Talk:Free Will Baptist Church

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"Free Will Baptists believe that once salvation is "lost", it can be regained through repentance."

This is a rather vague, inaccurate statement. Perhaps a better way of stating this would be: Free Will Baptists believe that if someone "loses" their salvation through apostasy that they can turn back to God before they die. However, if they do not repent, dieing in their trespasses, they would end up in Hell.

---Yes, this is closer but, having been a Free Will Baptist for many years and involved in ministry, I believe there's an even better way to put this. Without delving too deeply into theology, Free Will Baptist doctrine is heavily influenced by the works of Arminius (as oppossed to Calvin). "Salvation" is neither "lost" nor "gained" by anything man does. "Salvation" was provided for all by Christ's atoning death on the cross. Because of "Original Sin" all humanity is naturally in a fallen state, prone to sin, and bound for Hell. Christ tells us that in order to be saved from our sins (and consequent eternity in Hell) and gain eternal life with Him, man must be "born again" by accepting Christ's atoning death, burial and subsequent resurrection.

Therefore, it is not "salvation" that is "lost" and "saved" but rather the Souls of Men (Humanity) that are "lost" and "saved". Now, Free Will Baptists believe that a person is "saved" through their "Free Will" acceptence of Jesus Christ as their personal Saviour and continual acknledgement of Him as Lord. He/She may at some future point, excercise their "Free Will" and return to a life of unrepentant sin, thereby indicating the condition of their soul (in rebellion and rejecting Jesus Christ as Lord of their life). If a person dies in this state, they die "lost", having rejected Salvation, and suffer eternity in Hell.

However, as the Bible says, "God is willing that none should perish, but all should come to repentance" (2 Peter 3:9). If this person should realize the error of his ways and turn again from his sinful lifestyle and practices with a repentant heart, thereby again acknowledging Christ as Lord and Master, he shall be restored to a saving relationship with God through Jesus Christ and be counted among the "saved".--- William

I've noticed other Religion/Denomination pages have a section title something like "Famous Southern Baptists" or "Notable Lutherans", etc. What does everybody think about adding such a section here? It could include historical figures such as Benjamin Randall, John Colby, President Lincoln's mother, etc. and current influential leaders/speakers in the Denomination (David Crowe, Randy Williams, Trimon Messner, etc).

Also, I have an autobiography of Benjamin Randall and some other source material on Benjamin Randall and John Colby. I would like to start a Benjamin Randall page but I'm not sure how. I've lurked here (read: spent way too much time here) for years, make a few minor edits and suggestions now and then, but never started a new page. Where can a learn how? Is there a template or something like that? WilliamThweatt 03:25, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Wording on feet washing statement

I'd like to start a discussion for rewording a paragraph in the article.

A recent edit changed the third paragraph of "Distinguishing Doctrinal Features" to read: "Free Will Baptists also observe The Washing of the Saints' Feet as a third ordinance of the church along with Baptism and Communion, a rite common among other evangelical groups but not practiced by the majority of Baptist denominations, but initially practiced by all Baptist groups."

The older version read: "Free Will Baptists also observe The Washing of the Saints' Feet as a third ordinance of the church along with Baptism and Communion, a rite common among other evangelical groups but not practiced by the majority of Baptist denominations."

I am currently compiling material to publish a book on the history of feet washing among Baptists. Stating that feet washing was "initially practiced by all Baptist groups" is somewhat misleading. In America, some feet washing can be found historically among most, if not all, Baptists, but sometimes only as a minority practice. It was practiced by both Particular and General Baptists in England, but it was never universal among either of them. It was a major rite among the Continental Anabaptists -- though again never universal, and this also leads into the ongoing debate of whether English Baptists are successors of the Continental Anabaptists, which goes beyond the scope of this article. I am pro- feet washing, so this is not motivated by a desire to belittle the practice of feet washing -- just to get a more accurate and better worded statement. Ideas? - Rlvaughn 19:43, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

Hello, Rlvaughn. I wrote what you quoted as the "older version". I noticed the newer version a couple days ago. I don't agree with it, either, but thought I'd give it a little time to see what others think (apparently, this article isn't read much, though). I have done research in the history of feet washing (don't worry...I'm not writing a book...just a curious Free Will Baptist scholar), not into the history of "all Baptist groups", but I believe the statement to be inaccurate. It may have been practiced by various sub-groups at various times throughout the history of every Baptist group but, as you say, I strongly doubt it was ever universally observed as a Third Ordinance as this sentance indicates. I am going to revert to the old version. The contributing editor is welcome to chime in here and re-add the statement, but the burden of proof would be on him. A reputable citation is in order for such a sweeping statement to be included.--WilliamThweatt 20:15, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

Thanks William, good points. There is quite of bit of background of feet washing among those churches that would form the Southern Baptist Convention. But it never was a majority practice; most who did practice it did not call it an ordinance or make it a test of fellowship; and some in the churches that practiced it never agreed with it. By the turn of the (20th) century it had probably died out among the majority of those that had practiced it -- although there are some SBC churches in north Georgia (and perhaps other places) that still observe the rite. Some "non-SBC" missionary Baptists in my area kept up the practice until the late 1930s. BTW, since you mention you have done research into the history of feet washing, do you have any exceptional sources/resources that you would recommend? I am looking at (though not necessarily using) anything I can find. I really like records from individual church and local association minutes, such as notes about the local practice and articles of faith, but these are some of the hardest and most time-consuming to research. In U.S. Baptist history, I am keying on the groups not usually known to have observed the rite -- IOW, almost "everyone" knows that Primitive Baptists and Free Will Baptists practice feet washing, but many would and do assume that Missionary Baptists never did. - Rlvaughn 18:36, 9 March 2006 (UTC)