Talk:K.d. lang

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Contents

[edit] Requested move

The reasons for move copied from the entry on the WP:RM page

Add *Support or *Oppose followed by an optional one sentence explanation, then sign your vote with ~~~~
  • Support - Proper English spelling takes precedence over stylistic interpretation. DarrenBaker 15:53, 21 October 2005 (UTC)
  • Oppose - Wikipedia has precedent for using unconventional stage names as article titles (see Discussion below); it is harmless. Wasted Time R 16:28, 21 October 2005 (UTC)
  • Support This really should be consistent. Gryffindor 17:55, 21 October 2005 (UTC)
  • Oppose - While the general style is to have product names begin with a capital letter, the iPod is referred to with (generally thought) incorrect capitalization. Only a software limitation keeps the page itself from beginning with a lowercase letter. I see no reason why we shouldn't apply similar thinking to this page. Ral315 WS 08:10, 22 October 2005 (UTC)
  • Oppose per Wasted Time R. Rd232 talk 12:29, 22 October 2005 (UTC)
  • Oppose k.d.lang is clear usage. Septentrionalis 23:25, 23 October 2005 (UTC)
  • Oppose. That's her actual stage name. -Sean Curtin 05:39, 24 October 2005 (UTC)
  • Support. She may capitalize her stage name as she wishes, but as with corporations and such I believe we should use standard English rules. — Knowledge Seeker দ 07:17, 24 October 2005 (UTC)
  • Oppose. It's her name to capitalize or not as she sees fit. --Angr/tɔk tə mi 09:19, 24 October 2005 (UTC)
  • OPPOSE she spells it k.d. lang 132.205.45.148 19:53, 24 October 2005 (UTC)
  • Oppose — her spelling is supported in most print articles I've read, and thu their style manuals. --Gareth Hughes 14:08, 25 October 2005 (UTC)
  • Oppose — As someone said below, "the correct spelling of her stage name is "k.d. lang". The correct spelling of her legal name (when using initials) is K.D. Lang." The article is under the stage name, not her legal name. Quintusdecimus 18:05, 26 October 2005 (UTC)
  • Oppose obviously - we should use stage names where they are the common usage. sjorford #£@%&$?! 08:56, 28 October 2005 (UTC)
  • Support - we must respect the english language

[edit] Discussion

Add any additional comments
k.d. lang is her stage name. Wikipedia already places articles under stage names instead of real names, such as John Wayne, Ringo Starr, countless others. And it does so even if the stage name is not a proper Western full name, such as Cher, Madonna, etc. And it also does so even for stage names that are not proper English, such as 50 Cent. So I see nothing wrong with k.d. lang (forced to K.d. lang by technical limitations) as the article name. Note also that DarrenBaker wants to change the casing of her name in the body of the article too. This seems even more unnecessary: the Prince article is happy to refer to him as Image:Princesymbol.png during the time that glyph was his name, surely k.d. lang is mild compared to that! Wasted Time R 16:28, 21 October 2005 (UTC)

The choice of K.D. Lang to use lowercase letters is a purely stylistic choice. Her proper english name is spelled with capitals. I appreciate that you are great fans and all, but this is an Encyclopedia.

Regardless of how this is decided, you can't just copy-and-paste from one article to the other, losing all the history in the process. That's why I've reverted the main article to here again. Get an admin to approve and do the move, if it is really agreed upon as necessary. Wasted Time R 15:11, 21 October 2005 (UTC)
My bad, apologies everyone. I will get an admin to do it. DarrenBaker 15:31, 21 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Result

The votes are 10-3 against the page move: page not moved. Eugene van der Pijll 18:41, 29 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Various topics

While I appreciate that Ms. Lang's homosexuality is an important part of her life and personality, is it really necessary to have "and identifies as a homosexual" in the very first sentence of the article? Aside from being rather non-sequitur, other articles don't begin (for example): "Jackson Browne is a singer, songwriter, pianist, guitarist and identifies as a heterosexual." While I agree that Ms. Lang's sexual orientation deserves to appear somewhere in the article, isn't it a bit of a double-standard to highlight someone's sexual orientation so early, just because she's not straight? RiseAbove 19:41, 21 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Someone wrote:

CAN ANYONE FIGURE OUT HOW TO NOT START THE WIKI TITLE WITH A CAPITAL "K"?

It's not possible, I'm afraid. --Camembert

I was annoyed by wiki limitation in this regard. I don't see any reason why someone can't use lower case if they want to. If you study the history of typography, you will find it is a matter of taste. HOWEVER, I am less annoyed because at least wiki is consistent. Looking up e.e. cummings sort of cooled my jets in this regard. Still, it is amzing in this day and age where we can clone sheep we can't find away of allowing a person known to mass-culture to use his/her preferred style of writing their name. I think this is another example of the way in which we as a culture have allowed ourselves to sucuumb to the inertia of binary (machine) thinking rather than embrace the human.

thus endith my sermon Jackbox1971 00:33, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

Nothing on the Rolling Stones nicking the melody to "constant Craving" for their "Anybody Seen My Baby?" song? Or is that worth mentioning? Koyaanis Qatsi

I think it's certainly relevant info. Go ahead and add it. If I was more sure it was the exact same, I'd add that Velvet Underground's "Sweet Jane" uses the same riff as Tommy James & the Shondells' "Crimson and Clover" (obviously, I wouldn't add it to this article, but Velvet Underground). Tokerboy

Because of wiki-naming conventions, the e.e. cummings article title is E. E. Cummings. With that in mind, this article should be entitled K.D. Lang. Kingturtle 06:24 May 13, 2003 (UTC)

That is not the only reason. E.E. Cummings himself preferred to spell his name with capital letters as you will find out with a little research. It was his publishers and readers who preferred the small letter form. -- Derek Ross 06:33 May 13, 2003 (UTC)
What he said. In the present case, I think we should stick with "K.d. lang" - it's not perfect, but it's the best we can get. At least this way, it's possible to link to [[k.d. lang]] without any messing about - which is more than can be said for [[K.D. Lang|k.d. lang]].
-- Paul A 06:40 May 13, 2003 (UTC)
I accept that. With that said, shouldn't it be 'kd lang? sans periods? Kingturtle 06:53 May 13, 2003 (UTC)
kdlang.com uses "k.d. lang", for what it's worth. So do all the album covers I could find in a quick look around. (Some of the album covers actually say "k.d.lang", with no spaces, but I think that's just artistic license at work). -- Paul A 07:06 May 13, 2003 (UTC)
Frankly,I find treating the capitalization of proper names as other than compulsory as obnoxious as others find my treatment of spacing after punctuation as other than compulsory.It is Miss Lang's preference that her initials not be capitalized,but it is taking her side rather than NPOV on an issue that should be seen as debatable to describe the non-capitalized version as "the correct" version rather than her preference.--Louis E./le@put.com/12.144.5.2 01:57, 21 Feb 2005 (UTC)

The notice at the top of this article is POV. It states that the correct spelling is "k.d. lang". The correct spelling is clearly KD Lang by modern standards (K.D. Lang, K. D. Lang, etc are also fine). She is entitled to the POV that her pretentious lowercase name is "correct", but Wikipedia must not endorse this. If Wikipedia calls any form "incorrect", it should be the one without proper capitalisation. If we don't want to do that, we should work out a neutral wording. — Chameleon 29 June 2005 15:42 (UTC)

the correct spelling of her stage name is "k.d. lang". The correct spelling of her legal name (when using initials) is K.D. Lang.Rd232 talk 12:32, 22 October 2005 (UTC)

This is really quite ridiculous, seeing as the proper spelling is in fact K.D. Lang. There really is no argument here, that's English, folks. DarrenBaker 15:45, 21 October 2005 (UTC)

Sigh, no, her proper name is Kathryn Dawn Lang, choosing to call herself "K.D." is already a stylistic/artistic choice. True, it's one that has precedent and is often used; but the same could be said of the nature of the case of her name. Maybe it's just the part of Canada I'm from, but seeing it spelt "K.D. Lang" doesn't even look like the same name. She is known by the screwy spelling. It just doesn't make much sense to change it based on vague notions of what is "proper" english. For the most part, proper can be defined as common usage that stands up to time to a degree (yeah, argue all you want, but we talk and write in ways that would give heart-attacks to Victorian-age english teachers), and I have never in my entire life seen her referred to as "K.D. Lang", save for in this discussion. Although yes, you can probably tell from my usage of comma-after-quotation-mark that I'm somewhat of a "rationalist" when it comes to the rules of language. My own POV is clear, then. But I think it's rather NPOV to refer to someone by the way that everyone else in the world refers to them, nicht wahr? Phil Urich 02:18, 16 December 2005 (UTC)

Ain't technology grand? Jackbox1971 00:33, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Lesbian

"In addition to her musical talents, k.d. lang has championed lesbian causes"

Correct me if I am wrong but I thought she was a lesbian, pubically declared by her self? If so, I believe the article should mention that she is a lesbian. Hiding/censoring this aspect of her personality seems POV. If she is a lesbian perhaps we can incorporate it into the article? --ShaunMacPherson 00:44, 28 Feb 2005 (UTC)

If it's "POV",doesn't it cut both ways?(To those who think it glorious that she's a lesbian,she is denied credit,to those who think it shameful,she is spared scandalous exposure).Not actually taking a side on mentioning it,just observing...L.E/12.144.5.2 04:34, 5 Mar 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Gay Icon Project

In my effort to merge the now-deleted list from the article Gay icon to the Gay icons category, I have added this page to the category. I engaged in this effort as a "human script", adding everyone from the list to the category, bypassing the fact-checking stage. That is what I am relying on you to do. Please check the article Gay icon and make a judgment as to whether this person or group fits the category. By distributing this task from the regular editors of one article to the regular editors of several articles, I believe that the task of fact-checking this information can be expedited. Thank you very much. Philwelch 21:36, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Concort

Remark recieved at the contactpoint of Wikipedia EN; --Walter 22:37, 15 December 2005 (UTC)

I read somewhere that k.d. lang was born in Edmonton, Alberta, and her family moved to Consort, Alberta, when she was nine months old. Wikipedia states that she was born in Concort. Maybe someone could check this out.

[edit] Meat stinks controversy

Should her "meat stinks" ad controversy be mentioned? Between that and her lesbianism, it prompted the residents of Consort to publicly denounce her and basically disowned her from anything to do with their community. It was a fairly significant campaign in Alberta at the time —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.148.42.175 (talk • contribs) 10:23, January 17, 2006.

It's already mentioned, but I think that the campaign as a whole really should have an article of its own; it was a huge deal and I remember reading about it, and I'm not even from Canada or the US. --Qirex 09:50, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Images

THe images on the page were recently removed and have now been re-added to the article. they were remobved as it was said they constituted an infringment to the fair use policy of wikipedia. I would like input as to what people think on the issue and if the images do constitue a fair use copywright infringment the suiitable replacement need finding before the removal of the current images.--134.225.235.13 18:20, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

Please look at the licence tags for album cover, and for magazine cover on the image description pages of the two images I removed. The tags clearly state what constitute fair use. Album covers are to be used to provide critical commentary for the album - "solely to illustrate the audio recording in question". Here it was used to illustrate the person - not fair use. Same with the magazine cover - "to illustrate the publication of the issue of the magazine in question" and "It is not acceptable to use images with this tag in the article of the person or persons depicted on the cover, unless used directly in connection with the publication of this image. Such usages will be removed." There was no direct connection except for a one line reference under the heading of trivia that did not discuss the magazine or the image in any way. This is not up for debate as this has been Wikipedia policy for a long time. There are so many incorrectly used images that it takes time to identify them all, so you'll probably notice there are a lot of articles which use album covers or magazine (or book) covers in this way. But they're wrong and eventually they'll get fixed too. It's not our policy to keep offending images in articles until we find a replacement, as this offers no incentive for anyone to actually find a free image, so please do not revert. Rossrs 21:04, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
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