Talk:Ivan Nikolayevich Smirnov (musician)
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At 20:49, 20 January 2006 User:Ezhiki proposed that Ivan Smirnov (guitarist) be merged into Ivan Nikolayevich Smirnov (musician).
- 100% —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Iouri Lnogradski (talk • contribs) 15:13, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
_ _ At 17:55, 2 May 2006 User:Ezhiki summarized an edit with
- (please merge the other way around)
but left the proposal as before.
_ _ It may be important to clarify that a "proposal to merge" entails two or three things:
- Coming up with a single text. This may be a matter of putting pieces of one article's text into that of the other, or (occasionally) placing the text of one article before or after the text of the other without omissions, or a complete rewrite that leaves the curious guessing as to whether either version primarily inspired the new shape of the article, or (occasionally) throwing away the entirety of one article's text on grounds that nothing in the discarded one was both missing from the other and worth including. In any of these cases, the task of settling on the text is amenable to our normal collaborative editing process -- with the arguable exception that the merged text, or the process of agreeing upon it, may be important in establishing that there indeed are two articles covering a single topic, and justifying the merge.
- Choosing the title (usually one of the two) for the merged article; this means the unused title(s) becomes rdr(s) to the merged article.
- Merging the histories of the two articles (unless this is seen as too troublesome). The mechanics of this step require an admin, and a little bit more planning, insight, and care than a typical name change does.
--Jerzy•t 09:03, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
It would appear that Ezhiki now prefers the title Ivan Smirnov (guitarist) over that of Ivan Nikolayevich Smirnov (musician). "Ivan Smirnov (guitarist)" is probably good, if he never uses the patrynomic "Nikolayevich" in his publicity. On the other hand, use of patrynomics is much more standard among Russians than that of middle names is among the English-as-first-language cultures, and we have something like 7 I.S. claimants needing dab'n -- so the use of patrynomics is desirable unless some problem can be stated. (The choice of "guitarist" or "musician", BTW, can easily be separated from the patryonomic issue.)
--Jerzy•t 09:03, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
- I'm sorry, I don't quite understand what you want me to do. As for the article title, here's the reasoning why Ivan Nikolayevich Smirnov (musician) is a better title than Ivan Smirnov (guitarist):
- First name+Last name (i.e., "Ivan Smirnov") is to be used as an article title whenever possible.
- If there are several people by this name, then patronymic is added to distinguish between them (i.e., "Ivan Nikolayevich Smirnov"). The original title ("Ivan Smirnov") usually becomes a disambiguation page between the two.
- If there are several people by this name, then occupation is added in the parentheses (i.e., "Ivan Nikolayevich Smirnov (musician)"). The original title ("Ivan Nikolayevich Smirnov") usually either becomes a disambiguation page or a redirect to the other disambiguation page ("Ivan Smirnov").
- This is the convention by which the majority articles about Russian people are named, and that was the only reason why I asked to perform the merge "the other way around".
- Incidentally, if you need assistance with merging articles' histories, please let me know—I'll help. Thanks.—Ëzhiki (ërinacëus amurënsis) • (yo?); 13:40, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
