Talk:Elazığ/Archive 1

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Armenian citations

I could not find a relation between Elazig and Armenian genocide, which is never accepted by modern Turkish Republic. If you are referring to Armenian sites and historians than you must add similar statements to most of the German+Polish+Italien cities about Holocaust.

I found the sentence as an indication of an anger, which must be related with the writer's possible armenian historical histeria. Armenians betrayed to their state by supporting Russian and French armies against Ottomans. They killed hundreds of thousands of Turkish civilians to justify their population dominancy. What can be the response of a state in 19th century? Armenians are forced to leave to another part of the country. Most of them escaped to France/Australia where they look happy. If they were still in Turkey, they were begging to Europians just to be accepted to EU where most of them are already in now. That is not a genocide but must be an "expulsion". I think the Armenians must understand what they have done is not an acceptable behaviour. If Armenians want to understand what a "genocide" is, then they must read about Holocoust, Holodomor and Ruandan Genocides. Bernard..

What does all of this have to do with the article? If something important happened in this city and it can be cited, it should be noted. --Awiseman 16:54, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

The anon (residing in Istanbul) who posted that message also made this edit. That info is still in the article, but I have commented it out as it needs a source. —Khoikhoi 17:04, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

Elazg is a unofficial Kurdish city

A city which the Kurdish population form the majority.

Source? --Awiseman 19:27, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

Cleaned up

Cleaned up the page, if anybody needs to clarify things, please do, as some was a little hard to understand.

Also, the Catholic Encyclopedia says the kings were Armenian, not Assyrian.[1] --Awiseman 17:18, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

Please keep vandalism away from these pages and do not use here to pour out your hatred.

Where's the vandalism? —Khoikhoi 19:21, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Fix Elazig today section

The Elazig Today section says

"Elazığ is the capital of the Elazığ province. The Armenian Catholic diocese numbers 3000 parishioners, 8 parishes, 6 churches, 3 chapels, 14 stations, and 14 primary schools, chiefly at Kharput-Mezré and Malatia. There are about 72,000 Christians throughout the vilayet, which contains about 600,000 inhabitants. The Armenian Protestants have a large American mission at Kharput, which is the headquarters of all those in Armenia.

Note: The above information is unlikely to be about Elazig today, seeing as all the Armenians of the area were deported in the Armenian Genocide of 1915. The churches and schools written about were destroyed and there would be no community left to fill the 8 parishes written about. Also there are no Armenian Protestants to speak of outside Istanbul, so the notion that they would have a large mission in Elazig is highly suspect. Seeing as Turkey blockades Armenia it would be impossible to have a headquarters for all of Armenia in a separate country that has no contact with it. This "Elazig today" section seems to be talking about a time pre-genocide.[citation needed]"

That needs to be fixed. --Awiseman 18:37, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

Stephen Kinzer serving and "Azeris in Elazığ"

I think the Stephen Kinzer opus has no place here, perhaps in Harput (to be started), but not here. He is profoundly political, not a historian, and the entire article is based -or rather starts- with the confidences of a certain Tahire Cakirbay, 66. There is an expression in Turkish that goes like "Tying one's affairs to 66" (İşi altmış altıya bağlamak), and it bodes nothing well for whoever does it.

This is from the wiki article on Kinzer, in case anyone does not take the link there:

Kinzer was used as an example of media bias by Edward S. Herman and Noam Chomsky in their book Manufacturing Consent. The authors show that Kinzer fails to quote a single person in Nicaragua who is pro-Sandinista and contrast this with polls reporting a 9% support for all the opposition parties taken together. The authors conclude that such a persistent bias can only be explained by the propaganda model.

As for the population, I could understand if mention of Turks and Zazas and Kurds was made for Elazığ, but Azeris seem outlandish to me. I am sure anyone who must have had Azeri roots in Elazığ can fully be qualified as Anatolian Turks by now (I recall that Azeris are also Turks). I do not know where Lexorient holds that statement, but it seems empty to me (and will seem to anyone who has been to Elazığ). And I thought we were to be careful while citing other encyclopedias. Cretanforever

I think it depends on what the Azeris consider themselves. --Awiseman 19:39, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

Ask them! Regards:) Cretanforever

In regards to Kinzer, please see WP:V - The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is thus verifiability, not truth. He appears to be a well-established author and newspaper writer, so it is thus a verifiable source. If you want to counter his views, add appropriately cited material of your own. Feel free to add something from Justin McCarthy, as we did on the Adana article, or something from a Turkish historian or writer if you want. —Khoikhoi 01:28, 10 August 2006 (UTC)