Talk:L. Paul Bremer

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Because of their length, the previous discussions on this page have been archived. If further archiving is needed, see Wikipedia:How to archive a talk page.

Previous discussions:

• Archive 1 (Dec 30 2005 to Dec 25 2004):
• Archive 2 (Dec 25 2004 to Aug 29 2003):

Contents 1 Comments About Bremer: What Bloggers Were Saying 2 The Brazilian Communist Invasion 3 Copyright Images 4 Foreign Languages 5 Mr. Bremer's Book: My Year in Iraq: The Struggle to Build a Future of Hope 6 Something about some "important Orders" 7 Image copyright problem with Image:Bureaucrat_man.jpg 8 Removal of content from "Progress of Reconstruction of Iraq's Infrastructure" subsection ("Critics of Bremer's Appt.") 9 Biographical Account 9.1 The Section on Further Reading 9.2 Clean Up Tag 9.3 Op Ed Article by L. Paul Bremer, III 10 Early Departure Revisited 11 Unsubstantiated assertions 12 Rewording "shepherding" 13 Bremer's comments on the Inspector General 13.1 Cleanup Needed

[edit] Comments About Bremer: What Bloggers Were Saying

As another contributor pointed out, Bremer was ambassador to The Netherlands for a while toward the end of the cold war. There is something to the suggestion that his ambassadorship was odd, but it was not odd in the way suggested. As a young FSO (all of whom serve in diplomatic postings, by the way - it is ambassadorships only a few get), he served as filter of incoming news for the 7th floor at State. That puts one in direct contact with Assistant and Deputy Secretaries, maybe sometimes the boss himself. Bremer made an impression on Al Haig. Haig pointed Bremer out to Kissinger. Thus a career was made. He got his appointment to The Netherlands because we wanted to place theater nukes in Western Europe, and the Dutch were among the hold-outs. If The Netherlands would accept nukes, the rest of Western Europe was in the bag. Schultz was told that Bremer could do the job. It was very much the sort of closely orchestrated, daily contact with the powers in the administration sort of thing that characterizes his present job. He won that one. No surprise that he has been called on to try again. Folks, he may be self-serving, he may not know as much about the Middle East as the FSO quoted saying his knowledge of Iraq wouldn't fill a thimble, but don't mistake him for dumb. He was "the ambassador with the floppy disc brain" to the Dutch (sort of dates him, doesn't it?).....

Reference: Archives

[edit] The Brazilian Communist Invasion

Eeek! hide your kitty cats or else User:200.68.127.30 and possibly others who don't bother to register, will harvest their brains for scientific studies. It appears the article is on this anonymous user's "watchlist". Watchout for these sneeky buggers.

[edit] Copyright Images

In re to the anonymous contribution from User:68.127.241.195, these photos have Wikipedia copyright tags. Nothing to indicate these photos placed here are "for-profit". Ariele 02:27, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Foreign Languages

Is everyone sure he speaks all those languages. I find it hard to believe... Plus I remember he was taking arabic class during his time in Iraq (read it in Time)

Mr. Bremer does indeed speak or comprehend all those languages. This is why:

• Arabic - yes, he took lessons while in Iraq (30 minutes every day). We do not know if he continued with his daily lessons.
• Spanish - yes, he even published a book titled Notebook of a Student. Plus, we believe the years he spent in France in a town close to the Spanish border had something to do with his knowledge in the Spanish language
• Persian - We believe that would be Farsi a language spoken in places like Iran. We believe he speaks or comprehend the language
• German - Yes, we believe he either speaks or comprehend, and the name Bremer has German roots (i.e. Anglo-Saxon)
• English - A definite yes, since we've all heard him speak
• French - That's a definite yes too.
• Norwegian - We believe he either speaks and/or comprehends Norwegian because of his post in Norway.
• Dutch - We believe he either speaks and/or comprehends for the same reason, his post in the Netherlands
• We believe his familiarity with foreign languages does not end here. Someone once said Mr. Bremer can retain information like a floppy disc.

Ariele 14:53, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

Bremer has been interviewed on Dutch TV many times (before and after Iraq) but I have never heard him speak in Dutch. But it would be no surprise if he reads and comprehends Dutch. NescioNomen 15:52, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

The evidence outlined above in support of the claim that he speaks all these languages borders on the ridiculous. The claims are completely unsubstantiated and should be removed until someone can do a better job.

[edit] Mr. Bremer's Book: My Year in Iraq: The Struggle to Build a Future of Hope

I've not read his book. However, I listened through 6.5 hours of an abridged for audio (whatever that means) version of his book. Mr. Bremer's personal accounts in the abridged for audio version of My Year in Iraq did not come across to me as someone who felt he was/is set up as the fall guy.

Without divulging too much detail, the readers (or listeners) should be prepared for graphic images (in words of course) of the atrocities commmitted by "you know who" during the old Bathist regime.

That's all I'm going to reveal here. I will say that the abridged for audio is rather vague. <<<<<,,,Ariele 15:00, 12 January 2006 (UTC)

The hardcover copy is suppose to be 432 pages long (the audio is about 6.5 hours long, you do the math).

The material content is not suitable for young children. (e.g., Adult language, i.e., Profanity)

[edit] Something about some "important Orders"

"The most important tools used by the Bush administration to maintain varying degrees of economic and political control in Iraq were the 100 Orders enacted by Bremer before his departure.

A sampling of the most important Orders. Order #39 allows for the following: (1) privatization of Iraqs 200 state-owned enterprises; (2) 100% foreign ownership of Iraqi businesses; (3) national treatment of foreign firms; (4) unrestricted, tax-free remittance of all profits and other funds; and (5) 40-year ownership licenses. Order #40 turns the banking sector from a state-run to a market-driven system overnight by allowing foreign banks to enter the Iraqi market and to purchase up to 50% of Iraqi banks. Order #49 drops the tax rate on corporations from a high of 40% to a flat rate of 15%. The income tax rate is also capped at 15%. Order #12 enacted on June 7, 2003 and renewed on February 24, 2004, suspended all tariffs, customs duties, import taxes, licensing fees and similar surcharges for goods entering or leaving Iraq, and all other trade restrictions that may apply to such goods. Order #17 grants foreign contractors, including private security firms, full immunity from Iraq s laws. Order # 81 prohibits Iraqi farmers from using the methods of agriculture that they have used for centuries. The common worldwide practice of saving heirloom seeds from one year to the next is now illegal in Iraq. The Bremer Orders fundamentally altered Iraq’s existing laws. For this reason, the Bremer Orders are also illegal. Transformation of an occupied country’s laws violates the Hague regulations of 1907 (the companion to the 1949 Geneva conventions, both ratified by the United States), and the U.S. Army’s Law of Land Warfare."

"...there are reasons why some people turn to terrorism. There are political reasons, there are economic reasons. Some people are simply criminals...." quoted by L. Paul Bremer, III (pbs interview Global Threat June 6, 2000).

Concerning the orders Paul Bremer issued while being head of CPA, the texts of all of them can be found on the homepage of CPA (www.cpa-iraq.org). Don't link these texts though, as the main page says the CPA homepage will go off the web on June 30, 2006 due to the fact that CPA does not exist anymore. So, should you consider to link the orders to wikipedia, download them and store them somewhere else. 195.138.51.10 14:36, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

That might be a sign of the incompetence of the people Bremer hired. Last year it said the site would go dead on June 30, 2005. I wonder if it once said the site would go dead on June 30, 2004 -- the day limited sovereignty was given to Allawi and the other political appointees. -- Geo Swan 15:50, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Image copyright problem with Image:Bureaucrat_man.jpg

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Please signify the copyright information on any other images you have uploaded or will upload. Remember that images without this important information can be deleted by an administrator. You can get help on image copyright tagging from Wikipedia talk:Image copyright tags. --OrphanBot 07:30, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Removal of content from "Progress of Reconstruction of Iraq's Infrastructure" subsection ("Critics of Bremer's Appt.")

The following content was removed 2006.1.31 as it is not befitting the format of the main article:

"[This section to totally unreferenced which is in flagrant violation of the rules of this wikipedia. This is especially unfortunate since the clause "with the notable exception of the meters" makes an objectively unsupportable claim that the oil was being "stolen" by the Coalition. Nor, when the writer says "the progress of the reconstruction" of the utilities was "disappointingly slow", does the author state compared to what. Nor the the author elaborate on how contracts being awarded to U.S. firms (whether connected or well connected) would result in slow construction. This section needs serious repair or flat out removal to a website with a stated axe to grind.

Actually, the truth is that this entire "Critics" section of this article viciously one-sided and doesn't flinch from repeating the most absurd baseless rumor (such as Bremer fleeing an Iraqi lover). This section should be closed or totally rewritten by someone who knows the meaning of the word "objective."]"

This is an issue which should be addressed in the discussion page and not in the main article itself. With the risk of sounding overly didactic, I would like to remark that if the author of the aforementioned addition is to properly take issue with an article or section therein, he/she should follow the proper procedure of either editing in wiki format, or marking it for other users to edit.

JuniorMuruin 16:43, 31 January 2006 (UTC)JuniorMuruin

After another sweep over the Archived discussions, there's absolutely no way I (and other as well) can accept any of this seriously. How can we? We should consider taking a vote to bann User:Geo Swan from editing here!,,,,,Ariele 04:01, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

I haven't looked at this article in a while. When I come back to it now, I see that large chunks of it do indeed go beyond the proper reporting of criticisms of Brenner and actually adopt such criticisms -- stating opinions as fact. On the other hand, there are other passages that violate NPOV in Bremer's favor, such as the statement that he "had to make decisive and tough decisions" (as opposed to people in other jobs who had to make indecisive decisions?). The whole article needs heavy work to cite sources and properly attribute opinions. JamesMLane t c 17:56, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Biographical Account

[edit] The Section on Further Reading

This article is about Paul Bremer. The inclusion of a book written by a former Army Corporal removed (see Coalition Provisional Authority).

[edit] Clean Up Tag

This brings up another point, there is a section in Bremer's article that requires cleanup. If there is an axe to grind, it would seem that there's lack of cooperation. You should read Paul Bremer's book to get a better idea of what was spinning around everyone's head over there in Iraq and Washington.

I removed the clean up tag on 2/5/2006 after the editorial revision of this article.,,,,Ariele 13:52, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Op Ed Article by L. Paul Bremer, III

January 13, 2006

Op-Ed Contributor (New York Times)

In Iraq, Wrongs Made a Right By L. PAUL BREMER,III

THE recent debate set off by the publication of my book about my time in Iraq has shed more heat than light. Here are some of the fundamental lessons I took away from the American experience. First, repairing the damage to Iraq by decades of tyranny was never going to be easy, and I made some mistakes. For example, consider our efforts to ban senior Baath Party officials from public office. This was the proper decision - the party had been a key instrument of Saddam Hussein's dictatorship - and our policy was intended to affect only the top 1 percent or so of party members. The error was that I left the implementation of the policy to a political body within the nascent Iraqi government, where it became a tool of politicians who applied it much more broadly than we had intended. De-Baathification should have been administered by an independent judicial body. We also placed too much emphasis on large-scale reconstruction projects. While the urgent need for modern highways, electrical generating plants and the like was clear, we should have anticipated that building them would take a long time. Our earlier efforts should have been directed more tightly at meeting Iraqis' day-to-day needs. To speed up those larger projects, I should have also insisted on exemption from the usual bureaucratic and contracting rules. This lesson was brought home to me in a dramatic fashion a few weeks after I arrived. We had learned that six major hospitals in Baghdad urgently needed new generators to run their operating rooms and air-conditioning plants. Our budget director told me I could use American funds, which were subject to United States federal contracting rules, or Iraqi government funds, which were not. Using American money, he told me, would mean waiting four to six months for the generators. We used Iraqi funds and got the equipment in eight days. In the future, Congress must make provisions for legitimate exemptions. Another clear lesson is that the United States must be better prepared for the post-conflict phase should we find ourselves in similar military situations in the future. The administration has made a good start by setting up offices of reconstruction in the State and Defense Departments. But the effort must be broadened through the government and especially the private sector. The goal should be a quick-reaction, public-private Civilian Reserve Corps consisting of people with expertise on matters like the establishment of telecommunications facilities, rebuilding of electrical power plants, modernizing health care systems and instituting modern budgeting procedures. Last, much attention has been paid to my concern about the need to retain adequate manpower to defeat the terrorists and insurgents. Our military leaders said they had sufficient forces to ensure law and order, and that additional soldiers might increase Iraqi hostility. Theirs was a respectable argument. But I disagreed with it. And while I had concerns about the quality of Iraqi forces two years ago, their training has since been revamped. Today they are playing an increasingly important role in defending Iraq. Despite the missteps and setbacks, there is little question that, thanks to efforts by the American-led coalition, enormous political and economic progress is being made in Iraq today. Two years ago, Al Qaeda's leader in Iraq, Abu Musab Zarqawi, told his followers there that there would be no place for them in a democratic Iraq. One year later, Iraqis voted in the country's first genuine elections. Then they wrote and approved a new Constitution. And last month 70 percent of voters turned out to elect a new Parliament. Now that body should modify the Constitution to address legitimate concerns of the Sunnis. As for Iraq's economy, at liberation it was flat on its back: the World Bank estimated that in 2003 the economy contracted by 41 percent. Now Iraq benefits from an independent central bank, and a new currency whose stability is a remarkable indicator of confidence. The economy is open to foreign investment and commercial laws have been modernized. The International Monetary Fund reports that per-capita income has doubled in the last two years and predicts that Iraq's economy will grow 17 percent this year. No wonder registration of new businesses has jumped 67 percent in the last six months. There is, of course, still much to be done. American troops and Iraqis continue to die battling criminal elements of the Saddam Hussein regime and Qaeda terrorists. President Bush has correctly identified Iraq as the central front in the war on terrorism, as Osama bin Laden himself acknowledged when he told his followers "the third world war has begun in Iraq" and that it would "end there in victory and glory, or misery and humiliation." Despite these enormous stakes, some Americans have called for setting a timetable for our withdrawal or even pulling out now. This would be a historic mistake: a betrayal of the sacrifices Americans and Iraqis have made; a victory of the terrorists everywhere; and step toward a more dangerous world.

[edit] Early Departure Revisited

According to Bremer's account, the transfer was planned (go look it up in My Year In Iraq the Struggle to Build a Future of Hope beginning with p. 384, bottom paragraphs). The idea did not originally come from Bremer.,,,,,Ariele 01:25, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

One remaining weakness of this article, and the Coalition Provisional Authority article is that they lack any coverage of the change in plan for the CPA's duration. Originally its term was to run for at least another six months before it passed on limited sovereignty to an appointed government. The schedule was advanced in early 2004. The CPA rushed to spend all of Iraq's oil revenue prior to the handover. These articles completely neglect to cover this change of plan. I can't help wondering whether the references Ariele reports in Bremer's book about the handover's schedule change may not refer to change of plan of month's duration, not the two day schedule change that took everyone by surprise. -- Geo Swan 19:03, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Unsubstantiated assertions

Today I removed the assertion Bremer was authorized to modify Iraqi society.

On August 19, 2005 I wrote:

The article currently reads: "Bremer was empowered to issue decrees to modify Iraq's society and infrastructure." Who empowered him to modify Iraq's society? He was not empowered to modify Iraq's society by UN resolution 1483. Was he empowered to do so by some other UN resolution? If some document really tried to empower Bremer to modify Iraqi society this article should link to it.

On September 6, 2006 I wrote:

Because someone has asserted, without attribution, that Bremer had powers and responsibilities that I have concerns about. The article has said that Bremer was authorized to alter Iraqi society. Altering a society sounds like it could be a war crime. So, the exact wording is important. It is also possible that the statement in the article was too enthusiastically paraphrased, and suggests Bremer had powers and responnsibilities he did not actually have. If that is the case the assertion should be removed.

No substantiation has ever been offered -- hence the removal.

I also challenged the unsubstantiated assertions that Bremer was popular, and well-liked. Another user offered an anonymous blog as substantiation. That anonymous blog offered an anonymous third person account that claimed a single anonymous Iraqi asked for Bremer's email address, so he could thank him for his management. This is not an adequate source for the claim that Bremer was popular, well-liked or well-respected. -- Geo Swan 18:06, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Rewording "shepherding"

I questioned the assertion that "Reportedly, his method of creating the Iraq Interim Governing Council was compared to that of 'shepherding'". "Reportedly"? -- who reported it? "Compared"? who compared it? I am shortening the paragraph that includes this sentence because it is just isn't clearly written.

The importance of the authority to select cabinet portfolios is relative to the power ministers have, once selected. The next sentence said that Bremer retained veto power. So, it sounds to me that this should not be described as an "important power".

The assertion that the members held more responsibilities after their appointment is meaningless. So I removed it -- Geo Swan 18:44, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Bremer's comments on the Inspector General

I removed this paragraph, because it is deceptive. It implies that Bremer created the position of inspector general. Actually the United States Congress created the position of Inspector General of the Coalition Provisional Authority on November 6, 2003. The questionable paragraph implies that Bremer created the position, and that the IG's responsibility was to track down fiscal mismanagement of Iraq's oil revenue during the UN's oil-for-food program. In fact the IG's responbility was to monitor the fiscal management of Bremer's administration.

"Bremer announced the establishment of the offices of the inspector general on March 30, 2004 [1]. "Now, almost a year after liberation we are just beginning to understand the outline of the theft and corruption associated with the Oil for Food program. Both the United Nations and the Iraqi Governing Council have begun investigations into a program initiated to help the Iraqi people instead allegedly diverted Iraq's money to other, possibly illicit, uses....Never again should the Iraqi people's wealth be squandered on palaces and Ferraris. Never again should such corruption be allowed to take root....", said Bremer. At least not until June 28, 2004 as reports indicate as much as $2 billion dollars may have been stolen from various Iraqi ministries. [2]"

Above is the questionable paragraph I excised. -- Geo Swan 02:41, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cleanup Needed

I removed as much vandalism (more or less) as I could, though it's possible it will be reverted. There's probably a lot more, including unsubstantiated claims, and this article needs mroe thorough fact-checking.

Some claims I removed: Bremer approved of torture, Bremer didn't have the right to run the country, Bremer received the Presidential Medal of Freedom for "murdering Iraqi civilians," etc. Check the revision history to see more.

I don't like the guy, but that's no reason for such blatant libel and crap-throwing.