Talk:Healthy diet

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This article is related to the WikiProject Nutrition, a project which is expanding nutrition and dietetics related articles to academically reference-able standards. For guidelines, see the project page or the Contributing FAQ.


Because of their length, the previous discussions on this page have been archived. If further archiving is needed, see Wikipedia:How to archive a talk page.

Previous discussions:


Oops! Sorry, i removed the cleanup thing by accident :-/. No worries though, have put it back and now have a thing on - i'm doing a little overhaul on the article. I archiveds the past stuff because most of it was arguments, and i think we should start a "fresh". Well, anyway - I'm expanding and cleaning up the article so that it's better laid out, better explained and so on. Spum 13:19, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

Contents

[edit] This conspiracy is no theory

Ref. "to deal with the issues presented by particularly imported culture - cigarettes, alcohol and fast food all being produced in their majority in the United States, or by US-based companies" It became part of our plot to rule the world by making all other countries full of fat, smoking drunks immediately after electing ourselves "Dictator for Life".

When was this some kind of conspiracy theory? Fast food, originated in the United States; McDonalds, Kentucky Friend Chicken, Pizza Hut - all companies which have been targeted by a recent government initiative, as well as an anitiative by the British Heart Foundation. Secondly, tobacco is something which is also something in the majority of american production; out of the top 10 tobacco producers, 5 of those were american, as well as 3 were based in Britain, but 2 of those are owned by american companies basing their production here, or convergances between british and american sources;

"The US market is dominated by four key manufacturers known as Big Tobacco: Altria, which sells roughly half of the nearly 500 billion cigarettes sold in the US, Reynolds American, Loews subsidiary Lorillard Tobacco Company (part of Carolina Group), and Vector Group's Liggett unit."

Tobacco Industry Companies, in order of Yearly revenue and world ranking:

  1. Philip Morris USA Inc. [6601 W. Broad St. Richmond, VA 23230-1701] 804-274-2000
  2. R.J. Reynolds Tobacco Holdings, Inc. [401 N. Main St. Winston-Salem, NC 27102-2990] 336-741-2000
  3. Brown & Williamson Tobacco Corporation [ 200 Brown & Williamson Tower, 401 S. 4th St. Louisville, KY 40202-3404 ] 502-568-7000

Give them a call, and they'll verify each and every fact i have stated. In fact, i'll give them a call on your behalf.

Now that i've backed up the fact of the United states being the progenitor of Mass production in cigarettes i'll move on to fast food restaurants. In fact, i'll allow you to read this one. Double this time, old pal - 8/10 of the companies in the world by size are, tum-dum-dum-dum!; 3 of which having subsidiaries within different names throughout the United Kingdom.

Spum 15:38, 6 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] First sentence.

'A healthy diet is a diet which contains a balanced amount of nutrients, varied food, and minimal amounts of sugar, fat and salt.'

This is wrong, as You can not put sugars and salt in the same plane as fats. (By the way, it's not SALT itself a problem, but SODIUM.) From few sources (Mayo, eg.) we can quote that fat intake should go even up to 20-30% of daily calorie intake. (Not to meantion now all kinds of fats.) So it's not true that healthy diet contains MINIMAL amounts of fat. I can quote, if needed.

Feel free to change it. I'm not an expert myself, so I dont' feel qualified to make that change. jf 16:49, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

It is important to distinguish between "good" and "bad" fats. For example, many experts recommend including moderate levels of olive oil and moderate to high levels of fish oil in the diet. It is also important to note that the designers of some diets - for example, the Zone, Atkins and Paleo diets - generally recommend a higher level of all fats (and lower level of carbohydrate) than government diet experts do. 23 June 2005

I'm going to modify it. The definition certainly is well-intentioned and probably correct in a lot of cases, especially in more developed countries. It is the big public-health push in the US. I think rather than saying it is "wrong", I'd say it is "overly specific" to a certain demographic.
For instance, you don't want to "minimize" fat; you want to eat a healthy proportion and, if possible, ingest certain types of fat. But you need a good dose of fats in your diet for good nutrition. A host of physical processes depend upon fats in the diet, beginning with (certain) vitamin and other nutrient transport. Your brain cell membranes are made of fat. As another example, the minimization of "salt" (NaCl) could conceivably kill you fairly quickly -- say if you were stranded in a desert with plenty of non-salt food and fresh water. (You can theoretically commit suicide by drinking water! More realistically, there have been distance runners who have visibly suffered ill effects from NaCl and KCl deprivation, although this is much less common with the advent of sports drinks.) Even in the US/UK, research appears to indicate that the deletorious effects of comparatively high NaCl intake may, for a majority (or possibly vast majority) of the population, be a myth -- the scientific equivalent of an urban legend.
My point is that sufficient dietary fat is more important to good health than avoiding excessive dietary fat. While this is consistent with the technical concept of "minimal" or "minimize", such terms connote an effort to eat as little as possible, which is unhealthy. Actually, it is also incorrect to call for a technical "minimal" intake of fat, as fat, salt, and sugar can be ingested in higher amounts than minimum requirements with no ill effect.

Apollo 16:43, 16 October 2006 (UTC) Editor, Daily Health Report

This is worse than I thought. "an unhealthy diet, made up of . . . excessive amounts of . . . polyunsaturated fat." ?!?

Apollo 16:50, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Healthful

I do not know how much of the healthy-healthful debate has occured here. Although widely used when refering to a healthful diet, healthy food is food that is alive. Healthy food would scream when it is eaten! The correct word is healthful or nutritious. I suggest that the article would be better placed under "nutritious diet" or "proper diet" and the word healthful be used as the adjective to describe foods which promote health.--Counsel 16:54, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for bringing this up. I was considering a mention myself, for the sake of technicality. --AWF
Oh for goodness sake.... Healthy
Healthy - 1. enjoying health and vigor of body, mind, or spirit: well
He was father to three healthy daughters.
2 conducive to health
A healthy diet and exercise can help to maintain proper weight.
3 evincing health
HEALTHY FOOD IS NOT FOOD THAT IS ALIVE any more than red food is food that is communist. Words have more than one meaning. Which meaning is meant is derived from context. Healthy is not incorrect. aussietiger 05:27, 12 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Globalize

Hi everyone! I've added an extra paragraph to remind you all that this is an Encyclopedia for everyone in the globe, and a US-bias panel just in case someone else can bring in some variety in POV. Congratulations for your good work to date. Cvalda 00:04, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] First two paragraphs

I found the first two paragraphs to be quite problematic. I tried to help, I'm not sure how successful I was, but there you have it. Maybe someone else can have a go at it.

Steve Lowther 07:39, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Healthful?

Heh, hello. You may be aware of how i re-boosted this article. I'd just like tosay that the majority of the sources which i used were from a book called a Human Perspective on Nutrition, and it's an english publication. I haven't really read the article through since i did my last edit on it some many aeons ago, but if it is american based, then i'm sure there's a lot of other things to add into it. Unfortunately, there are countries which do not have such a communal and central approach or view of a healthy diet; I only have experience in British, American and, to a small extent, Japanese health perspectives, and interms of Nutritional and dietetic experience, UK and US. I'll hopefully be revamping WP:NAD, but as of now i'm concentrating on expanding Physiology and Medicine based articles after receiving my qualification as a Physician.

If any of you needs any guidance for the article, please don't hesitate to drop me a line! James S 21:00, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

Just like to follow up to say the "Healthful" debate has not raged amongst the nutrition community which i'm privvy to (Old workplace) Upon asking, they said it was an expansion of the "Friendly Bacteria" idea that was put forward due to L Casei Immunitas and soforth. It's most likely just slang, so please try to filter through what are commonly accepted terms, and what arent. A healthy diet generally means a diet which promotes health to the best extent possible through a balanced diet that provides you with energy equal to that of the amount of exercise you do. If you harvest plants, they're "dead" as you remove their source of gaining nurients and their respiration and photosynthetic potential is very low.
I urge you; as a dietician and a man of medicine, if you are wanting to change facts in such an article SUPPLY REASONING AND SOURCES.
James S 21:09, 15 August 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Rewrite

It looks like I can be useful here. My intention is to rewrite and expand the article into a more universal, and somewhat more rigorous, treatment of healthy dietary principles. Hopefully by the time I'm done all the claims will be adequately referenced and the tone and organization will be consistent.

This looks like a pretty big job -- already I notice that there are no entries for "refined carbohydrate" or "complex carbohydrate" -- so any and all productive co-workers will be appreciated.

I don't have a lot of time so this will be piecemeal and I already have entered a bunch of unreferenced data off the top of my head. I've already messed up the footnotes but if nobody else gets to them, I'll eventually get them consistent. Apollo 18:40, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Healthy diet?

Is this a joke? How on earth can one expect to be healthy when dieting?

Do not merge with healthy eating, for the love of all things sacred. Chris 18:22, 7 November 2006 (UTC) Note: This user was blocked indefinitely for trolling shortly after this comment was made.

Why? ChrisWright1979 = user:cjwright79 (don't call me a sockpuppet, I'm being up-front)

[edit] Merge

I think the merge is a great idea. The healthy eating article is currently full of unsourced material, but weeding it all out would leave us back with a stub. This article on the other hand is well sourced with a better structure and balance to the information. Plus the two terms mean the same thing! --Siobhan Hansa 08:48, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] No Bad Foods?

This is currently under the section "Foods": There are no foods which are intrinsically linked on a singular-consumption basis to illness, disease or decline of body function. Yet, there are foods, such as fugu, which when improperly cut or prepared can result in death. In essence, "there are no bad foods"[5].

Doesn't the middle sentence of this paragraph directly contradict the opening and closing sentence? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Glippy00 (talk • contribs) 00:50, 10 December 2006 (UTC).

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