Talk:Internets (colloquialism)

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Don't delete this article. I came here looking for the origin of the term and found it. Surely the whole point of wikipedia?

I also think it shouldn't be deleted.How broght up this idee anyways?

ditto

I agree. It should stay. It comes up quite often in many internet fora.

But do we need an entry for both "Internets" and "Internets (colloquialism)"? I say remove this one and put the info at Internets. - TalkHard 05:11, 30 Jan 2005 (UTC)


I originally suggested deletion. I'd never heard the term used in any online forum or otherwise, and just assumed it was a slander of the President (which you must concede is a reasonable assumption on WP). Apparently I was mistaken. Not that I don't believe you all, but could someone post a url (from google groups or wherever) of a discussion in which this term comes up? I'm interested now. Also, please sign your posts like TalkHard. --WayneMokane 07:37, 17 Mar 2005 (UTC)
It is used all the time on The Vestibule. Mga 30 June 2005 21:41 (UTC)

Here's some:

(feel free to add more) Charles 22:20, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC)

"By coincidence, "internets" was already part of an obscure catchphrase on the Something Awful Forums"

Coincidence? I think not. Perhaps Bush is a raving Something Awful addict. Think about it. It could explain a lot of things.  :-)

Is it not possible that Bush was an avid user of Internet2 at the time? Its popularity exploded once people figured out how to use it as a P2P network to share music and movies.

I am pretty sure that this term was already spread in "geekish" circles before Bush used it, so I don't think this article is entirely correct.

Contents

[edit] Vahn Internet, two Internets...

While Bush may have misspoken, there are, in fact, two Internets – the Internet and Internet2.

There are in fact lots and lots of internets. They're just not often called internets anymore since the rise of the Internet.

Internet2, despite the name, is not an internet, as its article explains. I've removed the quoted sentence. JRM · Talk 21:39, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] One Internet, Two Internets

Think about it: is George Bush capable of understanding the difference between 'the' internet and Internet2?

I'm not sure what thinking about it might accomplish, or what you're driving at. The fact is that Internet2 is not an internet. As it's article clearly states, it is a "non-profit consortium." It seems to me like you are driving at something else in your edit which isn't coming across clearly. Perhaps if you fully explained in the talk page what you're attempting to add to the article it would help boil it down to a concise but still accurate sentence. Charles (Kznf) 20:44, 6 July 2006 (UTC)


[edit] One Internet, Two Internets

I agree that the reference to Internet2 is completely superfluous to the article and have deleted it again. Even if Internet2 was the name of the Abeline network, it is only a small research network largely irrelevant outside of academia.

"internets" was used a long time ago as a non-specific reference to connected TCP/IP networks but specifically not THE Internet. It is unlikely that Bush was intending to use this obsolete historical syntax and even then it would have been inappropriate given the context of the modern Internet (which rumors are spread on).

From a footnote on page 2, chapter 1 of "Internetworking with TCP/IP Volume I, Principles, Protocols and Architecture" Douglas E. Comer Second Edition 1991:

     We will follow the usual convention of capitalizing Internet when referring specifically to the
     connected internet, and use lower case otherwise; we will also assume the term "internet" used without
     further qualification refers to TCP/IP internets.

SolarWind 23:36, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cheney too?

I could have sworn that Cheney also said "internets" during the Cheney-Edwards debate, when directing people to factcheck.com. It's not in the transcript though---what's up with that? 24.63.211.131 03:48, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Criticism

"While the term is popularily understood to be a Bushism, it is possible Bush's word choice was accurate, if he meant to refer to the Internet2 as well as the Internet proper, or TCP/IP internets [1] in general." <--I don't think that's accurate. To say that he could be referring to both would require (in the context) them both to be networks, whereas internet2 is an organization (the name of that network is abilene) see Internet2. Also, that note is non existant, there's no evidence to sustain that claim. Anyone have any objections to me changing this? Lunarctic 11:36, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

I really do not understand the point of this section. "Internets" was clearly either a slip of the tounge, or a misunderstanding of how the word is supposed to be used. Given the past record of Bush's public speaking snafus, those explanations are far more probable then assuming he was referring to smaller networks of computers, an explanation I hardly buy and I work in IT. Quite frankly, this whole section is spin, bending over backwards to apologize for Bush, and obviously has a point of view. Besides, even the most ardent Bush supporter would admit that he is not the best public speaker.

If he were smart enough to understand the situation he would have known to say "there are rumors" or "there is a rumor" rather than "there's rumors"

[edit] Removal of paragraph

I removed the "alternative interpretation", few people like Bush as much as I do and almost no one enjoys this colloquialism as much as I do, but this is a stretch. Diff link. It seemed like original research to me, a pretty strong claim with no source. Also very unlikely. Miltopia 14:32, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Ooops!

I think my classmates are perfect. They, just like me, are ignorant towards technology, computers and e-mails. Some of the don't even know that XP is an operating system! Yes, these people are perfect to me! 213.240.234.212 19:51, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] “the Internet” v. “internet”

See, for example, IETF RFC1129 (Internet Time Synchronization: The Network Time Protocol) for a plain statement on the difference between “the Internet” and “internet”. It is an evident fact that capitalization cannot be heard; no one should have to source that point. —12.72.71.166 03:16, 21 November 2006 (UTC)

  • That's true about it not being heard but what does that have to do with the section in question? I mean, the "alternative interpretation" being discussed is about the "internets" as a plural, not as a capital. And it gives a pretty detailed and non-ovious alternative interpretation of the use of plural - one that is not siply common knowledge. I couldn't ask anyone off the street to spout this off for me, so it needs sourcing or it's original ideas. Miltopia 04:16, 21 November 2006 (UTC)
The noun “internet” doesn't refer to a unique network, it is as pluralizable as “network”. The test for material needing sources is not whether a person grabbed off the streets carries the datum, otherwise we'd have to source things such as the location of Idaho. —12.72.71.16606:06, 21 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Ok, I see what you mean about the capitalization, but it's still needs sourcing to avoid being your own original research. Where did you hear this from in the first place? Miltopia 04:18, 21 November 2006 (UTC)
  1. I'm not the first to make the point here; that was someone else.
  2. The “original research” policy covers novel ideas, not points of ordinary grammar and obvious differences between what may be written and spoken.
  3. In future, when you believe that something needs a source, please use the “{{fact}}” tag.
—12.72.71.166 06:06, 21 November 2006 (UTC)


BTW, symmetrically, we could not possibly source as fact that he said “Internets” as opposed to “internets”. One way or another we are stuck with the fact that there are two possibilities here. —12.72.71.166 02:19, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
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