Talk:Manuel Chrysoloras

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"One particular group of students, those from the University of Bologna, was the seed of what would become the modern international fraternity Kappa Sigma. These pupils banded together under Chrysoloras to fend off the predations of the unscrupulous governor of Bologna, Baldassare Cossa." Fraternity origins, like secret societies, generally have extravagant origin legends. --Wetman 20:35, 19 Mar 2005 (UTC) Ewok posted Wetman, 19:36, 20 Mar 2005:

I am uncertain as to why you removed the last edit there. The bit about his being the traditional founder of Kappa Sigma is generally accepted by historians and is openly discussed by the fraternity. At the very least, historical records have traced a group calling itself "Kappa Sigma" to Bologna in the 1400s, and certain statements by Chrysoloras' students indicate strongly that he was at least a leader, if not the founder. Other wiki pages (Kappa Sigma, antipope John XXIII) even state this. It is not a fraternal secret, and it is independently verifiable. So why the deletion?

No historical records trace a group calling itself "Kappa Sigma" to Bologna in the quattrocento. Manuel Chrysoloras makes an excellent patron figure for a fraternity identified by Greek letters, but the history of American college fraternities cannot sensibly be connected to the Renaissance-- except in spirit! All fraternities and lodges have this kind of "antique" mumbo-jumbo, "ancient and honorable order of Hibernians" and the Shriners and the like. The official Kappa Sigma fraternity "history" might be directly quoted, in a neutral context. "Generally accepted by historians" is just not true. --Wetman 19:51, 20 Mar 2005 (UTC)

I hate to contradict anyone's findings, but there is historical proof of the link between Chrysoloras and the fraternity. Keep in mind, not every fraternity is known by the name it is known to the general public...secret names do exist for these order...and in this case did for the society Chrysoloras started in Bologna.

As a member of the order, I know there is direct historical proof of the fraternity's historical origins. I will try and dig it up and see if I can post it here. (Of course, without discussing any of the secrets of the order).