Talk:Meta-reference
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[edit] Teh Examples
I am puting this here because I really do not want to be blamed for doing what needs to be done. I am gonna set off an limb and say that over 90% of the "examples" are crap tacked on to be tacked on.
In the Tales from the Crypt spin-off movie Bordello of Blood, one of the main characters says at one point "I feel like I'm in a bad episode of Tales from the Crypt."
Is idiotic, they are ADVERTISING their FRANCHISE How hard is it to understand that, the actor didn't say "I AM in a episode of TFTC" he referenced it saying "It feels LIKE I am" If he said "It feels like I am in a horror film" you wouldn't jump on it being meta-reference... well probally would. This is about DELIBRATLY turning away from the stage and adressing the audiance / cameramen. I will accept Acknowledging the audiances existance, but not 'in this episode they may have done something that looked like this'.
You have to realize also that reference to past films is not Meta Reference. It is once again, advertisment. So in the sequal of Grimlins they held up Grimlins One, guess what, they are filming Grimlins 2 SO he was not aware of being an actor in a production.
Finally in the TV Show section it looks like you all forget that in TV Land time goes on. Just because the guy says something that happened in a previous episode does not mean that he watches the show. And in my example, I understand that you look at it like "ohh, it was in the show before. lets go spam meta-reference"
"Eric Cartman suggests a storyline feature 'Crab People'. This is immediately derided as a ludicrous and implausible idea for a television show. 'Crab People' were themselves featured in a previous South Park episode."
Some of the entries are rather, stupid. Implying that the show sucks and because they can do nothing and say nothing for the length of the show META-REFERENCE!!!!
"On SpongeBob SquarePants, certain characters (usually Squidward Tentacles) often mention things going on for 11 minutes, the usual length for a regular episode."
And some entries are clearly just commical remarks put in by the writer but not having the characters REALIZE they are fictional.
"Futurama features an episode in which, faced with the prospect of risking her and Fry's lives to save Bender, Leela exclaims, "It's not an easy decision. If only we had two or three minutes to think about it!" The show then breaks for commercials."
Personally allowing a TV Show section is the worst idea there is. EVERY show eventually has that little thing that writters toss in there. But if you are gonna put in an example based off of a TV show, the TV Show should have an example for every 5 episodes at least.
[edit] What was before
"Meta-reference describes a situation in a form of media whereby fictional characters display an awareness that they are in a film, television show or book. Sometimes it may even just be a form of editing or film-making technique that comments on the programme/film/b--Wasabe3543 19:53, 31 Mar 2005 (UTC)ook itself."
Does it need to involve fictional characters? What about instructional books that refer to themselves (eg, "In this book, you will learn how...") and so forth? And if that's not a meta-ref, what exactly is it?--Wasabe3543 19:53, 31 Mar 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Seinfeld
What about Seinfeld? Can someone add some of these? One particularly good example is the multi-episode sequence in which they write and shoot a TV pilot "about nothing," and George, over coffee, suggests that their conversation about salsa and seltzer "could be a show."
- Thanks for your suggestion. If you feel a change is needed, please go ahead and make it yourself! Wikipedia is a wiki, so anyone (yourself included) can edit any article by following the Edit this page link. You don't even need to log in, although there are several reasons why you might want to. Wikipedia convention is to be bold and not be afraid of making mistakes. If you're not sure how editing works, have a look at How to edit a page, or try out the Sandbox to test your editing skills. New contributors are always welcome. Guinness 12:39, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Cinema examples; a paradox in this particular meta-reference
"In his 1987 movie Spaceballs, the villains watch a video of the movie to find out where the heroes have gone, and become slightly confused when they end up briefly watching themselves watching themselves on video."
This represents a paradox in that, as long as they would watch the video, the fast forward would continue to show them watch the video no matter how fast it sped up, and they could never see the end for discoving their purpose of how to possibly get an edge on the 'good guys.' Secondly, the video fast forwards faster than the speed that they would actually end up watching the video for, so when they give up is actually past the point in time in which they would have fast-forwarded to beyond that scene of them watching themselves. Which seems impossible. I don't know if this could be concisely added to the article, but it is worth note if even just here in discussion. Nagelfar 20:07, 15 November 2005 (UTC)
One thing... you are wrong (ha ha). I distinctly remember them saying "Oh you went too far". Besides the joke of having the film before was that they are getting it out before it is finished being filmed. Space Balls was an eipidomy of Meta-Reference. Yogurt had thousands of Space Balls merchendice and even suggested they might meet up in Space Balls 2: The Search for More Money.
[edit] Merge with List of fiction that breaks the fourth wall?
There's a fairly extensive discussion and list related to this topic at List of fiction that breaks the fourth wall. Maybe these two articles should be merged? 23skidoo 21:46, 7 April 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Long Page
I noticed this page is almost entirely filled with examples. Are there too many? Should they be broken off into their own page? Dansiman 06:30, 14 April 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Slightly off-topic.
The article currently mentions that Banjo-Tooie features a number of references to Banjo-Kazooie. I've never played either game, but I'm operating under the impression that it's actually quite common for sequels to directly refer to events that took place in previous games. This, of course, would be a continuity reference, not meta-reference. Of course, if they used phrases along the lines of "Hey, I remember you from the first game.", well then, yes, that would be a meta-reference. Can someone confirm whether Tooie talks about things that happened in the first game, or about Banjo-Kazooie actually being a game? Master Deusoma 01:27, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Moliere
I'm not 100% sure, but I think there is some meta-reference in The Miser , when Harpagon goes insane? On The Miser's page, it mentions this but has no specific details. If anyone with a better knowledge of the play could provide details, it'd be much appreciated. Malrase 20:54, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
