Talk:Muten-Rôshi

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Contents

[edit] Renaming Page Again?

[edit] Google-o-Meter

Google Hits for Character Name + "dragonball"
Alternate Name Google Pages
Roshi 34400
Kamesennin 9800
Master Roshi 8190
Muten Roshi 2900
Kame-Sennin 2250
Mutenroshi 1170
Kame-Sen'nin 405
KameSen'nin 78
Muten Rôshi 38
Master Muten Roshi 31

Should we rename? I'm not keen on choosing Roshi because that word is a Zen title (see Buddhist_terms_and_concepts) and not unique enough. Master Roshi would be the logical next choice because the Master title separates the character name from the generic term. However, Master Roshi is third on the character list, behind Kamesennin. Of course, that term has the downside that it's bad romaji and not a character name outright.

Decisions, decisions... JRP 22:03, 29 Jul 2004 (UTC)

You're right; "Roshi" alone won't do, although you might want to make a disambiguation page or add a one-line disambiguation link to the top of whatever's there right now. In this context, I'd use either "Kamesennin" or "Master Roshi" -- you should probably let consistency with other Dragonball character entries be the deciding factor. (Note to self: replace all instances of "Romanji" in Wikipedia with "Romaji"). --Aponar Kestrel 00:53, 2004 Jul 30 (UTC)

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[edit] Old Stuff Follows

[edit] Renaming to Kame-Sen'nin

I moved this article to "Kame-Sen'nin" as the previous name (Master Muten Roshi) was incorrect. (It's either the dub 'Master Roshi' or the romization 'Muten-Roshi', but not both.) Looking at the other Dragon Ball character articles, the majority of the articles with differences in naming between the dub and the manga appear to favor the manga naming. (Krillin -> Kuririn, Goku -> Son Goku, etc.) So, for standardization, this was as good as any and better than the previous. If there is consensus, "Muten-Roshi" (with the accent over the 'o') or "Master Roshi" would also do. I've also fleshed out information on his name so I hope it is clear to readers that only watch the dubbed anime.

I've left the naming "Master Roshi" (without the accent above the 'o') in the article itself since it's easier than writing "Kame-Sen'nin" everywhere. It also feels more like a name. (It's an English phonetic interpretation of one of his Japanese name-titles, nothing more.) Whether those should also be changed or not, I don't know. I'm also going to wait a day or two before changing some of the places he is referred to elsewhere. Redirects are our friends. JRP 02:34, 6 Jul 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Moving

I'll move to "Muten Rôshi", then. I've seen him mentioned as "Master Muten Rôshi" in the Shonen Jump manga. WhisperToMe 01:41, 7 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Can you show me where? I have all the Shonen Jumps and all of the compilation volumes so far, so I'd be able to verify. Note that in the manga, "Muten-Roshi" is generally hyphenated. (Can you find an example where it isn't?)
I still stand by "Kame-Sen'nin" being the best official name we have for the character. (Note that it is the name given to him in the character list at the beginning of every manga volume.) However, I concede that "Muten Rôshi" is slightly more recognizable. That said, we should determine a rule for name spellings-- and since Wikipedia is a text medium we can be safer using the names from the text medium. (Besides, only a handful of character names were ever written out by Funimation, and they were inconsistent at best. For example, they still write 'Mr. Satan' on the back of the DVDs, even when that name is never used in the episode. And don't even get me started about the inconsistencies in the subtitles... JRP 01:58, 7 Jul 2004 (UTC)
I'll show you a scan, or I will show you where in the online manga. WhisperToMe 03:41, 7 Jul 2004 (UTC)
Shoot! I can't find where i found that instance. Anyways, let's add the hyphen. :) WhisperToMe 04:10, 7 Jul 2004 (UTC)
Actually, you win. Krillin calls him that twice in DBZ Vol 12. The name still doesn't make any sense however. (and the more I'm going through, the more I realize that even the English manga isn't perfect. I found cases where it uses 'Saiyajin', for example, when otherwise it's consistently Saiyan. There also appear to be some small translation differences between Viz DB and DBZ mangas; probably translated at different times. (I have a first edition of the volume in question, but I'm not spending the money to get the second just to check this.) I'm curious to check the text in the Japanese edition to see the wording that Krillin used, but I don't have a copy of that one. (I only have about 10 total in Japanese) Score one for you. (But please don't change the name back... this is much nicer and I suspect that people that speak Japanese won't look quite as sideways at it.) JRP 02:06, 8 Jul 2004 (UTC)
Oh, I won't change it back :) - By the way, the "accent" is actually a circumflex. In Shonen Jump, it is used to mark long vowels (like "ou", "oh", or "uu" in other methods of romanization). Standard Hepburn uses macrons to mark long vowels, but Viz' Shonen Jump uses circumflexes instead. WhisperToMe 04:21, 9 Jul 2004 (UTC)


[edit] Standardized info table Template:DB Character

{{DB Character|
RefName=Muten-Rôshi<br>''The Invincible Old Master''|
JapName=TBD|
RomName=Muten-Rôshi|
AniName=Master Roshi|
MangaName=?|
AltName=Kame-Sen'nin<br><small>''The Turtle Hermit''</small><br>Jackie Chun<br><small>''(alias)''</small>|
CanonTo=Original [[Manga]]|
FirstApp=Issue #3|
Race=[[Human (Dragon Ball)|Human]]|
FamConnect=<li>[[Urai Baba]] ''(sister)''}}
Muten-Rôshi
The Invincible Old Master
Image:Master Roshi, Dragon Ball.jpg
Japanese TBD
Rōmaji Muten-Rôshi
Anime Name Master Roshi
Alternate Name Kame-Sen'nin
The Turtle Hermit
Alternate Name Jackie Chun
(alias)
Canon to Original Manga
First Appearance Issue #3
Race Human
Family Connections
  • Urai Baba (sister)


{{DB Character|
RefName=Muten-Rôshi<br>''The Invincible Old Master''|
JapName=TBD|
RomName=Muten-Rôshi|
AniName=Master Roshi|
MangaName=?|
AltName=Kame-Sen'nin<br><small>''The Turtle Hermit''</small><br>Jackie Chun<br><small>''(alias)''</small>|
CanonTo=Original [[Manga]]|
FirstApp=Issue #3|
Race=[[Human (Dragon Ball)|Human]]|
FamConnect=<li>[[Urai Baba]] ''(sister)''}}

This template code produces the table at the far right, very similar to the table proposed by JRP, but with the limitation that the display image must be uploaded with the same name as the displaying page, appending "_photo.jpg". I'm not sure if this can be fixed as currently there are resrictions when using image names as parameters to templates (see:m:Help:Templates#Images in templates).


BCKILLa 07:10, 4 Aug 2004 (UTC)

what, no discussion of Ume-gama or Roshi's family connection to Uranai O-baba? i guess kaiousama's article doesn't include anything about bubbles or gregory, so..

[edit] No real name?

The original Dragon Ball is based on Chinese literature; the early stories take place in a China-type land. Indeed, "Rōshi" was never supposed to be his name, but neither is it some sort of Japanese Zen Buddhist ref either. It's supposed to represent "lǎoshī", standard word for teacher in Chinese. His name would certainly appear to be "Muten"; it isn't a title. This would be reinforced more by the fact his master's name is "Mutaito". It would seem that this is probably his real name, more than anything else (Kame, Jackie Chun, etc.) Also much of his background with Mutaito and Tsuru Sennin doesn't seem to be there at all. Anybody mind if I tweak this entry some? Evan1975 06:06, 31 March 2006 (UTC)

I thought in Dragon Ball volume 3 Kuririn called him August Muten Roshi. I think that's his real name. See here: http://img70.imageshack.us/img70/2931/augustyl6.jpg. Majinvegeta
August is used here as an adjective, not a name (august as in great). He calls himsomething else in Japanese. Jonny2x4 06:29, 3 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tri-beam

Add the tri-beam cannon to the list of roshi's attacks he uses it in dragonball episode 102 in a flash back of him and Master Shen and a bunch of other worriers when fighting against king piccolo's minnions. thnks User:Kami-Sama its a fact.

That is a filler episode, and was never in the original manga, I think that we could suggest that he uses it in the Anime alone, but not in the Manga.
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