Talk:Dublin Heuston railway station

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[edit] Name

"Dublin Heuston" is the name of the railway station as commonly used by Irish Rail, for instance on its railway maps and printed timetables. Whilst "Heuston Station" is common it is not the proper name of the station or the article, manual of style conventions follow that the name used in the article should match that of the article name and not be different. Theirfore I will revert to "Dublin Heuston". Djegan 00:41, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

Moreover it is almost unheard of for railway stations to include "Station" as part of the proper title, so in any case "Heuston Station" would be better written as "Heuston station", notwithstanding the above. Djegan 00:53, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

I'm not about to get into a discussion or a revert war (which would likely end up at WP:LAME) on the naming, but they refer to it almost exclusively as "Heuston Station Dublin" on announcements on trains and at stations. Stifle 18:49, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

I dont believe that what I am doing is lame, simply ensuring that the title used in the introduction matches the article title and correspondingly matches the proper name, rather than a common name that disregards both. Djegan 19:12, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

I have reverted the title in the introduction to corresspond with the article title, if people disagree then they can submitt a request to change the title. Djegan 19:21, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

For what its is worth, prior to the introduction of the automated train information system on DART/Commuter trains (the 2900 series DMUs and new EMUs), I only ever heard the Dublin terminals being refered to as xxx "Station, Dublin". The automated announcements were the first I heard of them being addressed as "Dublin " xxx. They seem to have been changed to the old format now (though not the LEDs, which still say "Dublin "xxx (probably because there is no space on the external LEDs for the other way).--Rdd 18:12, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

Certainly I agree that is the way that spoken announcements where several years ago. I am not sure what current written signage is in Dublin (as apposed to arrival/departure boards) but certainly in all my travels in Britain and Ireland I have yet to recall a station sign in the form "City Station" when they are simply written "City" and given the addition of the common name when their is more than one station in a city.

Looking on wikipedia the general consensus is that where their are more than one station then the city name should come first (followed by the common name of the station, if their is one, and then "railway station"), thus "Heuston" is written "Dublin Heuston railway station". Whilst their is no policy on wikipedia regarding railway stations (that I can find) I would be very surprised if "Heuston Station" was allowed to stand as it is patently incorrect in English (station should not recieve a capital "s" unless a proper noun, which it is not, unlike Dublin Airport for instance).

It was not until another editor moved these articles until I realised how obvious this was. Certain Irish Rail got (and continues to get) "Pearse Street" incorrect. Djegan 19:28, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

I disagree. While "station" should not have a capital S, station signage is either "Heuston" or "Heuston Station", Iarnród Éireann calls it "Heuston" [1] and all train announcements refer to it "Heuston Station", or "Heuston Station, Dublin". Please do try to establish a consensus supporting your naming before reverting (currently 2 users (67%) supporting "Heuston station", 1 user (33%) supporting "Dublin Heuston"). Stifle 23:54, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

All the written timetables use "Dublin Heuston". In any case, what the "consensus" as your cite above (actually a different user moved the page so its more 50/50 and not 66/33) does not override the article name (thus, for instance "County Derry" is not used first at County Londonderry), as a basic principal the article name should also be used in the introduction prominantly (i.e. firstly) rather than a so called consensus name. I am going to partially revert, if you disagree I suggest you go the route of WP:RM which I will respect, rather than engage in a revert war. Djegan 18:41, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

All the written timetables, route maps, spoken announcements, in train announcements, in train signage, etc uses "Dublin BLAH" as the name. Including Dublin Pearse, Djegan, not Pearse Street. However, the platform signs might not conform with this recent enough change. --Kiand 18:54, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

The platform signs all still read "Connolly Station", "Pearse Station" etc. There are new emergency exit maps just gone up in the last forthnight with "Connolly Station Dublin" on them. Of course, this is the same company which not only managed to put up a timetable with the perhaps forgivable "Pearse Street Station" (fair enough, its sometimes called that), but also one (only taken down in December, and completely unforgivable) which said "Connolly Street Station". Sometimes Irish Rail don't know what their own stations are called... I myself am undecided, "Dublin Connolly" always sounded better to me, but "Connolly Station" is the most consistantly used. Of course I believe Wikipedia policy on this regard is to use the most common name? --Rdd 20:59, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

Agreed on Pearse, so which side of the fence are you on when it comes to this? Of course one of the useful things about "Dublin XXX" is that it makes it very clear that it is a main city station. Djegan 19:40, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

I've seen nothing not using "Dublin XXX" recently. Its not a fad despite what Zoney claims, and its what we should use across the board. --Kiand 23:39, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

I'm semi-happy with the current status; suffice it to say that this is not a WP:RM matter since it doesn't involve moving a page. Stifle 13:55, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Timetable station names

The Iarnród Éireann timetables do not necessarily have the proper names of the stations, people should not set such store by them. Neither are all stations properly signposted (some of the ones renamed in 1966 aren't signposted with the adopted name - I'll admit that only Sinn Féin were particularly concerned about one such station recently - can't remember which one, but it demonstrates the lack of adherence to official names).

As far as I know, the names of a number of DART stations have repeatedly changed on timetables - the "true" name isn't necessarily on timetables or modern signage.

In summary, the station in question is quite obviously named Heuston station, not "Dublin Heuston" - the latter is merely a convenience for informing the less educated as to where the station is.

I am adamant that the same is true for Connolly and Pearse station.

It's not like people called the previous names "Dublin Amien's Street" or "Dublin Westland Row" or "Dublin Kingsbridge".

Why should we adopt a recent non-official Iarnród Éireann timetable fad?

zoney ♣ talk 23:06, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

We could probably make these same points for "Republic of Ireland". Djegan

The primary reason the Wikipedia article is at Republic of Ireland is because Ireland has other meanings. Much as I would like to say that the state has highest precendence, I can't - the island was Ireland long before our state came into existence.

I fail to see how this has any relevance in "Dublin Heuston" vs. "Heuston station". zoney ♣ talk 11:30, 9 March 2006 (UTC)