Talk:Eskimo

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[edit] defaced

The article has been defaced. Also I think the article should state that although the term Eskimo is considered derogatory amont Yupik, Inuit, etc, there is no other word in English to collectively refer to the groups as a whole.


I'm wondering whether this information should be in Inuit.

I am moving it there and putting a redirect. - montréalais

I don't think that Eskimo should redirect to Inuit. Groups like the Yuit and Yupik are also 'eskimos', and don't want to be called Inuit. --Jfpierce 06:25, 28 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Why can't we just have a disambiguation page, and have a redirect to the "Inuit" page, for the Aboriginese of the Canadian Arctic, and all other tribes who find the term 'Eskimo' offensive. For the others who do not find "Eskimo" derogatory, there could be another page. Besides, we have an "Inuit" page already, don't we? --Stephen 00:00, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Word origin

I think the article should state clearly that the origins of the word are unclear. It seems that it originally appeared in French, and that people have been looking for Amerindian origin of the word, but that this remains obscure? Could someone qualified make such an incipit to the section? The reader who doesn't know some about the debate is left to guess the little that is known from a discussion about what is not...! --Josce 09:17, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "Eskimo" doesn't mean eaters of raw meat?

The article says that the belief that the word Eskimo is an Indian word, meaning "eaters of raw meat", is incorrect. It says so without citing a source. Well, I was taught that it meant "eaters of raw fisht", not "eaters of raw meat". I think the article should back up this assertion. -- Geo Swan 10:09, 14 Jan 2005 (UTC)

The article did cite one source before. I added some more info and added two references at the bottom, but didn't cite them in the article itself. Sorry about that; I've added it now [Oh wait. I didn't notice the 2005 date; that comment was written a year ago. Oops]. Ives Goddard, who has suggested this new etymology, is one of the most respected and eminent Algonquianists today. I should also note that the American Heritage Dictionary also agrees with this etymology: [1]. --Whimemsz 01:13, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

In Saulteaux do call the the Inuit as "Eshkimeg", which would be "raw-fish" (from ashki-"raw", experiencing the subordinate clause initial vowel change of a to e, plus the combining form of the word "fish": =meg). However, in other areas speaking Ojibwe instead say "Eshkimo" to mean "eats somebody raw" (same eshki- as before, but with =mo, "eats someone"). Fr. Baraga, however, attributes the word instead to Cree:

ESQUIMAUX, (Cree), comes from: aski, raw, and, mewew, to eat some body, whence: askimowew, he eates him raw, or, better, askimow, he eates raw.

CJLippert 00:41, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

The word 'eskimo' is actually a condescending term, it's better to used the word inuit

---

The problem exists because you have a few different groups of people who fall under the group "Eskimo," and there is no other word that could be used in place of Eskimo to collectively refer to all of these groups. I corrected ur title it said eaters of raw meant in the beginning.

The article should be called something along the lines of “Arctic natvies”. The word “Eskimo” is considered by many people outside of the United States to be racist slang; it seems ridiculous to have the article on this page. -Arctic.gnome 16:11, 9 January 2006 (UTC)
One reason for placing the article under this name is the naming convention that articles are placed under the most common name. I suspect that "Eskimo" is the most common term used for this specific grouping (including both Inuit and Yupik but not Aleut). But see also Wikipedia:Naming conventions (common names)#Don't overdo it. Even if the article stays at Eskimo, however, that needn't stop one from using other phrases like "Arctic native" in the body of the article! But if you change anything, be sure to use a phrase that means the right thing; in the case of "Arctic native", that seems to me to wrongly include Aleuts --although for some parts of the article, that might not really matter. --Toby Bartels 06:55, 13 January 2006 (UTC)
"Arctic native" is ambiguous. The Sami people are Arctic natives; you could even argue that Finns, Norwegians, and Swedes are too. The article should stay at "Eskimo" as long as that term continues to be used. --Saforrest 19:45, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Whether "Arctic native" is ambiguous or not, "Eskimo" is overwhelmingly considered an offensive term in many areas. And as for the assertion that we should continue to refer to people based on whatever word others call them, this is lunacy. By this logic, god only knows what we should call all first nations people in Canada, or African-Americans. --207.47.143.4 01:15, 4 March 2006 (UTC)

The problem with considering the term "Eskimo" to be offensive is that nobody actually seems to use it offensively, and that there are large areas where it is not used offensively at all. The English-speaking world outside of Canada does not see it as an offensive term except as informed by Canadians. If Canadian people wish to see this as an insult that is their prerogative, but it is unfair for them to enforce their opinions on all the other groups who do accept this term. The same battle has been fought with words like "history" and "woman", and in these sorts of cases it is simply not tenable to claim that words are offensive when nobody uses them in an offensive manner.
Furthermore, the term "Eskimo" is widely accepted in both linguistics and anthropology as an appropriate ethnonym for the ethnic groups including the Inuit, Inupiat, Yup'ik, Yuit, Cupig, and Sugpiaq/Alutiiq. This is by social scientists who are today acutely aware of cultural sensitivities, and who go out of their way to avoid offending indigenous peoples of any sort. The term "Inuit" is too restrictive, it only applies to the groups in Canada and Greenland who speak Inuit languages, and to noone else. The Inupiat do speak an Inuit language but are themselves uncomfortable with the label "Inuit" because they feel it applies in both English and in Inupiaq to people living east of the Mackenzie River delta. All the peoples listed who live in Alaska and Russia accept the term "Eskimo" as an appropriate term for all of these groups, and none of them accept the term "Inuit" except as an exonym for the Canadian and Greenland peoples.
Despite acceptance by the other Eskimo peoples, the overwhelming use of this term in scientific literature is a very strong argument in favor of Wikipedia using the term. The article has fairly addressed the issue, and if you feel there is something that needs to be added to this then feel free to make those additions. But it is inappropriate for the article to be renamed and thus go against both scientific practice as well as the opinions of the non-Inuit Eskimo peoples.
Also please note that Wikipedia is not a place for original research. This means that if you want to see a different term established which fairly describes all of these groups, then you need to establish this in the rest of the world first, then come back to Wikipedia to change it. Wikipedia is not a place for activism in any form, be it linguistic or otherwise.
— Jéioosh 12:28, 4 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] plural : Eskimos

Please check for people writing "eskimoes" as the plural of this word. I saw this twice today. +sj + 23:33, 30 August 2005 (UTC)


[edit] East/west

The beginning of the article includes excluding circumpolar Scandinavia and all but the easternmost portions of Russia. Shouldn't that be westernmost Russia? — KayEss | talk 05:58, 26 October 2005 (UTC)

It's correct. It excludes all but easternmost Russia; the double negation means that it includes easternmost Russia. But it is confusing, so I've reworded it. -- Toby Bartels 06:58, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Note about history of word "esquimaux"

Doubt this helps anything, but,

es qui maux - "be which evils" in literal translation. "qui es maux", assuming an inversion, "who be evils".

172.172.1.152

That etymology is more than a bit forced. In any case, it would be qui est mal ou qui sont maux. Qui es maux doesn't mean anything in French. --Saforrest 19:40, 31 January 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Esquimaux should not be merged with Eskimo

Eskimos are a tribe of Alaskan natives. On the other hand, the Esquimax race was defined by anthropologist Thomas Huxley in On the Methods and Results of Ethnology (1865) to include all Alaskan natives and indigenous north Canadians -- Dark Tichondrias 07:44, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

According to this article, "There are two main groups of Eskimos: the Inuit (in northern Alaska, Canada and Greenland) and the Yupik (of western Alaska and the Russian Far East)." They are not restricted to Alaska only. It looks like Huxley's "Esquimaux" = the Inuit. --Lukobe 23:41, 14 April 2006 (UTC)
They seem equally vague and should therefore be merged. —Keenan Pepper 17:08, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Add Smithsonian link?

Hello! I am a writer for the Smithsonian's Center for Education, which publishes Smithsonian in Your Classroom, a magazine for teachers. An online version of an issue titled "Teaching from Objects and Stories, Learning about the Bering Sea Eskimo People" is available at this address:

http://www.smithsonianeducation.org/educators/lesson_plans/eskimo/start.html

If you think your audience would find this valuable, I wish to invite you to include it as an external link. We would be most grateful.

Thank you so much for your attention.

[edit] Use and origin of the term

"The term "Eskimo" is an exonym that is not generally used by Eskimos themselves. The term "Inuit" is sometimes used instead, but it does not properly include the Yupik."

Yup'ik Eskimos in my village in the Kuskokwim Delta of Alaska regularly use the term "Eskimo" to refer to themselves. "Eskimo" is written onto their Tribal Council ID cards and their Eskimo heritage is something of which they are quite proud. I understand this to be the case throughout the Yukon-Kuskokwim Delta. Generally, they consider themselves "Yup'ik Eskimo." I think this should be changed, but I'm not sure where to cite the source. Should I scan a copy of the ID card and post it to a website and provide a link? Knowmoore 02:34, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

Nah, just delete it. You don't need a reference to delete false statements that don't have references of their own. - Nat Krause(Talk!) 03:01, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

OK, how about this instead- "The terms "Eskimo" and "Inuit" are frequently used interchangeably, however the term "Inuit" does not properly include the Alutiiq, Inupiaq, Sug'piak, and Yup'ik Eskimo populations of Alaska, or the Yup'ik population of Western Russia. “Inuit” refers to Arctic Native populations in Canada." Knowmoore 04:34, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

Yes, I also think to delete the unreferenced statement and put in what you think is correct. It would be very good to also add in a reference to some reliable source on the matter. Now, I was brought up (in Britain in the 50s and 60s) to say "Eskimo" and then later I was told that was derogatory and I should say "Inuit". I'm delighted that I wasn't being rude! However, some guidance for people like me would be helpful, maybe beyond what the article says already. The American Heritage Dictionary [2] in the "External links" really still leaves me in doubt. Also, I think it would be really neat to include a scanned ID card. You could upload it to Wikipedia (or Wikimedia Commons) directly, not just just link to it on another site. The No original research policy allows this (providing copyright is OK). However, to keep within the "NOR" policy, I think you should not add any conclusions of your own concerning what is on the card. Thincat 12:25, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

Well, I left (after living there for 2 years) before asking anyone from the village if I could copy their ID and put it on the internet. I would have felt stupid asking. But the point is that there are plenty of Northern Natives who consider themselves Eskimo. Most importantly, as the article already states, while they identify themselves as Eskimo, they are Yup'ik, Inupiaq, Sug'piak, etc... It is a minor detail, but it's important to know that "Eskimo" is actually a term used and appreciated by many Northern Natives- both formally and casually. For those who identify by it, the term is not degrading. I furthermore suspect their use of the term does not come with ignorance of this debate. Knowmoore 07:48, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] citations

There needs to be some cleanup and sites to the section I added the tag too.

Some Algonquian languages call Eskimos by names that mean "eaters of raw meat" or something that sounds similar citation or footnote needed for this.

But in the period of the earliest attested French use of the word this needs a citation

It is entirely possible that the Ojibwe have adopted words resembling "Eskimo" by borrowing them from French, and the French word merely sounds like Ojibwe words that can be interpreted as "eaters of raw meat" This is speculation. The citation must be reputable and sourced, otherwise its original research and needs to be removed.

etc. There are a lot of claims made in the article that have no citations. if need be I can go through and tag each thing, but I think people can figure out what things need citations there. --Crossmr 20:24, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Eskimo should be a disambiguation page

"Eskimo" is offensive. Why not have separate articles, one for Inuit and one for Yupik? Is there a reason for lumping them together? That's like having an article called "Orientals" about Chinese, Japanese, and Koreans. Wikiwikifast 15:02, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

  • Seconded. It is clearly offensive to some. I'm shocked to see that the page notes that the use is offensive in Canada, and then goes on to say how many "Eskimos" there are in Canada. Isn't that like putting the results of the 2000 US Census on the nigger page? Nfitz 06:08, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

I suppose that the languages of oriental people are

Also terms like Altaic languages or Paleosiberian can be problematic, as are not proven to be genalogial units.

But Eskimo-Aleut languages are accepted to be relative (and, of corse, they are similar in typology, having polysynthetic and incorporating features), thus we cannot used this analogy.

If I am speaking Hungarian, I simply use term “eszkimó” to denote “the bigger main branch of the Eskimo-Aleut languages” (the other being Aleut. The image of the genaelogical tree shows the necessity of denoting this node of the tree somehow. Saying “Inuit and Yupik” may be problematic because Sirenik language is regarded sometimes as a third subbranch of Eskimo (althogh it is said that Sirenik language became extinct in 1997).

In Hungary, “eszkimó” sounds not derogatory. Nor does “néger” — Hungary's soaring point is the unright prejudiece against Roma people, but most other native groups in the world are thought of neutral or appreciated in Hungary, and so are the their names.

I do not know how “the bigger main branch of Eskimo-Aleut languages” is termed in English, or which words are derogatory in English. Maybe a similar question arises with speking of Gypsy people, because

  • Gypsy is term a used for denoting people speaking relative dialects, and the other names denote specific groups, thus are not general enogh (e.g. using term Roma people may be problematic when speking of the Manush groups living in France), Thus, using term Gipsy may be felt as justified.
  • but Gipsy may be felt derogatory in Hungary (althogh the context and tone may be the most important whether it sounds so).

Physis 16:29, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Term Eskimo is extremely derogatory

In Canada and many other areas, Eskimo is extremely derogatory. It means eaters of raw meat (I believe in one of the Cree languages), and who wants to be called that? The term Inuit is generally more acceptable. Government employees in Canada have gotten into huge trouble just for saying eskimo when visiting the north. --216.106.109.111 21:19, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

There is no derogation in the name itself. There is no problem with being called "eaters of raw meat" unless you have a problem with eating raw meat (which many people do not have). In that case, it is your own point of view problem, not the name's problem. Compare it with the "Adolf" in Adolf Hitler, meaning "Wolf", which, in his parents' view, is probably a brave and heroic creature that they want their son to be, while for other people a wolf is a ruthless and dangerous animal, like Maugrim. Things are offensive only when we take them as offensive, and most of the times this is our own point of view (You can well say that the term "Americans" is offensive because "Amerigo" is actually an Italian person, or that "Chinese" is offensive because it originates in the Qin dynasty where the people were virtually all of Han ethnicity, or that "Indonesia" is offensive because it means "Indian islands"). Eskimo is an established and commonly used term and for that reason we use it in Wikipedia. Aran|heru|nar 13:20, 22 October 2006 (UTC)
Regardless of whether the term is derogatory, I support the suggestion in the section above to merge this article with Inuit. I have three problems with this article: (i) Iniut and Eskimo seems both to refer to the same ethnic groups (or tribes), (ii) the Inuit articles says that Eskimos are a subset of Inuits, while the Eskimo articles says that Inuit is a subset of Eskimo, (iii) the Eskimo article is more a stub than an article. In other words, having to articles is just confusing.Labongo 13:59, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
I have started a thread for discussing the merge in Talk:Inuit#Merge_with_Eskimo. I suggest that the merge discussion continue there.Labongo 09:56, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
I work directly with Innu communities of Northern Quebec, also known as Nunavik.
I am somewhat horrified that the word 'Eskimo' is used to describe the Inuit, in this day and age.
The word 'eskimo' was long abolished by the Canadian government when referring to its Inuit peoples.
'Eskimo' is a Cree word. It means 'eaters of raw meat'. Calling an Inuit an Eskimo, just as calling different First Nations 'tribes', is EXTREMELY insulting. I don't see why there's even any debate in here on usage of the word. Certainly the name should be mentioned, but only to say that it is no longer acceptable :to use it when referring to the Inuit.
How archaic.
My reply to this is also at Talk:Inuit#Merge_with_Eskimo. CambridgeBayWeather (Talk) 12:30, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Deleted from article

I have deleted the following sections from the article. I believe both should be incorporated into the articles about the respective groups. But I am not sure how accurate the information in "New ways of life is" and whether Technology is already covered by the articles. Labongo 13:15, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

/Lifting out and hue shade approaches. (I have moved my answer to this subpage for better readability.) Physis 17:41, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
Perhaps a good principle would be to only add topics that are common for Inuit and Yupik? When doing this we should take into account that the Inuit articles already have a lot of content. For example is it necessary to write a new section about Eskimo mythology, should there be a separate Inuit and Yupik mythology article, or should Inuit_mythology be renamed to Eskimo mythology? My personal opinion is that most of the content should be pushed to the appropriate groups, and that this article should mostly contain summaries and links to to articles. But note that I have very limited knowledge about how similar the Inuit and Yupik are.Labongo 11:33, 16 November 2006 (UTC)
/Eskimo in the Platonic realm (I have moved my answer to this subpage for better readability.) Physis 12:59, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] New ways of life

Russia About 1,500 Eskimos live on the northeastern tip of Siberia. They herd reindeer, hunt walruses and other animals, and produce carvings and other handcrafts for sale. They receive education, housing, and other benefits from the government. See also Siberian Yupik and Sirenik language and also Naukan.

Alaska About 42,000 Eskimos. This figure includes about 8,000 Aleuts, a group of Eskimos who once lived only on Alaska's Aleutian Islands. Today, many Aleuts live on the Alaskan Peninsula, as well as on the Aleutians. The majority of Alaskan Eskimos live in small rural villages and hunt and fish for most of their food. Unemployment in rural areas is common. Federal and state governments provide some assistance and grants to many of the rural villages for education, public utilities and other public services. Until 1976, the US Bureau of Indian Affairs provided centralized boarding schools for rural Alaska Native students and high school graduation rates were very low. Since 1976, small high schools established in rural villages have proven much more successful, and the drop-out rate of Alaskan Natives, including Eskimos, has fallen to half the US national average as of 1985 [1]. The Alaska Native Claims Settlement Act, passed by the United States Congress in 1971, distributed 44 million acres of land in Alaska (approximately 10% of the state) and $962.5 million to Alaska Natives in exchange for the aboriginal rights to the rest of the state, including aboriginal hunting and fishing rights. The Act created 13 regional corporations and over 200 village corporations (literally business corporations) to represent the Alaska Natives (shareholders) and manage and distribute the land and money. Development in northern Alaska since the late 1960's, mostly related to the oil industry, has created some economic opportunity for the Alaska Native corporations and individuals, even as it has threatened some aspects of their traditional lifestyle.

Canada About 25,400 Eskimos. Most of them live in towns in housing provided by the government. They also receive financial aid, health care, and other help from the government. Most Canadian Eskimos cannot find permanent employment. To combat this problem, the government has helped the Eskimos establish commercial fishing and handcraft cooperatives. These organizations have been especially successful in selling soapstone sculpture, which has become increasingly popular in Canada and the United States. Educational opportunities have increased greatly for the Canadian Eskimos since the 1950's, but most students still do not finish high school.

Greenland About 49,300 Eskimos. Almost all these people have mixed Eskimo and European ancestry. But most experts classify them as Eskimos. Most Greenland Eskimos work in towns, chiefly in the fishing industry. Only the Eskimos in northern Greenland still live mainly by hunting seals and continue to follow many of their traditional ways. Most Greenland Eskimos receive less than a high school education, and the government still provides them with housing, health care, and other assistance.

[edit] Technology

The harsh environment forced them to develop sophisticated tools. They used kayaq (a skin-covered one-man-vehicle), and umiaq (a larger boat for transporting women and children and also for whaling). The igloo (snow house) was used in the winter, but not by all groups: some used houses made of peat, driftwood or stone (p. 3 of [2]).

[edit] Notes

  1. ^ Kleinfeld, J. (1985). Alaska's small rural high schools: Are they working?, Fairbanks: University of Alaska Center for Cross-Cultural Studies.
  2. ^
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