Talk:Moises Salinas

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This article may be a violation of the Wikipedia:Autobiography guideline. Any reason why it should not be deleted? Nesbit 19:14, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

I've put a notability tag on the article. It may have been created by Moises Salinas, and if so would be a "vanity" article. No disrespect intended to Dr. Salinas, but his level of publication seems at about the level normally expected for professors, and not sufficient for WP notability of academics. Nesbit 06:21, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

I've replaced the notability tag after it was removed and added an autobiography tag. This would be a good time to start discussing the issue here. Nesbit 01:21, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

My name is Julia Fegenbaum, and I am a member of the Board of the Greater Hartford American Zionist Movement. The original article was posted by me and othe rmmebers of the board. We asked Dr. Salinas to add information because we had a very limited biographical sketch. He is one of only 14 awardees World Wide of the Herzl Award (by the World Zionist Organization) for his Zionist accomplishments. One of very few contemporary Zionist leaders in the U.S., and the only one to found a new chapter of the AZM in the U.S. in the last 40 years. Regardless of his academic accomplishments, he is certainly a major personality in the Zionist world. Perhaps you don't care about Jewish personalities, but that is not a reason to impeach his notability. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.2.163.235 (talk • contribs) 18:01, 10 December 2006 (UTC).

Hi Julia. Welcome to wikipedia. I noticed that the article was created by user:Msalinasphd. That user also added most of the information in the article. Are you claiming that this user was not Moises Salinas, but someone else? What content was added by Moises Salinas, and what was added by others? Generally, autobiographical articles are not acceptable in WP. Even biographical articles written by someone close to the subject are suspect. If a person is truly notable then someone outside that person's circle of associates will see the need to initiate a biographical article. I also question how Salinas' notability can rest on him obtaining a Herzl Award when no one has seen the need to create a wikipedia article on the Herzl Award itself? I propose that you and interested others create an article on the Herzl Award that would include brief biographies of recipients, and move the relevant content from this article into that new article. The present article could then be deleted. If, at a later point, someone (other than Salinas) starts a new article on Moises Salinas, it is much more likely to stand up to scrutiny. Sorry for any negative feelings. We are not supposed to bite the newcomers :-). I hope you decide to continue contributing to wikipedia. Nesbit 21:01, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

Hello John, this has been fun to watch. I personally have no issue with the article being deleted or not. Some of the people on the board, who taught about the idea, sent me the original bio sketch for revision, and I went ahead and posted it since I am an experienced wikipedia user anyway. However, I have to take issue with one comment you make: "his level of publication seems at about the level normally expected for professors." I agree with you on that observation. However, why is this not something notable in and on itself? Would you make the same comment about actors, sports figures, politicians, or artists (e.g., "his roles seem to be about what expected for a 20 year acting career")? I do believe that professors are public figures. I also believe our collective contribution to society is of the greatest value (I won't argue about if the contribution of an average NFL linebacker or an average FOX show actor is grater, but the contribution of academia is certainly no lesser). And any professor who has contributed with several publications is, in my opinion, as "notable" as, for example, an actor who has appeared in half a dozen supporting movie roles. Why are we different? Why is there a different standard? Anyway, just wondering about your thoughts.
Moises.

Hi Moises: Good to hear from you. Most experienced WP editors follow the proposed guideline Wikipedia:Notability (academics). Someone trying to push for inclusion of an article could take one of two stances: (a) the guideline is too stringent or (b) the guideline should be interpreted in a particular way that favours the article. I think your view falls in the first category. Probably though, arguments in the latter category are more successful in preventing deletion of borderline cases. My view is that the interests of the academic community are better served by holding to a higher standard, not a lower one. Anyway, I would urge you to propose the article for deletion yourself on the basis of unintentional violation of Wikipedia:Autobiography. Then later, perhaps after the publication of your second book and after accumulating a weightier citation count, an article about you created by someone else would likely stand unchallenged. None of this is intended to slight your accomplishments, which are really quite respectable. Also, as I mentioned before, there does seem to be a need for an article about the Herzl Awards. Nesbit 01:00, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

I'd be happy to do it. How do I propose an article for deletion, though? Also, given the fact that I am an awardee of the Herzl Award, do you think it would be appropriate for me to write it? Thanks.

I've looked around for the easiest way to do this. As the creator and main author, you can get a speedy deletion by deleting everything on the page and placing a Template:Db-blanked template. To place the template you just enter {{Template:Db-blanked}}. This signals to an administrator that the article was created by mistake and should be deleted without debate. I expect that the administrator will read our discussion and look at the version history to get a understanding of the situation. Give me a day to investigate the Herzl Awards. cheers. Nesbit 23:47, 12 December 2006 (UTC)