Talk:Hadiths of Abu Bakr's succession

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[edit] also need to include...

a similar and related narration when abu bakr as-siddeeq was made the imaam of the jama'ah, during the final sickness of the messenger of allah (salallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) present in bukhaari and muslim (or at least one)

maybe change the title to "hadeeths" or "ahadeeth" to accomodate multiple narrations? jazaakallah ITAQALLAH 22:17, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

I don't know how to change the title of the page, I've changed the page List of notable Muslim reports to mention Ahadith of Abu Bakr's succession instead but I don't know how to change it on this page, so if you can do that. Salam --xx-Mohammad Mufti-xx 22:46, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

done ITAQALLAH 22:49, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] other ahadeeth

as-suyuti in his taareekh al-khulafaa' mentions a number of ahadeeth other than those which are already mentioned which are used to indicate the sunni perspective of the successorship of abu bakr. this work of as-suyuti been adapted and translated to the work "khulafa who took the right way" which is pretty popular. i do have a transcript of pp.47-54 which discuss these narrations (i could probably get access to taareekh al-khulafaa' also) and may try to implement these into the article soon. would it be a copyvio to include the translations of the hadeeth cited exactly as present in the book "khulafa who took the right way"? ITAQALLAH 16:56, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

The Arabic, of course, is in the public domain. We are assuming that the translation is copyrighted which means 1923-1956 or before and renewed or after 1956. Also... I'm not 100% if translation copyright works the same way as original authorship... but, I think it does. So, fair use guideline is do you have commentary on it. That means for each quote there should be a decent amount of original (non-quoted) work explaining the relevance of the work. If the article will have that (which is a pretty vague standard) then you can use some quotes. But, it can't be all or majority quotes from a copyrighted work. You can cite the info in other ways... but, it tends to be a bad idea to work from one source because the whole point of the copyright is that if your work is derrived from one source then.... people should just use the original source since they did the original work. gren グレン 20:10, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

thank you for shedding more light on the matter. so for example if i was to quote a sentence from the translation, i would need to include some of my own prose elaborating upon or discussing what has been quoted? linking this in with the style of the article... it seems that this and other articles entitled "Hadith of..." have a separate section for the narration(s) and the explanation/interpretation. would it be legitimate to include any discussion of the hadeeth in a different section as in this case or must it be straight after the quote? would one need to even discuss this narration specifically as ideally the interpretation would be a general evaluation of all the different sources given?

if quoting the hadeeth (or hadeeths) from the translation itself proves too difficult in terms of fair use policy, i guess the other option is to quote from the arabic directly. is there any specific procedure required for rendering the arabic to english when there may not be a "usable" published version in english? thank you ITAQALLAH 00:44, 20 July 2006 (UTC)