Talk:List of electrical engineers

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Contents 1 Another Proposal 2 When is a list redundant? 3 Proposed deletions 3.1 Deane Blazie 3.2 John Wolfe-Barry 3.3 Degreed engineers not noted for contributions to the field 3.4 Red-linked electrical engineers 4 Deleted but deserving discussion 4.1 Faraday & Volta 4.2 Rowan Atkinson 5 Proposed additions 5.1 Heinrich Rudolf Hertz 5.2 Yasser Arafat 5.3 Charles Kettering 6 Consistency with other engineering lists 7 A proposal 8 Add Robert Noyce 9 Valdemar Poulsen

[edit] Another Proposal

I suggest maybe making a new list for famous people with electrical engineering degrees, but have not contributed to the field (i.e. Michael Bloomberg, Yasser Arafat, Rowan Atkinson). Just a suggestion.Jtconroy88 05:18, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

• Your proposal would address some of the problems with the current list, but might open a whole new debate about which of the two lists gets used for any given individual. Also see note below about Arafat, whose degree is in CIVIL engineering. Engineer Bob 07:45, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] When is a list redundant?

Since we have the category electrical engineers, do we still need this list? --Wtshymanski 03:18, 14 May 2005 (UTC)

The category doesn't list their contributions in its listing. This list does.

Categories "mark" each article individually. Lists do not.

Categories and lists are not interchangeable. Cburnett 06:26, May 14, 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Proposed deletions

[edit] Deane Blazie

This entry in the list appears to be borderline vanity (incidentally, he also appears in list of programmers). The linked article has never been created, and most "Deane Blazie" hits on an Internet search link to his company website or press releases. I'd vote for removal. Engineer Bob 07:27, 15 October 2005 (UTC)

Unless or until someone starts an article, I agree. --hydnjo talk 01:37, 30 October 2005 (UTC)

Note: Blazie was deleted from the list on 4 November 2005 by Wtshymanski.

[edit] John Wolfe-Barry

This individual was actually a civil engineer, and despite the note on this list he had only incidental (if any) connection to the British IEE. Although late in his career he did serve as chairman of Cable & Wireless, that alone would not appear to justify inclusion on this list. I vote for removal. Engineer Bob 07:59, 15 October 2005 (UTC)

No objection being noted, Wolfe-Barry has been deleted from the list. Engineer Bob 17:54, 24 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Degreed engineers not noted for contributions to the field

Suggested by hydnjo in the discussion on Rowan Atkinson below: ... another questionable entry would be Michael Bloomberg. The second column on the list, Contribution(s), to me suggests notability related to EE. Lets discuss (notability) further.'

I concur with this suggestion. The same line of reasoning would eliminate Chinese political figures Huang Ju, Li Changchun, and Zhu Rongji from this list. Engineer Bob 21:49, 29 October 2005 (UTC)

More recent discussion on this topic can be found below under the heading "A proposal".

[edit] Red-linked electrical engineers

Again from hydnjo in the discussion on Rowan Atkinson: ... can we agree that the list should not include red linked people? If a user wants to add someone they should at least start a stub which should weed out a vanity entry ...

This is consistent with my rationale above for deleting Deane Blazie. Engineer Bob 21:49, 29 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Deleted but deserving discussion

[edit] Faraday & Volta

Wtshymanski deleted the entries for Michael Faraday and Alessandro Volta earlier today on the basis that they predate electrical engineering as a discipline. I thought about this issue at length before adding them to the list recently. They certainly are not EEs as we define the term today, and thus are usually thought of as scientists -- but I'd argue that they were laying important groundwork for our profession. I'm not convinced that they don't belong on this list. Engineer Bob 06:11, 28 October 2005 (UTC)

I think "electrical engineer" is nicely focussed and letting anyone who studied physics in the last two millenia on the list would dilute it- otherwise soon you'll have Thales from 600 BC on the list. I'd like to drop Edison from the list on the grounds he was an inventor, not an electrical engineer - but having been badly burned by the whole Tesla controversy I know when I'm licked. I suppose we could drop Heaviside because he was more of a mathematical physicist than a practicing electrical engineer, but since he confined his studies almost entirely to electrical matters I suppose he's sort of an honorary EE. --Wtshymanski 17:40, 28 October 2005 (UTC)

My case for Volta is the weaker of the two; but the British IEE appears to recognize Faraday as a sort of proto-EE and has a long biography on their website (linked in his article). As for Edison, most of his inventions were not new, and he is best known for making the ideas of others practical -- which is what engineering is all about. Engineer Bob 15:18, 29 October 2005 (UTC)

Still not happy about Faraday, but Lord Kelvin belongs on this list because of his telegraphic cable work. --Wtshymanski 18:58, 31 October 2005 (UTC)

I don't see why the fact that these people did not have formal degrees in electrical engineering ought to stop us. They made contributions to electrical engineering as a discipline, which I think gives them a place on this list. The same would not be true of everyone who worked on electricity related topics - this does not mean we'd have to put Thales on there. --Pierremenard 16:01, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

Also, note that List of aerospace engineers includes Leonardo de Vinci, even though he was around quite a bit before AE materialized as a discipline. --Pierremenard 16:03, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

Valuing consistency above accuracy is entirely within the Wikipedia tradition. --Wtshymanski 18:46, 30 January 2006 (UTC)

Based on support from Pierremenard, I have restored the entry for Michael Faraday. Engineer Bob 06:54, 28 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Rowan Atkinson

hydnjo deleted Rowan Atkinson from the list earlier this week, and while I personally don't have strong feelings one way or the other, I'd like to see some discussion here. Although Atkinson (aka "Mr. Bean") is best known as a comedian, he is "trained as an electrical engineer" per the list's introductory description. If we're proposing a more restrictive criteria for inclusion, there are a few others (Chinese politicians, for example) that should be deleted as well. Engineer Bob 06:19, 28 October 2005 (UTC)

Hmmmm, he's back ... An anonymous user (80.58.6.235) has restored Atkinson's entry, although his name is spelled wrong and he's not in the correct sort position. If we're going to put him back in the list, let's at least do it right. Engineer Bob 15:10, 29 October 2005 (UTC)

Hmm, may I include myself and some of my friends because we're not only "trained as electrical engineers" but were also awarded a BSEE? And for that matter how about you? ;-)

Anyway, another questionable entry would be Michael Bloomberg. The second column on the list, Contribution(s), to me suggests notability related to EE. Lets discuss (notability) further. Also, can we agree that the list should not include red linked people? If a user wants to add someone they should at least start a stub which should weed out a vanity entry like well, me. I'll go ahead and put Mr. Bean in the right place for now. --hydnjo talk 18:36, 29 October 2005 (UTC)

Atkinson's entry was deleted yesterday by Pierremenard; see discussion below under the heading "A proposal". Engineer Bob 15:50, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Proposed additions

[edit] Heinrich Rudolf Hertz

Hertz was another scientist who did significant enabling work for electrical engineering. If we agree to restore Faraday and Volta to this list (see above), Hertz should also be added. Engineer Bob 07:16, 28 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Yasser Arafat

He said on TV that he originally studied electronics at university--Light current 19:48, 26 November 2005 (UTC)

Arafat's degree was in civil engineering; I've removed him from this list. Engineer Bob 23:37, 26 November 2005 (UTC)

Are you sure? He definitely said he studied electronics on TV. I heard him. Was he lying?--Light current 12:34, 16 December 2005 (UTC)

Although Arafat (like most engineers) may have been exposed to electrical engineering during his studies, electronics as a field did not emerge until after he graduated -- in 1956 as a civil engineer, according to his bio here on Wikipedia. Engineer Bob 18:05, 16 December 2005 (UTC)

Yes that does make sense. He must have been joking with the interviewer!--Light current 18:14, 16 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Charles Kettering

This one appeared non-controversial, so I added him to the list. Besides holding a EE degree, he founded Delco and is credited with numerous patents including the first practical electric starter and the first reliable battery operated ignition. Engineer Bob 08:45, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Consistency with other engineering lists

My suggestions above regarding eligibility for this list (EE notability and no red-link) were made in haste. For sake of consistency I went up to Category:Lists of people by occupation to check the other disciplines: MEs, ChEs, IEs etc. There seems to be no common format but more importantly the editors in those and other lists of engineers seem to be far less selective than what I have suggested here. While we debate Faraday, Volta and Hertz the ME list includes Leonardo Da Vinci, Alfred Hitchcock and John Sununu. Oh, and the chemical engineering list is adorned with Cindy Crawford! I'm thinking that we should review these and other occupational lists before we set any EE standards that are out-of-line with the rest of the community. I'm sorry that I didn't check before spouting-off.  :-( --hydnjo talk 03:10, 30 October 2005 (UTC)

I disagree, I believe there should be a high standard set in order to be listed. If we allow anyone with a degree in Electrical or Computer Engineering to be added to the list, it will become too long. Although, I do believe that people that predate electrical engineering degrees are eligible for the list if they did make a major contribution to the field. Their consideration for inclusion should be determined by the value of their contribution. If anything, the other lists should be brought up to the standards of this list. Jtconroy88 05:12, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] A proposal

A list of people with electrical engineering degrees is not notable. See Wikipedia:What wikipedia is not under Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information.

On the other hand, a list of people who have made contributions to electrical engineering would be tremendously useful. To that end, I think Michael Bloomberg and Zhu Rongji need to be deleted from the list. --Pierremenard 06:59, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

• I agree completely -- see some of my earlier comments above. Using this same rationale, I've now deleted Li Changchun & Huang Ju. Engineer Bob 08:29, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

• Informational note: Pierremenard has now deleted Rowan Atkinson, Bernhard Goetz, and Julius Rosenberg using this rationale. Engineer Bob 15:50, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

• Sugest deleting Simon Sunatori as no-one aside from Wikipedia has ever heard of him, according to Google. The article looks like self-promotion and the pen article is near pure advertising copy. --Wtshymanski 00:00, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
  • I concur, and the pen article was recently deleted anyway. I'm deleting him from the list. Engineer Bob 06:57, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

• I also agree with this proposal. --hydnjo talk 22:22, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Add Robert Noyce

Hi, I'm new the wikipedia, but I hope that my suggestion will be taken seriously. I propose for Robert Noyce be added to the list of engineers. He is one of the co-founders of Intel, and dubbed the "Mayor of Silicon Valley." I don't think I need to say much more about him, his accomplishments and contributions to the Electrical Engineering industry speak for itself. Thank you for hearing my case. Please add Robert Noyce to the list of Electrical Engineers! Thank you. - hsuyangchang June 4th, 2006.

• I agree; also note that he is a recipient of the IEEE Medal of Honor. Unless someone objects by the end of the week, I will add him to the list. -- Engineer Bob 06:08, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Valdemar Poulsen

Shouldn't Valdemar Poulsen, the inventor of magnetic recording be on the list of electrical engineers? His 1998 idear and patent matured into the magnetic wire recorder of 1947. A major feat, forming the later basis of tape recorders, and hard disk drives