Talk:Iguazu Falls

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[edit] Naming and accents

The English term is Iguassu. In Portuguese, it is spelled "igaçu" without an accent; words ending in l, u, z, i, or r in Portuguese have the emphasis on the last syllable unless they are accented. See www.fozdoiguacu.pr.gov.br.

Three different spellings are used in the article (in the title, text, and photo captions). Obviously these need to be regularized, but which should be the official encyclopedic spelling? Lee M 12:35, 3 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] IGUAÇU

In portuguese it is called Iguaçu and not igaçu. What should we do with the Iguaçu article. Should we merge or...?

Iguaçu and Iguassu Falls are two different articles (the river and the waterfalls).
Iguassu is the English name, prefered over Portuguese Iguaçu or Spanish Iguazú. (It's a Guarani name, and they had no writting).
BTW:Don't forget to sing your msg with ~ ~ ~ ~. --Marianocecowski 13:36, 20 May 2005 (UTC)
Well, whatever spelling you choose, please make sure it's coherent in the title and the article itself. Right now, "iguassu" and "iguazu" are both used, confusingly. --84.154.132.241 18:44, 9 April 2006 (UTC)
If Iguassu is the preferred English name, then please move the article back to it. Icemanofbarcelona101 also moved Iguaçu without any reason. --193.86.75.124 13:08, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

I'm no long so sure about the English name google reports 708,000 hits for "Iguazu falls", and only 280,000 for "Iguassu falls". Commens form any native English speaker? Mariano(t/c) 13:28, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

I'm not a native English speaker, but here is some data:
  • Encarta: Iguaçu (the river also Iguassu)
  • Britannica: Iguaçu
  • Little Britannica (?): Iguazú or Iguaçu (ex-Victoria??)
  • Webster: Iguaçú or Iguazú
  • Columbia Encycl.: Iguaçu or Iguassú
To Iguaçu, I say. --193.86.75.124 13:54, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
Well, what you gave is not necesarilly all. For instance, Britannica also uses Iguazu Falls and Iguazú River] as main titles. I'm more for Iguassu or Iguazu, but I would prefer a native speaker to give his/her point of view. Mariano(t/c) 14:10, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
That's the third item. Btw, until the native speaker appears, you can consider those as the opinions of 5 native English speakers, namely the editors of those encyclopedias. They mostly seem to favor Iguaçu. --193.86.75.124 14:23, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
No, in the links I gave its the first item, not the third. Please, at least take a look at them before answering. your reasons are no better than mine, so I don't know why you replaced all the words saying that the decision is finnal. I hope the survey clears things out. Mariano(t/c) 07:28, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
Third item. Did you even look at my comment? I doubt it. --193ypico 09:34, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
I am a native English speaker and favor Iguaçu. The redirect of Iguacu should exist because the ç normally is not on our keyboards. I strongly believe that place names should not be translated when all possible. (note: many place names in the US and UK are translated in Portuguese and I don't like that hehe). However, Iguazu is Spanish and it is equally valid, since the falls are international.--Kungfu Adam (talk) 12:38, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
Please, if you consider local names Iguaçu and Iguazu to be valid, vote at the section down below. Mariano(t/c) 10:48, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

Someone asked my opinion here, but as for where the article should reside, I don't really have one. All the redirects should exist; all the common spellings should be listed in the lead section of the article; other than a mention of alternative spellings or in direct quotations, the article body should consistently use one spelling; but beyond that I have no opinion. - Jmabel | Talk 16:00, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

I'm not a native English speaker but want to make my comments anyway. I also believe that place names should not be translated when all possible. The original name of the falls is not Portuguese and not Spanish, it's Guarani. Though Guarani was not a written language it became one with a complete grammar and spelling rule since the Spanish Jesuits used it to instruct the natives hundred's of years ago. The real name of the falls in Guarani is Y'Guazú. Paraguayans, which actually speak Guarani name them Yguazú which is the nearest to the original Guarani term. I think it's important to notice the letter "Y" is also a word that means "water", so I think it's not a matter of spelling, it's a matter of meaning. LucasAntuna 15:41, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Hi Lucas, and thanks for your information on the Guaraní name of the falls, I'll add it to the article. Nevertheless, the naming conventions in wikipedia ask us to use wither the English name or the most commonly used name. The guaraní version is clearly not any of those two, so I would say it wouldn't be such a good idea to change the page's title. Take care, Mariano(t/c) 07:18, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
Hm, I guess it was already there. Mariano(t/c) 07:21, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Hi Mariano, your right, it's already there. I vote for Iguassu as the English term because it's easier to type (without accents and wierd characters that are not available on American keyboards). The comparison with other famous falls is excellent, I'm going to link my related site page http://www.iguassu-misted-falls-vacation.com/iguassu-falls.html to this page. Maybe you find something interesting there to publish here (of course, your authorized) or want to include it as an external link. 201.217.22.1 11:23, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

The name of the article has already been extensively discussed, and the Iguazu has been chosen as the most common English name. The site you point to seams to me fine enough to include it among the external links. Mariano(t/c) 11:37, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Iguazu Falls in fiction

Like in the Antarctica article, I suggest we remove the Iguazu Falls in fiction section of non-important trivial facts. Please see Antactica's talk page. -Mariano 07:26, July 15, 2005 (UTC)

Such facts can be interesting, keep. 72.231.18.127 11:30, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the debate was no consensus. "Correct" names in Spanish or Portuguese would be Iguaçu or Iguazú, BTW. —Nightstallion (?) 10:39, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Requested move

As shown in #IGUAÇU, the preferred Englush name is Iguaçu. I don't understand why Marianocecowski refuses to move, what does he mean by this comment, or why he thinks that a random English-speaking Wikipedia editor's opinion should have more weight than three encyclopedias and one dictionary. Anyway, since he doesn't want to move, I can't move, and nobody else is here, I put the request on Wikipedia:Requested moves. I don't think a survey is necessary; but just in case... --193ypico 21:19, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

I stated enough reasons to doubt of which name should be used, and given the fact that the name of the article has been a controversial topic is enough reason to take the time to decide this with more than one or two users. And the fact that you seam to find your way so smoothly in the Wikipedia as to create move request minutes after your account was created makes me wander about your good will.
Given the three possibilities for the naming, I will reformat the vote.Mariano(t/c) 07:22, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
The survey is not necessary; three encyclopedias and one dictionary agree. For some reason you think that your opinion is more important. I created the account for the sole purpose of moving this page, but moving is not allowed to new accounts and I was directed to Wikipedia:Requested moves. I supposse it's personal for you now, and you will fiercely defend anything else than Iguacu (there are you, choosing Iguassu over Iguacu (!), as if it were a preference survey), so I don't expect a quick resolution of this anomalous situation. It's a shame. I'll try to move it when my account is old enough. It was my mistake calling you to see the case in the first place; I judged you wrong. --193ypico 09:48, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
The three encyclopedias and one dictionary where your finding. I can list you more examples with other spellings: [1], [2], [3], [4], [5], [6], [7], etc. I believe that the English name is Iguassu (W:English names), the Portuguese is Iguaçu, and the Spanish one is Iguazú. Many encyclopedias try to make use of the local names, so they might choose to use Iguazú, or given the size of Brazil Iguaçu. Now, I would prefer to restore the previous consented title of Iguassu Falls, which a user changed to the Spanish spelling, but wanted also to point out that Iguazu Falls is the most used term of the three, at least as I showed with the google hits (W:Common names). Given the fact that this is the English wikipedia, it would be hard for a English speaking user to type either Iguaçu or Iguazú, I think Iguassu should really be used for the articles name, of course pointing out the local spellings. I also whant to point out that I left messages asking people for their oppinion in this talk page in the Argentine, Brazilian and Latin American WikiProjects. Mariano(t/c) 11:11, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
I'll sum up your links for you: (1) 3 of them use the same dictionary: WordNet (uses Iguazu or Iguassu w/o distinction, and doesn't know anything about Iguacu), (2) I didn't find anything related with the falls in the "Encyclopedia of Conscientology" (?), (3) Collier's Encyclopedia (if we believe that 2nd or 3rd hand citation) uses Iguassu (and thinks the falls are in Argentina alone), (4) I strongly suspect that thefreedictionary also uses WordNet, (5) the Concise Britannica article was linked before.
So, merging your findings with mine, we have:
  • Iguacu: Britannica, Concise Britannica, Encarta, Webster, Columbia
  • Iguazu: Concise Britannica, Webster, WordNet
  • Iguassu: Encarta, Columbia, WordNet, Collier's
(Small type means alternative accepted name.)
(The contradiction within Britannica itself is a little startling...) So, in reference works we have: 1. Iguacu, 2. Iguassu, 3. Iguazu. In google: 1. Iguazu, 2. Iguassu, 3. Iguacu. Probably we'll end up compromising on Iguassu, as you say. --193ypico 13:15, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
I hope so. In any case, we should wait for a week to end since the beginning of the survey since your first vote, that is, late June 8th (normal proceedings). Mariano(t/c) 13:42, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
But probably reason will prevail and we'll rename it to Iguacu. Eh! One never knows... ;-) --193ypico 14:30, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Survey

The following voting is for popularity, meaning a voter can vote more than one of the options.

[edit] Iguazu Falls

  1. -Mariano(t/c) 07:22, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
  2. -Mtiedemann 08:01, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
  3. Taragüí @ 11:50, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
  4. Seattlenow 00:26, 5 June 2006 (UTC) (first choice--most common and seems like a better transliteration)(English words rarely have diacritics--"Iguaçu Falls" is Portuguese, not English)
  5. IlyaHaykinson 07:07, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Iguassu Falls

  1. -Mariano - first choice (t/c) 07:22, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
  2. -Mtiedemann 08:01, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
  3. Taragüí @ 11:52, 2 June 2006 (UTC) My first choice
  4. Seattlenow 00:26, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
  5. IlyaHaykinson 07:07, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Iguaçu Falls

  1. Pro --193ypico 21:19, 1 June 2006 (UTC) Reasons: Encarta, Britannica, Merriam Webster and Columbia Enc., all favor Iguaçu.
  1. Pro - it simply is the correct name. Dpotop 15:20, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.
The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the debate was keep Iguazu Falls. Mariano(t/c) 07:31, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Run-off

As the choice is now between Iguazu and Iguassu, I'd say we have a vote on just those two options. —Nightstallion (?) 10:52, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

And just to clarify, "normal voting time" is five days after the move has been listed at WP:RM; that is today, so I've closed the move above. This run-off is an attempt to come to a decision, as Mariano claimed this was not a no consensus result. —Nightstallion (?) 10:54, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Iguazu Falls

Support

Oppose

[edit] Iguassu Falls

Support

Oppose

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

[edit] Iguazu Falls in television

This is incorrect the waterfall that appears in this episode is Gullfoss, located in Iceland in Hvítá river. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 82.148.69.158 (talk • contribs).

Brought from main article by: Mariano(t/c) 08:59, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Nov. 5 edits (spelling)

An unregistered user has changed most but not all of spellings in the article from Iguazu to Iguaçu. This was done despite a vote to the contrary (see archives below) and with no recent discussion. It was also done inconsistently. I have reverted the page. (I have no strong feelings one way or the other but have an aversion to sloppily executed edits by unregistered users on controversial topics without prior notice.) Rivertorch 23:45, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

Agree, usage must match article's name. Mariano(t/c) 09:57, 6 November 2006 (UTC)
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