldn't suggest waving a PageRank of 3 around as significant. Most of my friends vanity domains have ranks of 4 or 5. My own vanity domain has a rank of 6.) Alan De Smet | Talk 22:46, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

Let's not be naive here. Most articles on wikipedia are started by somebody who has a direct interest in seeing that article included. I'm just an honest guy. As for the pagerank comment, I never said that a page rank of 3 was "significant". Considering, however, that the vast majority of sites on the Internet are PR0, I thought it worth noting. Additionally, the site functions as a modding community for Eberron-related NWN2 projects, and since two major pillars of NWN2 are community and moddability, I don't see why the site faces such stiff resistance given that it epitomizes the two things NWN users are traditionally interested in. Yes, there is a mod project on the site (not yet completed, as you note), but it is also a portal for others interested in Eberron NWN2 content, modding, and adventure modules. As you wish, however. I listed the link because the NWN2 community is interested in it, but if you truly think it detrimental to the integrity of Wikipedia, then by all means delist it. Yare 03:47, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

Not to mention that External link should NOT be used to link to possible illegal versions of the game. Needless to say I've removed them, but I'm not sure if an admin or poweruser would be able to remove the history of the site. KDLarsen 22:24, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] removal of NWN2News

To the anonymous user who continues to remove the NWN2News link please read this first. There are many other sites listed which are community sites, some of which are not specific to NWN2 at all (Sorcerer's Palace, NWCitidel, NWN2.WarCry, NeverWiki, even the NWN2Wiki). Please state very clearly why you feel this one site should be removed yet the others left? I have absolutely no association with the news site but feel that your anonymous removal is not warrented. Enigmatical 02:33, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

I agree that nwn2news should stay, though the article certainly has a few extraneous links. --Muchness 19:58, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

As the admin of nwn2news I will leave such petty actions to be delt with by those that have the time to do so and my thanks to them. However I just wanted to clarify something in response to one of the edit comments questioning why I stated nwn2news was the "first(oldest) news/community site'. The site went live aug 12 2004, days after nwn2 was announced. I do not know of any other site that did go live dedicated to nwn2 in such a short amount of time. Cetainly if there was one that has the creditials to prove such before the above date I'd be happy to concede the point. However that was my logic for stating such, take it as you will. - SM

NWN2 news is an inconsequential small fansite of which there are thousands for the game. It offers nothing that most other pages, including NWVault don't offer already. Therefore, in accordance with Frankies post above, it should be removed. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.149.180.121 (talk • contribs).

I would dispute that comment, here are the stats for the site for Aug 2006: Aug 06 site stats I do not think those numbers reflect a 'small' or 'inconsequential' site, certainly not to the over 31,000 unique visitors or 3.16 million hits last month alone. - SM

Anonymous user 68.149.180.121, you're making yourself look back with your repeated edits. One could easily conclude that your interest isn't in improving Wikipedia, but that you hold a grudge against nwn2news. Every edit you've ever done has been about nwn2news. One of your edits smears User:Enigmatical, claiming "Don't mind Enigmatic, he works for the spamsite" without evidence. Perhaps most damningly, your most recent edit is innocently labeled "Sorted External Links in order of relevance." However the "sorting" amonted to moving a link link one space; hardly an obvious improvement. However, you also deleted the nwn2news site link. Again. It certainly looks like you might have been trying to hide your real intent. If your goal is simply to make Wikipedia better, take a step back. Before making edit more edits to delete the link, continue to discuss it here. Take a break and edit a few other pages you can help with. Alan De Smet | Talk 03:05, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

As to the specific issue of nwn2news: They appear to have original content, including interviews (another). While it could be faked with spam pages, Google believes nwn2news has thousands of pages of content. While it may not be enough to be a useful resource for Wikipedia, I'm not convinced it's an "inconsequential small fansite". Alan De Smet | Talk 03:05, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

We are not in the business of writing a web directory, but -- unlikely as it may seem -- try to write an encyclopedia. I'd suggest removing all links to forums, wikis, community sites, etc. --Pjacobi 11:17, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
Then you would have about 250,000 articles to go through and remove all of those as well. Why set a precident? The purpose of external links is to provide additional information and that is what those links to. You put the most notable ones down and leave it at that. Enigmatical 22:49, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
Wikipedia policy is that a small number of external links are appropriate. The goal is to keep it to a tight, highly relevant list. Wikipedia:External links goes into detail. Alan De Smet | Talk 03:01, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Less notable site

To give an example, Sorcerer's Palace is listed, yet this website is not strictly for Neverwinter Nights, it covers all D&D games instead. So given the current list of external links, which should in all reality be listed? A site dedicated to news and other things directly relating to Neverwinter Nights 2? Or a site which covers all bases and is probably listed elsewhere on every other D&D game already? Enigmatical 22:56, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] More details on the actual game perhaps?

Hi, Not a bad review; perhaps change the order around. A description of the official campaign/story should come before descriptions of say toolsets. Also a description of the official campaign should be more than one paragraph. This should be a game review not a review of tool editors. Otherwise not bad. Cheers, Beugnen

I don't think this should be a review at all, but an encyclopedic article. Your other points might still be valid, just wanted to make that clear ;) Sirius81 | Talk

[edit] November 19, 2006 edits

I completely shuffled around the content on this page. I tried to base the format on the original Neverwinter Nights page. I also edited quite a bit of text and even added some of my own. I also updated the game infobox. I think the page already looks a lot better, however if this is out of line with what's intended with the page feel free to revert. ;) Geologik 07:31, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

Exclusion: "The Persuade skill has been removed and replaced with Bluff and Intimidate (both of which featured in the first game). Bluff now has the same effect at Persuade."

Persuade isn't replaced with Bluff... It's replaced by Diplomacy, and that's why i've replaced it 70.82.40.81 07:00, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] More Information

I've read both this article and the NWN acticle, being interested in these games but having never played them. And as far as this article tells me, this game might as well be a xerox of the first. This article needs to go more in-depth, not only with the game itself, but how it differs from NWN and possibly a more detailed 'Reception' section (having said "the reviews were generally possitive" is hardly enough).

The game has only been out a short while which is why actual gameplay, plot, spoilers, etc. is lacking. I haven't even finished the game yet myself. The games (NWN and NWN2) will be similar in that they use D&D rules and are set in the Forgotten Realms. However, the two vary greatly in story, gameplay, features, etc. Also, this isn't a review site. If you want to read a review about the game check Gamespot or one of the numerous other gaming sites out there. Geologik 01:18, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Support

Basically none exsistent! Neverwitner Nights 2 developed by Obsidian and produced by Atari, neither of which offer support for the many bugs found within the game and toolset. As for updates... well lets just say the updater that ships with the game doesn't work and any reference to an update on the offical website points back to the ingame updater, which again doesn't work. Both Atari and Obsidian have successfully ripped off many of it's customers - many young kids - taking their hard earned money and just haven't cared enought to answer any support emails.

Okay, I haven't dealt with Obsidian or Atari's customer support, so I don't feel qualified to fix this. But, wow, someone should.209.89.155.128 02:49, 2 December 2006 (UTC)


Absolutely. I've flagged it. It's probably one of the most flagrant violations of NPOV that I've ever seen. --Grahamdubya 03:44, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] NPC Listing

Someone listed recruitable NPCs on this page. I do not think that is encyclopedic. I am not familiar with the policy on this exactly, if someone know, please discuss or amend the article. --Voidvector 04:44, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Linux/Mac

There is a lot of stuff in here about how the game sucks because it can't be played on Mac or Linux... it's really not NPOV at all, it reads more like a rant on a blog. Not being a Wiki expert I wasn't sure whether to remove it or not but figured I should mention it. 130.88.185.180 22:56, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

I just rewrote those things, hope it's better. I tried to be as objective as I can when talking about the development decision to use DirectX, and I moved the gamer reactions to criticism section. --Voidvector 01:43, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
You just made my brain hurt a lot. I came on to this page while it was still biased over the whole Linux/Mac thing, and tried to edit in a few grammar and spelling corrections and went onto this edit page in another tab. By the time I clicked edit it was already changed and until I refreshed i thouht I was mad :( Good work on that though, that was some pretty biased stuff up there before. 81.152.168.224 08:05, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
Looks better... I wasn't sure what to do about it really, but it's looking far less biased now. 130.88.185.180 10:31, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
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