Talk:Gears of War

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[edit] Vandalism

What is the point?

Of such Senseless vandalism?

And how can a game have homosexual tendencies?

  • It happens to most video game articles due the few people who don't like the game, or the people playing the game, or the people that made the game, or the people writing the articles. Vandalism will be common for this article, and it will get worse when the game's sequel is released. --Jecrell 15:12, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

"This game was made by Zash(Zach),Keith,Dealer, And Hunter, they are the presidents of gears of wars and Xbox 360 they are also the maker of everything in gaming and almost anything you can think of.A word from us WHERE GOING TO POWN YOU..Dealer is a assasain maybe. IN the end of the game is where the people try to plant a bomb and blow up the place Spoilerdown the page more."

This looks like vandalism, can someone revert this? 151.188.16.17 13:59, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Someone keeps putting this myspace link. Ban them or something. I changed it this time but This is at least the 2nd time. Superbowlbound 16:36, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Most likely someone already reverted it. --Scottie theNerd 22:33, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Misinformation

There's a glaring inaccuracy under "Act 5" claiming that the lightmass bomb was never mentioned prior to this act. That is flat wrong as the colonel says "we now have the lightmass bomb" to the Lt. in the first act after the prison rescue. MartinDuffy 02:02, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

Did you know that the $100 million USD factoid listed at the top of the page for the last month or so was actually unproven? The original source it had said nothing of the sort, but you'll see various gaming fansites using that information now that it has been on Wikipedia. I also recently found references that led to forums. People posting on discussion forums is no way to say that a majority of people are experiencing disc problems and the like, but that doesn't stop people from actually editing the article and putting that information in there, possibly to drive away sales or point out personal issues. I had all sorts of disc read errors with my early Xbox 360 models, and it took 3 replacements to get a good one that didn't create problems. </end rant> --Jecrell 14:53, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Trivia Section

While I didn't put up the notice in the trivia section; it turns out that Wikipedia doesn't like trivia sections to begin with. Toss out the garbage and merge the important information with the rest of the article. --Jecrell 10:00, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

  • I shortened down the trivia section a bit. I expect to be beaten with a stick for it, but there was a dead Digg URL that was used as the source of a lot of the material. Subsequently I had the trivia points with the dead Digg reference removed. It doesn't really mean they're bad references, but Trivia isn't important information to begin with, just interesting. Unimportant information that isn't cited probably doesn't belong here. --Jecrell 14:56, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

The achievement trivia is constantly being removed and readded. I'd like some explanations on why this is such an important issue. Do these references need to be in the article at all? --Jecrell 05:02, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

I think it's worth noting. There's been wide interest in the media, and it's something multiple third-party sources have reported on. It's gotten much more attention than trivia such as John DiMaggio's unrelated voiceover work, Eric Nylund's involvement, Megadeath or even the connection and references to Terry Tate. It's sourced, it's true, and I see no reason for it to be deleted. Again, it's just worth noting. -- Viewdrix 21:36, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

While it's not an Achievement, on the first level you face the Kryll, when Anya tells you to "Head down the ally to your left", Dom remarks "It's Pitch Black out there!" and Marcus says "Huh..." This is a reference to the Kryll's similarity to the creatures in the movie Pitch Black.

[edit] Reception

Gears currently holds the #14 spot on Gamerankings.com, with an average score of 95.0%, on their list of games with at least 20 reviews, which is their standard.

  • I have removed the word "unanimously". Unanimous is an overly strong word. If *any* professional critic gives it a low rating it is no longer unanimous. The game critic in the Swedish newspaper Svenska Dagbladet gave it a 2 on a scale to 6. Here is a link: http://www.svd.se/dynamiskt/rec_spel/did_14079192.asp . Thus it is no longer unanimous. Sensemaker 14:11, 21 November 2006 (UTC)

Lead Designer Cliff "CliffyB" Bleszinski cited Resident Evil 4's quick pacing and emphasis on "memorable moments" as a major influence on Gears of War in an interview with Game Informer, and promised the game would have the presentation of this game be cinematic in scope, and chaotic, destructible environments would be an important aspect of gameplay.

    • Well it was fun while it lasted. ;D --Jecrell 20:19, 21 November 2006 (UTC)
      • Good joke, Jecrell. :-) Sensemaker 11:53, 23 November 2006 (UTC)
        • Changed to #18 on Game Rankings --Jecrell 17:27, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Weapons

Yo, I updated the weapons section completely! Any tweaks, feel free to add anything you find in the game, Peace Basejumper123 04:06, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

  • The weapons section seems to have disappeared (vandalism likely). I don't want to revert too far back, but let's not post huge GameFAQ-esque pages. If they are mentioned, brief descriptions with bullet points would work best. --Jecrell 17:55, 25 November 2006 (UTC)
    • Ya, im trying to find it, ill condense it, it was already just bullets Basejumper123 19:30, 25 November 2006 (UTC)
      • Fixed, found it in history and placed it back up there, any thoughts just tell me @ Basejumper123 19:38, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

You just reverted the huge GameFAQs-style game guide list back into the article. Please don't do that. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 20:46, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

  • Ok, sorry, i wrote it cause it was a mess before. Peace Basejumper123, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Notability

Alright, let's hammer this one out now. Most of the equipment in Gears of War isn't notable in themselves, being vamped up versions of existing ballistic-based weapons. However, I choose to note several weapons that are uncommon or unseen in other games of the same genre.

  • The Lancer assault rifle is the archetypal weapon of the game. The chainsaw bayonet has never been seen in a game or any other form of popular culture, and it was a heavily promoted item in game during development and extensively featured in trailers. As the most commonly used weapon in the game, I believe its mention is justified in this article.
  • The Torque Bow takes the traditional crossbow and gives it an explosive tip and the ability to penetrate surfaces, a feature not seen in most other games.
  • The Hammer of Dawn is a large-scale satellite based superweapon. Certain games feature a similar weapon, but not to the tactical scale of Gears of War, and additionally the weapon's limitations add depth to the game.

The rest of the weapons are, to my interpretation, pretty generic as far as weapons go (grenade launcher, sniper rifle, shotgun, etc.). I believe the above three weapons deserve mention for the following reasons:

  • The article does not convey the applications of the fictional advanced technology the setting possesses. A brief description of technologically innovative weapons would provide the readers with a better understanding of the technology of the fictional world of Sera and its practical application.
  • These weapons stand out from other first-person and third-person shooters in that they are either have not be used or their role has been greatly expanded through gameplay.
  • The inclusion of these three contains more significance than several other gameplay features that are included in the article. A list of game modes that are barely different from deathmatch and a shock-health system don't set the game apart as much as the fluid combat gameplay. As part of the combat side of the game, these weapons deserve mention and how they differ from other war games.
  • The section is not an extensive list of weapons. Three weapons that stand out is not a big deal is not a GameFAQs-style list.
  • If no weapons are to be mentioned, you might as well remove the whole Weapons section, as it only contains two general and ambiguous statements.
  • Other games feature (or used to feature) whole articles dedicated to weapons. Those that have been deleted have been reincorporated into their base articles as general statements with notable exceptions. As these three are, to my interpretation, notable exceptions to other games, they deserve the few lines they get.

Your turn. Why shouldn't they be included? --Scottie theNerd 06:06, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Chainsaw bayonets have been done. They've even been done in first-person shooters before (the Chaos Marine enemies in Warhammer 40K: Fire Warrior). It's also just a gun with a bayonet. Crossbows with exploding bolts aren't new, either. Calling in tactical airborne strikes isn't new, either. (Ghost Recon 2 comes to mind.)

If you have to argue on the talk page to establish importance, you've failed to establish importance. Make the article speak for itself; explain how these weapons make GOW different or exemplify GOW's gameplay or artistic style, and back it up with references. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 06:14, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Yes, the chainsaw bayonet is "just a bayonet", yet few first-person shooters actually feature bayonets in the first place, and Warhammer 40K: Fire Warrior only features it as an enemy weapon. Exploding crossbows aren't new, but exploding crossbows that can interact with a dynamic environment are (in GoW's case, providing a source of light to defeat a boss). An orbital laser satellite isn't an airstrike; many games allow "precision" missile strikes in pre-determined locations, but no FPS game give players a precision they can manually control over where and what to fire at (albeit in limited sections in GoW). The inherent problem with referencing game features is that manuals poorly document in-game abilities, and many game articles simply explain game features without reference to the manual or other sources, yet the information is often frightfully obvious the moment someone picks up the controller.
I am putting forward this discussion here as this is the purpose of the discussion page, and I'm sure you would rather discuss a contentious point here than to engage in an revert war. I have already attempted to show how these items exemplify GoW's gameplay and have been reverted, it is clear that I must clarify with you and other editors before I make another edit. --Scottie theNerd 07:00, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

If you're planning to write this based on your personal experience with the game, that's pretty much the definition of original research, and I'd advise you to reconsider. The description of the taste and texture of various types of cheese isn't based on personal experience of the author in cheese, but in descriptions in the sources on which the article rests.

I wasn't criticizing your decision to take this to talk, but rather the fact that the text, as written, failed to establish importance. You say these differences from other games are noteworthy; I say you need to back up these assertions in some way other than "Well, I can't think of any games that have these features." - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 07:32, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

If we are to have a weapons section, I'd like it if we noted the more unique weapons with references as necessary. If that's not possible, I think it should just be summarized or merged with the gameplay section. --Jecrell 07:42, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

In this case then, what would be a credible source to reference? The manual does provide the basics of the equipment, and the game itself is pretty clear on what they are used for. The only other source I can think of would be a professional game guide. It's not based on my experiences with the game; it's simply what the game contains but isn't specifically outlined in the manual. Apart from summarising it as part of the gameplay (which is feasible, but doesn't provide specific examples), how would you suggest citing sources for gameplay features that are not outlined in the manual or game news site? --Scottie theNerd 12:24, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
In my opinion, you did the right thing by mentioning the few specific weapons that can be considered unique to the Gears of War game. Previous variations of the weapons section mentioned every single weapon-type and provided too much detail while you singled out the unique weapons and mentioned that the other average kinds of weapons were already in the game. It could be all that is needed are article references that mention particularly how the Gears of War weapons differ from the average first person and tactical shooter titles we are all familiar with. Perhaps an IGN impressions article summarizing the experiences of using Gears specific weapons would suffice. --Jecrell 13:53, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
I personaly think each weapon should be added as it is a feature of the game.While yes the shotgun and sniper rifle are typical, the Hammer, Lancer Rifle, and pistol are not. Someone should also add the Locust weapons as well like thier machine gun and such. Also I added to the section on weapons about how it is a similar to recent games where you can only hold so much.

--AllTeam november 30 2006

That's exactly what we don't want. We're avoiding mentioning weapons that are similar to standard equipment in most games; not every weapon is "featured" in the game, and we don't want a GameFAQs-style technical list. As I have outlined above, the three weapons I consider to be most notable are the Lancer, the Torque Bow and the Hammer of Dawn. The pistol is hardly unique: you have one weak rapid-fire pistol (like practically any other pistol in any other game) and a powerful Magnum-like pistol, which is also a common alternative. The Locust don't even have their own weapons other than the Troika gun (which is basically a dual-mounted minigun. I'm reverting your edit since your information is redundant and not an important technical detail and we are yet to establish the section's significance. --Scottie theNerd 05:26, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

The manual establishes that such-and-such weapons are in the game. What you need are references to back up the claim that such-and-such weapons are unique or important. Reviews would seem to be the first place to look. EGM's Afterthoughts series is always good for an after-release perspective from a developer. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 05:38, 1 December 2006 (UTC)


The lancer itself as a weapon isn't notable nor is it's bayonet. The notability of the lancer is the fact that the bayonet uses a rag-doll physics engine. What that means is that based on how and where it is used, the environment and the "victim" are affected. After you kill an enemy with the chainsaw, the body can be moved post-mortem by running in to it. If you play the game and pay attention, the head is in two parts, like if you took string cheese and split it down to the middle. Also, the blood spray sticks to the walls and onto characters. In certain parts when you use it multiple times (this is especially noticiable in the wretches' sections) the blood drips off of the player and surrounding enemies. This is one of the first games to use the system for such purposes, and the chainsaw's use of rag-doll engines is not seen in any other game.72.193.239.80 22:18, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Edit: Wasn't signed in, sorry...Kea vader 22:22, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

The significance in that is in regard to the game's physics engine rather than the weapon. --Scottie theNerd 00:26, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

That's the significance all together. The lancer is one of the first weapons in which the game's physics engine has been applied to. Normally, the rag doll physics engines have only been applied to the game in general (it first appeared in the original Ghost Recon). True, the chainsaw itself isn't new, but how the physics engine is applied to it is. The head stays in two parts after death and it reacts as such. The physics engine only applies to the other guns the same way as the engine always does in games. Shoot something, and it moves to react to the shot. But chainsaw it, and something totally new happens.Kea vader 04:09, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

The game's physics are significantly different to other games. It can be demonstrated by the Lancer. The Lancer itself should not be the focus of a section. Additionally, other weapons also make use of dynamic ragdoll/model decal effects: the sniper rifle's headshot creates a blast pattern dependent on the point on the head at which it strikes, while explosive weapons tear character models apart based on blast location. These are all features of the game's physics, not the weapons. --Scottie theNerd 05:03, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
  • Actually, chainsaw bayonets have been seen on weapons held by characters in the Warhammer 40000 universe, specifically Chaos Terminators. I'll see if I can find an image link, but the 2nd edition of "Codex: Chaos" had images of miniatures with said bayonets, and that was published in 1996. It's hardly original. - DeadEye001 14:35, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Missing chuncks of info in article

I found several spots in the article that looks like half of a sentence (or more) was just removed. I've cleaned up what I found and rewrote what I could recall from memory. Keep a good eye out for more spots. -th1rt3en 19:31, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

Looks like the result of a sloppy copyedit. --Scottie theNerd 19:36, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Weasel Words on Cole Character

There was a sentence along the lines of "some critics say Cole is a token black character." I removed this because (a) it's a weasel sentence, (b) this is not a well-known or documented opinion and (c) the Cole character was clearly based on the existing Terry Tate character. KyuzoGator 19:44, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

  • I'm glad you did. It sounds most distressing that some people consider one of this game's most unique personalities a 'token black character'. --Jecrell 15:00, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Vandalism in the character section

Although I do not play Gears, I was reading and found this in the characters section "game, usama is gay Delta Squad"

218.186.8.12 04:32, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

edit: for some reason i was not logined

Ghostbearkhan 04:34, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

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