Talk:Knights of Solamnia

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ReyBrujo (talk • contribs)
DoomsDay349 (talk • contribs)

[edit] The Oath and the Measure

Added The Oath and the Measure. I am planning on creating a Wikibook to collect all the rules scattered around the Dragonlance books, trying to recreate the fictional Oath and Measure for common people to read. -- ReyBrujo 18:31, 6 October 2005 (UTC)

Actually, maybe the Wikibook should be about Knights of Solamnia in general... although I am still thinking one only for The Oath and the Measure -- ReyBrujo 14:18, 7 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Paladins?

The knights of the order, are they fighters or paladins? SpectrumDT 00:58, 21 November 2005 (UTC)

Knights of the Crown and the Sword are considered fighters. Knights of the Rose could be considered paladins interpreting the Dragonlance rules. In the novels, though, their magical powers are really very rare, and I believe they are considered fighters only. -- ReyBrujo 02:56, 22 November 2005 (UTC)
In the book Knight of the Black Rose, we see a Solamnic Knight (Peradur, I believe) healing by laying on hands. And I don't think he is a Rose knight... SpectrumDT 20:34, 18 June 2006 (UTC)
Apparently, only Habbakuk does not give clerical powers to knights. Kiri-Jolith gives some minor healing powers to Knights of the Sword, as stated in The Black Wing. In the Dragonlance Campaign Setting, page 57, Kiri-Jolith grants the Sword Knights magic that gives them strength in battle, the power to defeat dangerous opponents, and the ability to protect others in need. Even when they do not have divine magic from their deity, faith and courage sustain them. In gaming terms, they can cast 1st-level divine spells. Knights of the Rose can cast 2nd-level divine spells. It also points that Rose knights get their spells from Kiri-Jolith as well, not from Paladine. The War of the Lance sourcebook allows to create a setting where the knights do not have spellcasting available, to match the post-cataclysm environment. -- ReyBrujo 20:48, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Issues with this entry in general

There are some serious issues of accuracy in this article, but I don't wanna step on any feet here. I'd rather simply give my thoughts here and let you guys decide if you want to fix it.

I've already made two minor edits, didn't wanna go any farther than that. Changed "Rebellion of the Roses" to "The Rose Rebellion", and something about Solamnus "discovering honor", which is just weird... changed that so reflect what really happened.

At any rate... there seems to be very little mention of the gods of the Triumvirate, the quest of honor is glossed over after essencially skipping the reason for it (after the fall of Daltigoth, the province of Vingaard became independant, named Solamnus it's king, and renamed itself Solamnia. It was 16 years later that some northern provinces also broke from Ergoth and wanted to join Solamnia. Solamnus didn't see this as practical due to differences in culture and ideals, thus, wanting to help, embarked on his "Quest of Honor". He found his way to the Whitestone Glade where he collapsed in exhaustion, or prayed and mediated, depending on the source, and was granted a vision of the three orders of knighthood by the gods of the Triuvirate: Paladine, Habbakuk, and Kiri-Jolith).

The group referred too in the article as the "Conclave" is actually called the Knightly High Council, or simply High Council. It has never been referred to as the Conclave in any text I have read (Conclave, in fact, refers to the 21 member ruling body of the Orders of Magic in Dragonlance). The four members of the council are the High Warrior, head of the Order of the Crown, the High Clerist, head of the Order of the Sword, the High Justice, head of the Order of the Rose, and the Grand Master, head of the entire Knighthood and commander of the Knightly Circle of Sancrist. The High Warrior is not "second in command" of the knighthood, only his Order. All three High Knights are equal in command and hold no authority over the other two orders.

No knight of any order has ever been permitted to cast Arcane magic. The Knight of the Rose section implies that they used too. Some Knights of the Sword and of the Rose are able to cast Divine "spells", which are really nothing more than immediately and visibly answered prayers. Only in the current age, post war of souls, have knights even begun associating with magi, accepting white robes into the Order of the Kingfisher (which isn't a true Knightly Order, but an Auxilliary branch consisting of commoner foot soldiers and peasant levies).

The Orders do not necessary denote rank. A Knight of the Crown can outrank a Knight of the Rose. The orders are a matter of role and prestige, not rank. In fact, most knights LOSE rank by advancing to a new Order. All knights do begin as Knights of the Crown, and one must become a Sword Knight before advancing to the Order of the Rose, but a Lord is a Lord, a Baron is a Baron, and a Sergeant is a Sergeant, regardless of Order. Lord Knights outrank Knight Officers who outrank sergeants who outrank postulants, and that is regardless of Order. Order is, at best, a tie breaker.

The role of the different orders, however, is quite veried. For the most part, Crown knights are homeguards. They garrison the fortresses across Solamnic lands. Knights of the Sword serve two roles, as illustrated by their two distict classes of Knight... standard Knights of the Sword, and Clerists. Your basic Knight of the Sword is a warrior, he actively seeks and roots out the enemies of the Knighthood, taking the fight to them. The Knight Clerist, however, are the spiritual backbone of the Order, serving as sort of glorified chaplains and battlefield medics (able to call upon the powers of Kiri-Jolith to heal their comrads). The Order of the Rose makes up much of the disciplinary aspect of Knighthood, as well as Solamnic lands. It's the most autonimous of the Orders, and deals in a lot of legal issues.

Ultimately, however, all three Orders are represented on any major battlefield, and Order is more about prestige than anything else.Adembroski 11:31, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

Nicely said, but I take from it you have not read Knightly Orders of Ansalon or that you have read any of the Solamnia Trilogy by Doug Niles. Magic users are now a part of the Knighthood, which are a group called the Kingfishers. Before you start editing the article tow hat you think is right, make sure you have referenced both books of that series, and the gaming book Knightly Orders. Just my suggestion if you want to make the article right.--Kranar drogin 16:37, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
Also, the Triuvirate is no longer as you stated, but Shinar, Kiri-Jolith, and Habbakuk.--Kranar drogin 16:39, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
Thank you for the suggestions, but instead of putting it here it would have been far more useful to us if you had edited the article to reflect it. Don't worry about stepping out of place, or over feet, or whatever. Be bold, and edit as needed. Thanks :) DoomsDay349 21:33, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
The Kingfishers are an auxilliary, not an Order of Knighthood. Knights of the Rose have NEVER used Arcane magic. And the state of the triumverite NOW has nothing to do with what it was when they appeared before Solamnus. I do have both of the sources you mentioned, and everything i said is still accurate. Adembroski 00:31, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
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