Talk:Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere

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[edit] credibility

Why is this ideology described as a front? Is the Civil War called the war of Northern Aggression or the Civil War and does the differing perspectivs in that war bring explanation for this article? Or how about the Monroe Doctrine, Manifest Destiny, White Mans Burden, Cold War, War on Drugs, War on Terror, or GLobalization? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.32.112.217 (talk • contribs) . 2006-04-14 17:39:47

The War of Northeren Aggression is used by Confederate sympathists to make the South look better. In reality, the root of the war was not in an aggressive union. Likewise, the war was not about bringing prosperity to East Asia. The citizens of Nanjing can tell you that. That's why it is a front. Foster2008 03:34, 6 August 2006 (UTC)


[edit] additional credibility

If this plan was a front because Japan manipulated other countries with puppet governments to their advantage, then what is the difference in the countries with puppet governments now and in the past that benefit the U.S.? Such as the Philippines (declassified CIA documents display the intervention by the U.S. on the part of Philippines and U.S. interest in the country at the time for resources and strategic importance), what about governments like Pinochet's, the Shah, and the list goes on to the point of even attempting to list all these examples is too time consuming because there are too many examples. Was the cold war a front? Is the war on drugs a front? Is globalization a front? Etc.Etc.Etc. It is unfair to classify the Greater East Co=Prosperity Sphere plan a front when the article itself states the activities partaken to establish this end were similar and as of today even more similar to western colonialism. In other words, all these fancy equivocal War on _______ names are means of control for the benefit for the west whichever way you look at it. Cold War - elimination of communism and building capitalistic countries friendly to the U.S. and intertwined to their economic systems. War on Drugs- Stop the flow of drugs to U.S. therefore eliminating crime in the U.S. and in the long run replacing governments that harbour these activities with friendly governments that trade the production of drugs with other economic means that are interwined to the U.S. economy. Globalization - the creation of an economy and world rul similar to the original model of U.S. democracy which is always the same as capitalism when applied in foreign policy. War on Terror- elimination of the threat of terrorists to make the world safe including the prevention of another 9/11, it just so happens that 9/11 had to happen before terrorism was a world plague. All of these preceding doctrines of bull____ and many others all supposedly inadvetently strengthen economic hegemony for the U.S. Perhaps it is because money is the only way to create meaningful change or to eliminate poverty which is the cause of many social disorders in the world. Yet does the U.S. know this and could this fact be used for U.S. advantage?


To state that Japan's aforementioned plan of unification of country states (similar to what occured in the Civil War or War of Northern Aggression) a front and imply that the west's is not, smacks of American jingoism and chauvinism. Ok Ok Ok, yes segregation and slavery is over, it does not mean the next victims of prejudicial judgements can be asians because there aren't enough of them here in the U.S. or western countries to make a difference. Please consider rearanging your viewpoints, try to be a little more subtle with your biased disposition, or try another hobby because your writing is only for wikipedia and not the academic community. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.32.112.217 (talk • contribs) . 2006-04-14 18:06:53

[edit] Also

Yes, the methodology employed to further this doctrine by Japan was more horrible than U.S. activities during World War II. Japan was guilty of massacres against innocent civilians. The Japanese MILITARY committed a thousand My Lais, but does that mean inappropriate, cruel, and harsh methodology or war crimes mean that the intentions were false? How many times have good intentions turned sour? How many times have good intentions turned sour enough where anger and negligence caused something criminal to occur? It happens and its a way of life. Moreover, in the application of Manifest Destiny, where did the Native Americans go? Compare the amount of land controlled by native tribes from the beginning to now. Do the same with population figures. Regardless of any excuse, anyone not able to be deceived with subjective and insignificant complex arguments will be able to focus on the simple fact that such a difference in numbers can not be explained by nothing more than genocide. The statistical facts say so including many testimonies as to intentions and behavior of western expansion into all of North America. If there is any denial of Japanese massacres by Japan during World War II, they are STRAIGHT OUT LIES similar to the ones in the U.S. about there was no form of genocide on Native AMericans and other incidents.The facts speak for themselves. On the contrary, though both coutries have their own self-perpetuated lies to hide and comfort the feeling of guilt, their intentions should not necessarily be questioned because of these incidents. Did Japan really want a united asian land for their benefit or for all asians benefit? Does the real motivations behind these intentions matter when the end result will be the same? Did the immigrants and corporate (charter) workers in the U.S. really need what the Germans called Lebensraum (living space) or were they just greedy? Does it matter when the same end occured? I would like to know the answers to these questions but fairness must be observed in all issues of similar subject matter. There has to be an end to anti-japanese sentiment. Pearl Harbour and World War II are over. Stop using the term Japs when common sense tells everyone that every derogatory slur applied to any culture or race has not been met with kindness. Stop talking about massacres from Japan and Germany as if they were actions of the anti-christ when similar actions have been committed by many countries including the U.S. The unfortunate fact of the matter is that the U.S. is now responsible for more loss of innocent lives due to ambitious program that support those mysterious and self-proclaimed angelic, humane, and just Cold Wars, Drug Wars, etc.etc.etc.etc.etc.etc.etc.etc.etc. than both German and Japanese atrocities put together. Actually that number is so signifiacnt that there is really no need to compare. In Conclusion, don't dismiss the intentions of Japan due to actions that are not diametric to policies enacted by countries such as the U.S. and don't dismiss intetntions due to war crimes. Give ample eveidence that the Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere was unlike other western programs which warrants its dismissal as a real intetnion. Otherwise you will receive articles like this for the rest of your life and opposition to your arguments for the future will no longer be saved from scrutiny because of how many Asians there are in your country anymore. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.32.112.217 (talk • contribs) . 2006-04-14 18:40:25

It seem to me that you'd be better off doing a research paper about this. Wikipedia is not really the place to have academic debates. Rather, it reports on academic views and information found in other verifiable sources. --日本穣 Nihonjoe 00:46, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
Actually, it is widely considered in the WEST that this was merely a front, but there is ample evidence for disparities in this view. Many Taiwanese, for instance, subscribe to Japan's intentions in this regard, and it is taught in places like Myanmar/Burma that the Japanese were liberators from English colonial rule. Loft3 14:57, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] WPMILHIST Assessment

This is a major concept within the discussion of the Pacific War as a whole - Japan's motivations & ideology etc etc. The article needs much expansion, and perhaps a bit better attention to NPOV. It is a controversial subject, and certainly one does not wish to be too pro-Japan, but all must be taken within context. Was this really a front for fascist, imperialist expansion, a cover to secure land and resources only for Japan's benefit? To what extent did the people of Japan, the soldiers, and the higher-ups believe in this or not? Who saw it as propaganda, who as a front, and who as a genuine motivation? How does this differ from the Communist Chinese propagandist ideology of "liberating" Tibet from its supposedly oppressive and feudal overlords?

Three things I think need changed: (1) Expansion. (2) Better attention to a less anti-Japanese view, and to an attempt to objectively, academically, consider the ideology or slogan within its context. (3) The introduction, identifying and defining the Co-Prosperity Sphere. It was not "an attempt by Japan to create..." anything. It was a slogan, a euphemism, much as sonnō jōi and fukoku kyōhei were. Okay, not quite the same. I think it would be most accurate to say that the Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere was a goal: a goal envisioned by the Japanese militarists and a justification for their expansionist actions.

Finally, a more minor quibble: is it really fair to call the Monroe Doctrine a comparable policy? The US may not have always had the most 100% noble & selfless goals in mind - she was always looking out for her best interests - but she never invaded or attacked Central or South America. Is protecting Central/South America from European imperialist depredations the same as militaristic imperialism itself? LordAmeth 21:15, 3 December 2006 (UTC)