Talk:Great white shark

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[edit] Endangered status

I'm not sure where the latest data can be found but I though http://www.redlist.org/search/details.php?species=3855 was the current and official status and if I can read that the status is vunerable but under consideration for endangered so I change back to vunerable, if that is wrong please inform where the latest data can be found and/or how often and old the web site is Stefan 13:40, Oct 13, 2004 (UTC)

According to an article that was posted on the Internet only yesterday (10/12/04), the Great White Shark has been added to the endangered species list.
Yes it has been moved to Appendix II after the CITES meeting this week - see also e.g. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/3736042.stm.
However a CITES Appendix II listing is not the same as a IUCN Red List grading of endangered. For instance the Basking Shark has been Appendix II for some time, but listed only as vulnerable. Then you get oddball situations like the Minke Whale being Appendix I yet Red Listed only as Lower Risk.
It would not be at all surprising if IUCN changed the species to Endangered the next time the shark specialist group reports, however until then we should not jump the gun and continue to use the red list listing as we do for all other species. Hope that's helpful, Pcb21| Pete 21:06, 13 Oct 2004 (UTC).
OK thanks, that clears things up. Stefan 07:38, Oct 14, 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Photo?

Is the photo used photoshoped? I thought great whites closed their eyes as they bite. A white lid comes up from the bottom to protect them. It looks very strange to me.

Sorry but i just want to correct you, great whites do NOT have eyelids, they roll their eyes back into the skull and it looks as if their eye's have gone white. I think all mackeral sharks are the same. Necropolis123 16:56, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Excerpt from this website: http://www.sharkattacks.com/satvermyth.htm

"Some species possess a third eyelid which closes at the moment of the attack." Th e map is wrong you should  get it up to standards, because new discoveries have proved that the White shark is all over the world.

[edit] Warm-blooded?

I had heard somewhere that great whites are warm-blooded. Can anyone confirm or deny this? Jeshii 13:53, Oct 17, 2004 (UTC)

Not sure about the white, but some sharks like the shortfin maco has a warmer than the seawater temperature, not by much but by a few degrees. This I think can make them faster and therefore better at chasing fish. Since I'm not sure sure I did a quick google check, see the links
* http://www.elasmo-research.org/education/topics/p_warm_bodied.htm
* http://www.aquarticles.com/articles/breeding/McFarlane_Warm_Blooded_Fish.html
* http://geopubs.wr.usgs.gov/circular/c1198/chapters/177-184_WhiteSharks.pdf
So I would say that these few links are inconclusive, one say white shark is warm blooded, one that only mackrel sharks is and one that the short fin maco is, but not the long fin (both mackrel). Since great white is a mackrel shark I would guess that it is warmblooded but I need to check some books at home. Stefan 09:14, Oct 18, 2004 (UTC)
It is indeed 'warmblooded', that means that its body temperature is slightly higher than the water. It has bloodvessels that passes through the swimming mussles to warm the blood. Same for some other sharks and tuna. Stefan 23:43, Oct 18, 2004 (UTC)
The main fish article has a mention of the Great White being the only warm-blooded fish, so once y'all find out what's actually true please alter both this article and that (if necessary). Thanks! Ziggurat 00:24, Dec 17, 2004 (UTC)
Most of the species in the family Lamnidae are homeothermic, capable of maintaining a body temperature slightly higher than their surroundings (World of Animals: Fishes, 1986).

if you think about it they should be because they are mammals and they give birth to live young but im only in the 8th grade so what do i know lord_voldemort8675309@yahoo.com

I could be wrong but i don't think that great whites or other Mackeral sharks are warm blooded, there body temp is always a few degrees above water temperature but this can change with the temperature of the water...i thought that for an animal to be classed as warm blooded there body temp had to remain at the same all the time....?? can anyone confirm this or deny this...??Necropolis123 16:42, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

And also lord_voldemort8675309@yahoo.com sharks are NOT mammals.....they have gills and are fish.

The main reason great whites aren't mammals is that they don't make milk. Shark cheese, anybody? Notreallydavid 15:53, 26 November 2006 (UTC) (I don't make milk either, but some members of my family have been known to.)

OK I'm confused. In the Diet part, it says they're warm blooded, in the reproduction part they are cold blooded?Hqduong 09:02, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Out of Place?

"Great Whites, like many other sharks, have rows of teeth behind the main ones, allowing any that break off to be replaced rapidly. Their teeth are unattached to the jaw and are retractable, like a cat's claws, moving into place when the jaw is opened. This arrangement also seems to give their teeth high tactile sensitivity." This seems like it should be in the first part, not the Attacks on Humans part. Agree, disagree? --OGoncho 20:56, 23 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Agree, and should be in the shark article instead of here. not sure if all sharks have this though (whale shark?, basking?, cookie cutter?) but most have it. Stefan 12:32, Oct 25, 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Size & longevity

[edit] Candidates for largest recorded individuals

While searching for the largest measured – not estimated – Great White individuals, I've come to the conclusion that the "typical maximum" size is 5.0–5.4 m (16½–17¾ ft.) and 1,200–1,600 kg (2,700–3,500 lb.). Any bigger than this is truly spectacular. I've never seen convincing reports of individuals exceeding 6 m (19 ft. 8 in.) length or 2,000 kg (4,409 lb.) weight.

Heaviest specimen
Commercial fisherman Joe Friscia captured an adult female Great White Shark in his drift gill net on September 18, 1985, about 24 km (15 mi.) southwest of Point Vicente, Los Angeles County, California. The shark was 5.36 m (17 ft. 7 in.) in length and weighed 1,878 kg (4,140 lb.). The shark's stomach contained the remnants of an adult Harbor Seal (Phoca vitulina) and a juvenile Northern Elephant Seal (Mirounga angustirostris). The accuracy of the shark's weight is indisputable, further detail can be found here – scroll down to the 5th photo.

On the Elasmobranch Research around Monterey Bay website list of large individuals, the heaviest specimen that appears to have been measured, rather than estimated, is a 2,120 kg (4,674 lb.), 5.57 m (18 ft. 3¼ in.) long shark caught off S.E. Taiwan on January 2, 2004. Caution advised here, however. Other references of the same author (Victor Lin) include some doubtful cases on the site, including even larger Great Whites, and a 1,176 kg (2,593 lb.) Tiger Shark (Galeocerdo cuvier). Yet it should be noted that this shark had the largest vertebrae measurements mentioned on this list.

Longest specimen
A shark 5.94 m (19 ft. 6 in.) long, weighing 1,470 kg (3,241 lb.), was caught in Ledge Point, Western Australia, on March 22, 1984. This individual seems to have been accepted by the scientific community. Yet, at least on one discussion board, I've seen doubts voiced on this individual. A photograph of this shark suggests a robust individual, but since a shark this long would weigh 1,500–2,500 kg (3,300–5,500 lb.) with typical proportions, the given figures would put it very much on the slender side.
I can't promise that I've got all the facts right, the information I've found has been a bit sketchy. I wasn't able to find a good reference or a picture for this individual at the moment. I'll add the links here if I manage to find them in the future...

Another long individual was caught in Gansbaai, South Africa, on January 17, 1987. Its length has been reported between 5.67 m (18 ft. 7¼ in.) and 6.00 (19 ft. 8 in.), so it was probably never accurately measured. It weighed 1,214 kg (2,676 lb.) or 1,241 kg (2,736 lb.) – I don't know which one's the typo – after its liver (20–25 % of body weight) was extracted, so originally it must have weighed c. 1,600 kg (3,500 lb.).

If neither of these is accepted, I've seen a length of 5.54 m (18 ft. 2 in.) in a scientific sample, so the Great White must grow at least this long. Anshelm '77

Update: Check out this page I've found. There's a pretty good case of a 5.83 m (19 ft 1½ in) Great White, caught in Sète, France on Oct. 13, 1956. This is the longest Great White, that I know of, that (at least seemingly) has been accurately measured. I'm not totally convinced about the Ledge Point shark I mentioned earlier, and even less about the 6.1 m Prince Edward Island specimen – note that 6.1 m with given accuracy is exactly 20 feet, and besides Wikipedia I've seen only one other mention of this individual.
"The model of a white shark preserved in the Museum of Zoology in Lausanne, Switzerland, is a mould reconstructed via casts from the original body of the specimen caught in Sète, France, on 13th October 1956: this is the largest white shark specimen whose complete morphometrics (made following Compagno, 1984) are available worldwide (De Maddalena et al., 2002). Considering that the size of this specimen is very close to 6 meters (583 cm TOT, 565 cm TLn and 458 PRC)."
--Anshelm '77 18:54, 8 October 2006 (UTC)
Further update: Based on the information above, I've also found this – what I find interesting is that they've come up with a much larger estimate for the 7.13 m (23 ft 4½ in) Maltese claim than the 5.2–5.5 m (17–18 ft) based on the photgraph and its jaws. --Anshelm '77 19:51, 8 October 2006 (UTC)


An encyclopedia I have says that 'most are between 6 and 7,50 m'; one noteable specimen measured 6,40 m and weighed 3,2 tons, another was 5,20 m long and weighed 1,3 tons. It also speaks of a much larger one being captured in Port Fairey (Australia) in the late 19th century; supposedly that one measured a staggering 11 m. The encyclopedia, Purnell's Encyclopedia of Animal Life, is pretty old (1970), so I this info may have been debunked since. Also, the fact that featured a very inaccurate text about dinosaurs (using the name Brontosaurus, saying T.rex was 17 m long, misspelling Triceratops as Tricaterops) kinda harms its believability, although it can be explained because the writer probably knew far more about zoology than paleontology. Interestingly, it does state that claims of 12 m or more are most likely false, despite that apparently not implausible listing of 11 m being pretty close to that. I suppose it could be true that there were bigger great whites in the past, but now they don't live to that size (presumably because of man). Isn't the same happening to the blue whale? Jerkov 21:19, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Longevity

Great Whites are known to live more than 30 years old. Many sources say 36 years; but another source said this to be erroneus, and that there were verified cases of individuals 31–32 years old. The information on the subject is limited, so it's more than likely to live much older than this. I could imagine an animal this big to live for 50–80 years, but that's just me. Anshelm '77

[edit] Question

The article mentions only one failed attempt at keeping a great white in captivity. What about this? http://www.mbayaq.org/cr/whiteshark.asp


The longest attempt was 198 days, breaking the previous record of 16 days, by the Monterey Bay (california) Aquarium. The female shark, who was injured when captured by a fisherman, had grown to large for the aquarium and was attacking other sharks in her tank (article references a soupfin). There is a documentary airing on PBS stations about the Monterey Bay Aquarium, with an excellent website ( http://www.pbs.org/wnet/nature/oceansinglass/index.html ), that retells the story of the shark's captivity, as well as information about the shark after its release: http://www.pbs.org/wnet/nature/oceansinglass/whiteshark.html

Google: "great white captivity" http://dsc.discovery.com/news/briefs/20041004/shark.html http://dsc.discovery.com/news/briefs/20050307/shark.html http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7351538/

[edit] Megalodon?

This article says that they are related to the extinct Megalodon, and then says that they are not. This is probably the result of a poor edit. Someone should certianly try to find a reliable refrence that confirms either side. Great Green Arkelseizure 05:31, 14 January 2006 (UTC) THEY ARE NOT REAL WOW! THEY used to exist but not anymore JWC

Shouldn't your name be Great Green ArkLEseizure, Great Green Arkelseizure? Notreallydavid 00:54, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Why do great white sharks attack people?

they are hungry. They need to eat too JWC

My understanding is that sharks (including great whites) do not attack humans because they're hungry. I believe it's generally accepted that:

1) there aren't very many unprovoked attacks on humans

2) attacks on humans are usually cases of mistaken identity (such as mistaking a surfer laying on his board as a turtle or seal -- favorite food sources for great whites)

Sharks have some of the greatest sences in the world, and they have 6 of them! I don't believe that a shark would mistake a human on a surf board for a seal. They have great farsight, terrible nearsight, they have a great sence of smell, and they have the electro sence. They know what a seal smells like and how much electrical pulses it sends out, they wouldn't easily mistake that for a human. Bcody 01:46, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

i've never heard that before. do you have a cite for that? Mapetite526 16:22, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
My understanding is that sharks attack people because they are curious about them, and a shark probes/tests strange items by biting it. Due to the size of the great white, a probing bite would still often prove fatal to a human.--Caliga10 16:32, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

Sure, many times sharks will "test bite" a person. Most of the time they take a bite, then go away. But there have been different cases. There was one case in H.I. where a tiger shark not only bit a woman who was swimming, but continued to attack her and ate much of her body. There have been cases like this with great whites. If there is a low amount of food in the area, sharks will attack humans and won't stop. You can't just say that it's always a "test bite" Bcody 03:34, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Trouble in captivity

A new user wikivandalizer (talk • contribs) added the following paragraph:

One of the main reasons Great Whites have such trouble in captivity is because they have a "sixth sense" that navigates them through the water based on the earth's magnetic field. When in captivity you will see the Great White bump into walls and such because its sense of navigation has been altered because of the small size of a tank compared to the whole ocean.

I removed it since adding nonsense is part of the MO for other edits the user has made, however I am moving it here in the hope it was the one useful edit made... Any thoughts? --Hansnesse 04:03, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

The size of the body of water should be irrelevant, and even if magnetic navigation is what White Sharks use (recent evidence from satellite tracking esp. shows they spend an unusual amount of time near the surface on long trips, so they may be using visual navigation) the size of the tank won't matter. Plus it sounds like it's confusing the Ampullae of Lorenzini with magnetic navigation. Sharks need a lot of room to roam, and you don't need to go to the lengths of magnetism to find a reason they bump against the edges of their confinement.Wevets 04:47, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Great White Space

Is there any way to remove that ugly big white space at the top? Aplomado - UTC 21:46, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Amaletz?

Can anyone explain where the name 'Amaletz' comes from? I can only find it in this article and rip-off articles.

  • I can't find any source for that name so have removed it. Looks unlikely to be an English language name anyway and the article doesn't list names in other languages. If anybody can give a source for this I'd love to know as it seems to have been copied in in the original article. Yomangani 11:06, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Spy-hopping?

  This is the only shark known to lift its head above the sea surface to gaze at other objects such as 
  prey; this is known as "spy-hopping".

Is spy-hopping actually to look? You'd imagine that eyes designed to interface with water would be mostly useless interfacing with air. If they're build anything like human eyes that is. I'm obviously clueless here and I can't seem to find much about spy-hopping online. This link suggest they focus similarly to a camera, which could be part of the story:

http://www.elasmo-research.org/education/white_shark/vision.htm

Anybody?

I think we should rewrite this, not sure what is consedered spy-hopping, but this should be consedered lifting its head above the sea surface to me. I will do some more research before I update the text and as for the question, yes I think they actually do this to see, but obviously I'm not sure, whales do a lot of spy-hopping (but I can not even find a article about it? need to ask the whales guys) but it (for whales) have been described as a way to look, but then I know I should not trust documentatries :-). Stefan 00:23, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
See Breaching Stefan 01:37, 28 May 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Sperm Whale Attack

Is there a source for this? I don't remember reading any account of a sperm whale attack on a Great White Yomangani 18:45, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "Frequent" death due to own teeth

"Great whites often swallow their own broken off teeth along with chunks of their prey's flesh. These teeth frequently cause damage to the great white's digestive tract, often resulting in death from infection and blood loss." <-- This sounds like an urban myth. Is there a reference to a study demonstrating this? Andrew Moylan 09:16, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] I've got a question

In the distribution of the whales, why do they only live near the continents? Surely they are somewhere in the deep sea as well, no? --Scotteh 17:09, 4 September 2006 (UTC) new message.

Please message me.

[edit] Sources

This article has a few things listed as, basically a bibliography, but there aren't many in line citations. So when numbers and the like are changed, there's no way to ensure the change is moving us forward. It would be good to add inline references to the article. Does anyone who follows this talk page know which bits of the current article came from which listed book/paper/etc. --Siobhan Hansa 01:18, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Yes agree, and no we do not know which refers to what, inline references will be added when we have time. When adding references you basically have to look at a few good one and see if they match the text, if not you update the text to be according to the references and inster the reference. In project sharks we are working on improving the standard of shark articles, I'm sure we will come to this also at some time, but not yet. Please help! Stefan 01:33, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Question

Any recent attempts at putting them in captivity?? I always wanted to see one first hand.

Yes, see this link. Stefan 14:36, 26 September 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Shark tourism

I think there needs to be something on shark tourism, since the GW is the main shark associated with this booming industry, or is it here and i missed it?--Halaqah 00:41, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] GW to GA

This is now seleted as collaboration of the week. The goal is GA status. This is my comments on what should be done, please add on to my list and strike out if you fix something.

  • need a taxonomy section (see e.g. Oceanic_whitetip_shark)
  • Think we should make a 'Relationship to humans' section where we can have 'Great white sharks in captivity' , 'tourism', 'cage diving' and probably Jaws references and so on.
  • References!!!!
  • Take away odd sighting sounds like blog entry, not encyclopedic.
  • English, I'm sure we need to make the text better (always need that to pass GA)

Stefan 02:07, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

Pictures, that would be nice. Hard to find any, but if that would definitely help, since we only have one photo and a distribution map. chris_huh 16:51, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Video

The video linked to from "Video of great white sharks attacking seals" which links to http://www.filecabi.net/video/shark081.html appears to be in copyright violation of content from a BBC programme. I have added a link the video sequence on the BBC web site instead, which is of higher quality and directly from the source. Flux 22:20, 13 November 2006 (UTC).

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