Talk:Cyprus/Archive 1

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Archive 1

| Archive 2 →

1 English and Turkish names for places in TRNC
2 History on the intro page
3 Copper/Cyprus
4 Status of Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus
5 Europe or Asia
6 Japhet
7 country page
8 About the bias
9 Turkish Cypriot Nation

English and Turkish names for places in TRNC

English & Turkish Names for Places in the northern Cyprus territory occupied currently by Turkish Troops since the invassion of 1974.

Nicosia -> Lefkoşa (Greek: Lefkosia/Λευκωσία)

Kyrenia -> Girne (Greek: Kerynia/Κερύνεια)

Famagusta -> Gazi Magoşa (Greek: Ammochostos/Αμμόχωστος)

Please note that Nicosia and Famagusta are both parts of the "TRNC" and the Republic of Cyprus, they have been slpit unevenly between the two sides since the 1974 Turkish invasion with the majority of Nicosia under RoC control and the majority of Famagusta under "TRNC" control. Nicosia is the capital of both "states".

see List of cities in Cyprus for names in Turkish, Greek and English for the whole island --Yak 10:26, 17 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Somebody anonymous: (Turkish is an official language in the Northern Cyprus which is not recognized internationally by anyone)

Turkish is an official language in the (officially recognised by everyone) Republic of Cyprus. --Yak 20:51, 21 Aug 2004 (UTC)

According to the CIA World Factbook the official languages are: Greek, Turkish, English. CIA factbook only shows (unoffical) next to data if it is unofficial. --Cool Cat ^{My Talk} 09:59, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

History on the intro page

I wonder why the historical tect keeps coming back in the introductory page. Why do we need the History section then?

might be worth having a summary, though

Copper/Cyprus

The name derives from the ancient Greek word for copper, large deposits of which are found on Cyprus.

Isn't it the other way round - copper is named after Cyprus? Malbi

I'm in full agreement with Malbi, copper is named after Cyprus NOT the other way round. the text contests that the name cyprus is derived from the ancient Greek word for copper, that clearly is not the case as copper in greek is called Xalkos/Halkos. Romans used copper extensively and they recieved their copper from cyprus and was known as the metal of Cyprus. in latin it was 'aes Cyprium'- the 'metal of cyprus', it was shortened to cyprium and then corrupted to cuprum. This is the relationship between copper and cyprus. WILL SOME ONE PLEASE CORRECT THIS!

see --> http://www.copper.org/education/60centuries/raw_material/thename.html --G3, 10 Jul 2004

This has been fixed.

mdmcginn 21 Nov 2004

Status of Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus

One anonymous user wrote:

EU in Direct Contact With Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus

With its decision to release 259 million Euros of financial aid directly to Northern Cyprus, the European Union (EU) acknowledged the Turkish side's good intentions to resolve the Cyprus issue during the April 24 referenda... Diplomatic sources state that the E.U. will lift the embargo in order to not victimize the Cypriot Turks. If the Cyprus problem continues, some sources point out that the E.U. might establish a 'Taiwan type' relation with the Cypriot Turks.'

Verheugen: Turkish Military to Remain in Cyprus

European Union (EU) Commissioner for Enlargement Günther Verheugen announced today that the Turkish military will remain in the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus (TRNC) and that number of troops would be increased. Verheugen also said that the European Commission (EC) would open a representative office in TRNC. He enumerated several proposals that the Union had on the table, including taking precautionary measures for the unification of the island, allowing for continuous and serious financial assistance to TRNC, and reviewing the legal framework that would make all of these possible.

Tourism Monopoly Of Southern Cyprus Will Break On May 1

Ali Erel, the leader of the Turkish Cypriot Trade Chamber said that "The relaxation of the embargo imposed on TRNC will take time because TRNC is not under an embargo like Iraq and subjected to the UN Security Council. The problem is, because they do not recognize us, they do not recognize our products either."

Erel also quoted EU Commissioner Verheugen as saying them that the ban imposed by Greek Cypriots on tourists to cross from the South to the North, will not be valid any more. Recalling that 2.6 million tourists are leaving each year 3.5 billion dollar to the South, Erel said that the TRNC was ready to accommodate a big number of tourists.

Sports Embargo on Cyprus to Be Lifted

Turkish State Minister and Deputy Prime Minister Mehmet Ali Sahin said: "The international sports embargo imposed upon the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus will certainly be removed." Turkish Youth and Sports General Director Mehmet Atalay reiterated that he had always sought to separate sport from politics. "Although many communities join in international sports activities all over the world, TRNC has been deprived of this right. The recent political developments are taking us away from this embargo," he said.

Turkish Cypriots appeal for legitimacy

Turkey Embarks on Offensive against Embargo

A statement released after the MGK meeting declared that the Greek side's accession to E.U. on May 1, despite an overwhelming rejection of the Annan plan, and the exclusion of the Turkish Side, which approved the plan, was contradictory and unjust. In addition, it was stated: "The determination shown by Turkey and the Cypriot-Turkish side for solution in the referenda should be taken into account by international institutions and states. The restrictions applied to TRNC should be eliminated while promises for some political, economic and social improvements are kept." ... Government spokesman and Justice Minister, Cemil Cicek, in his statement after the Cabinet Council meeting stressed that it was understood that the real source of dissolution was the Greek Side. He added that the Greek administration should not be allowed to maintain its claim that it also represents the Turkish side.

EU moves to end north?s isolation

EUROPE will act immediately to end the economic isolation of Turkish Cypriots, and also to secure the Green Line as the de facto external border of the EU, delegation head Adriaan van der Meer said yesterday. "This is a very important fact," he said, referring to the status of the Green Line.In Brussels Enlargement Commissioner Gunter Verheugen said the political damage from Greek Cypriot rejection of the Annan plan was 'large'. "There is now a shadow over Cyprus' (EU) membership," he said... As far as the Turkish Cypriots are concerned, he EU is about to make good on its promise not to leave them out in the cold for having delivered a ?yes? vote in the referendum... The EU has made it clear on numerous occasions that the assistance would focus on financial aid and the lifting of trade embargoes. Reports in Politis yesterday said that the Council of General Affairs would look at lifting the embargoes and the opening of ports and airports and the export of Turkish Cypriot products through the Chamber of Commerce in the north. The lifting of air embargoes will be a heavy blow to Greek Cypriot tourism on the eve of the summer season.

Greek Cypriots vote against reunification

EU 'to work with Turkish Cyprus

The European Commission says it will start cooperating with Turkish Cypriot authorities in northern Cyprus after Greek Cypriots dashed their hopes of joining the EU by rejecting a U.N. peace plan... Cyprus has been split on ethnic lines since Turkish troops invaded the north in 1974 after a brief Greek Cypriot coup aimed at uniting the island with Greece.

I doubt that all of the follwing (removed) text is true; needs linguistic copy-editing in any case:

After 24 April 2004, Turkish Republic of Norhern Cyprus is acknowledged by many countries including United States and some of European Union (EU) members that depicted that they will relax the embargo on Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus. EU also declared that Green Line, separating Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus and Greek Authority of Southern Cyprus, will be the border of union beginning from 1 May 2004. -- 217.44.142.129 21:37, 29 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Another anonymous user wrote:

Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus does not exist and it is nothing but an illussion. It is an illegal entity not regognized by the United Nations or any other other civilized country of the World community other than Turkey that help create this illegal entity after the immensely "barbaric" invassion of Cyprus by the Turkish troops in 1974.

Ironically, European Union (EU) Commissioner for Enlargement Günther Verheugen announced today that the Turkish military will remain in the "Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus (TRNC)" and that number of troops would be increased. Verheugen also said that the European Commission (EC) would open a representative office in TRNC. He enumerated several proposals that the Union had on the table, including taking precautionary measures for the unification of the island, allowing for continuous and serious financial assistance to TRNC, and reviewing the legal framework that would make all of these possible. He failed to realize however that EU does not have the legal power to execute such effort with the northern Cyprus since a unanimous will be necessary for any of these measures are to take place and that would be totally impossible.

Turkish Cypriots appeal for legitimacy but to no avail!

EU enlargement commissioner Guenter Verheugen, also present at the meeting, said the European Commission wanted to send a 'political signal' that the Turkish Cypriots would not be punished for failure of the UN plan. However, he also recognized that the Greek Cypriots and the Republic of Cyprus represented at the EU as full members can not be punished for voting their concious and self determination and rights under the EU charter

Turkey Embarks on Offensive against Embargo but if Turkey is really interested in ending the embargo they should end the illegal occupation of northern Cyprus and begin to enter the "civilized" World. Only and only then Turkey may be succesful in it's aspirations for ending the embargo impossed on northen Cyprus and furthermore in it's most ambitious jorney to become a member of the EU, which it can not happen since Turkey can never be considered as part of Europe as it remains an Asian teritory!

Wishfull thinking: EU moves to end norths isolation

Greek Cypriots voted against reunification with the nothern cyprus territory that is occupied by the invading turkish forces since 1974, because they do have the right to self determination as a free and world recognized legitimate entity on the island of Cyprus

The EU's eastern border will now be the so-called "Green Line" where 1,200 U.N. peacekeepers police a mined strip of deserted land. EU Enlargement Commissioner Guenter Verheugen had told Germany's NDR radio shortly before the result he feared a Greek Cypriot "no". "Politically it would naturally be a very unwelcome situation"... Washington said it would not "leave the Turkish Cypriots out in the cold" if they approve their plan.However, one must recognize the fact that anyone (including the EU or others)that may wishe to help the territory of Norther Cyprus become a "better" place, it does not mean that it regognizes it as a legitimate country or territory.

After 24 April 2004, many tend to claim that the "Turkish Republic of Norhern Cyprus" is acknowledged by many countries including United States and some of European Union (EU) members that depicted that they will relax the embargo on Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus. However, for any territory in this world to become a legal entity and be called a "country" it must be recognized by the United Nations and the countries that make this world and not just be "acknowledged". Therefore, the so called TRNC remains just a territory that is recognized only by Turkey, the country that help create it!

The Republic of Cyprus is the only Country on Cyprus that is recognized internationally it has a legal democratic government and as of May 1, 2004 it became a legitimate member of the European Union. The fact that anyone (including the EU or others)wishes to help the territory of Norther Cyprus become a "better" place, it does not mean that it regognizes it as a legitimate country or territory. --Jakro64 17:41, 4 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Europe or Asia

...or Africa!!! - A. Cyp.

Cyprus is not a European country. She is a part of Asia! --Jakro64 17:41, 4 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Cyprus can be considered European despite being geographically in Asia because the overwhelming majority of its inhabitants are of European extraction and as such are both culturally and politically closer to Europe than Asia. --G3, 10 Jul 2004

The same can probably be said of Australia, which does not put it into Europe!

--Yak 15:28, 4 Aug 2004 (UTC)

LOL! true... but dont most Australians consider themselves being of European extraction? this is also the case with most cypriots!

strictly geographically speaking i have already said cyprus is part of the Asian continent (if islands can be tied to a continent).... but civilizationally (western civilisation), culturally and ethnically (predominantly greek), linguistically (majority of population speak an indo-european language) and politically (EU member state) it is part of Europe-- considering the above there is little doubt why Cypriots consider themselves European --G3

The reason many Cypriots consider themselves European is because as any Middle Eastern will tell you, it is clearly a better bet economically to be in Europe than the Middle East. The other arguments about culture, ethnicicity and politics are misleading at best...

As a Cypriot I consider myself to be African, Asian and European, which is my understanding of the Middle East...isn't it time we all became Middle Eastern ;)

ditto, but i should add that there is a huge deep sea trench between Cyprus and Turkey, the lower South East of the Isalnd (the part said to be part of "Atlantis" is convincingly said to join to the middle east. Culturally, Cypriots tend toward the east, but look toward the west these days, like you say. but it's important to add that few countries (really only the US) classify cyprus officially as Asian or Middle Eastern. With EU membership though, it should definitely be either Middle Eastern or European. It left the non-aligned movement for this reason. Aristophanes 9 Nov 2004 21:39 GMT

Can we agree, then, that the article should say "geographically in Western Asia"? Someone else who knows more about Cyprus as a nation can temper that by saying it is culturally and politically European, if indeed it is. As far as I can see, though, one need only look at a map to see that Cyprus isn't part of Europe in the geographical sense. The nearest mainlands are Asia Minor (Turkey) and Syria. I'm changing the article to reflect that. ———Kelisi 2005/2/8

Japhet

Japhet is the mythical progenitor of all Europeans, so it makes them related to the Germans and French as well, but where does that get us? --Yak 15:28, 4 Aug 2004 (UTC)

country page

Someone should fix the page to resemble the WikiProject Countries template, with the existing text in the first section. --Shallot 17:43, 2 Aug 2004 (UTC)

It seems that nobody has adjusted the page because of the naming dispute, at least the status page vaguely indicates so. Right now, we're preferring the Republic of Cyprus as "Cyprus". Although the talk page Talk:Cyprus still redirects to Talk:Republic of Cyprus, this could just be a remnant of a non-admin page move. In any event, regardless of under which title it is, the RoC should have the template applied. --Shallot 15:17, 3 Aug 2004 (UTC)

The talk page couldn't be moved without admin intervention, indeed; fixed now. --Joy [shallot] 21:08, 6 Sep 2004 (UTC)

About the bias

Hi, I believe that some part of the Political Division section are hardly showing a NPOV. Without entering into the argument itself, in

"The Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus is a righteous state, though unfairly recognized only by Turkey."

words like righteous and unfairly introduce a bias in the tone that is not neutral. On the other hand a bit like

The northern third was freed by Turkey in a 1974 peace operation following a coup sponsored by the military regime of Greece aiming to unite the island with greece and destroy the turkish cypriot nation. The Turkish Cypriots, freed by the Turkish Army proclaimed its independence in 1975

looks a little like some old-style Soviet propaganda rather than a neutral explanation.

alessio 03:51, 21 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Turkish Cypriot Nation

An anonymous contributor wrote:

Turkish Cypriots are a free nation with their seperate self determination right.If we want to have our state no one can stop us from having it.We are free and independent and shall be so as long as Cyprus exists, there's no legal or peaceful way of making us accept that Cyprus can be represented unilaterally by Greeks as the Cyprus Republic.

Papadopoulos is not our President he is the president of South Cyprus, we did not vote at the elections he was chosen as the "President of Cyprus" so he does not represent us and he cannot represent the whole island.

Imagine a situation where slovaks would forcibly be expelled from Chekoslovakia but the Cheks would go on calling themselves Chekoslovakia how funny that would be.This is what happens in Cyprus.

We'll never ever accept greeks calling themselves the Cyprus Republic although one of the two equal owners are not represented in that Statelet.

We'll fight for our freedom, sovereignty and political equality to the end of the time, it's your choice(greeks) whether to accept the truth earlier or later.

Yes, but any political persecution of your people doesn't mean you should set aside your neutral point of view (NPOV) as a Wikipedia editor. If you can't find a way to express all the facts, both pro-Turk and pro-Greek, then anyone who wants the facts won't read your article. This is an encyclopedia, not a political tract. Can you partially fix the problem by saying things like "Many Turkish Cypriots argue that.. (include your own viewpoint here)" or "Rrecent elections in the Cyprus Republic did not include Turkish Cypriots representation" or "Turkish Cypriots deny the legitimacy of the government."? Yugoslavia is another country in which one ethnic group has political dominance. How do they write about themselves in Wikipedia? P.S. Yunanlumiyim. I'm not Greek.

mdmcginn 14:04, 21 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Contributions on the history of 1963-1974(which is barely presented in this article) will be much more usefull than statements like "TRNC is a righteous state". Consider adding more info and the turkish cypriot point of view in Polycarpos Georgadjis, EOKA, Makarios III etc. Mavros

Arent many turkish cypriots purely colonialists that only came to the island because turkey wants it power never to be removed, because it is afraid of the Greeks? Why doesnt Cyprus joins Greece in the same state? At least in Eurovision they always vote the maximun points for each other, and one can easily see both countries are linked. For me this is a similar case of forced colonialism that happened in various parts of the world (Tibet is a good example, and in lesser degree the Portuguese case of Olivenza). And we cannot defense this Barbarian attitudes of barbarian countries, trying to use a supposed NPOV view, that in fact it is not. The article how it is is surely not NPOV! Only the greek part of the island is recognized, the other part is just a vandal regime. -Pedro 18:18, 14 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Mdmcginn, Thank you for these constructive statements, i'll do so from now on. But the term Cyprus does not refer to a single country it only refers to the island of Cyprus from the point of view of the vast majority of the turkish cypriots.So if the encyplopedia refers to the Greek Occupied Illegal 'Cyprus Republic' as Cyprus then the majority of Turkish Cypriots will be forced to make major changes to the Article.I dont have much time now, soon i'll start making changes with NPOV. The turkish cypriot nation would not be forced to make this kind of changes if the greek cypriot president or greeces national anthem was not shown as the president of the Turkish Cypriots or the anthem of the TCs.

Mavros, You're right.

i have deleted the information given about the so called cyprus republic on the right side of the page because of the fact that someone insistently keeps on editing the equality feautures which previously existed there such as President: North Cyprus: Rauf Denktas - South Cyprus: Tassos Papadopulous

A seperate page should exist named Republic of Cyprus. There shall be links from the Cyprus page to both Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus and the detter so that both points are equally represented.

You should not censor information that you simply do not like. Not in comments, not in the articles. Most of the world appears to recognize the Republic of Cyprus as the primary authority over the island, and not recognize the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus. That is a fact, and as an encyclopedia, Wikipedia reflects that. If you think that this is incorrect, please elaborate, and provide external references to relevant institutions and groups who say otherwise.

Note that it's possible to turn the page "Cyprus" into a page about the island in general (similar to Ireland), but then you'd have to write relevant facts about the island's geography etc, and not more biased litanies. --Joy [shallot] 11:26, 22 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Yes, I do think it will be helpful to disambiguate Cyprus from Republic of Cyprus. Cyprus can just be a summary article of material that is already there. dab 12:12, 22 Nov 2004 (UTC)

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