Talk:Count Dooku

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Contents 1 Power 2 Undetected vandalism 3 Categorization 4 Behind the Scenes??? 5 Ataru in Dooku? 6 Please Verify the Following 7 Bias towards Yoda 8 Tyranus or Dooku? 9 Height 10 Deletion 11 Deletion from Category: Fictional Racists 12 Dooku in Video Games

[edit] Power

I think that Count Dooku is less powerful then master Yoda. Yoda could win the fight if he would not save Anakin and Obi. --Anon.

Perhaps he is, though I see little reason to point this out in the article. Further more I don't find it advisable to base that assumption on the fight in question for many reasons. One could argue that the fight was a stalemate. I know it is the fan concencus that Yoda "Kicked Ass" so to speak, but if he had really been so victorious surely he would have won the battle proper despite Dooku's distraction tactic. The question of who is more powerful can not be answere by one fight. -- Kikimad 01/05/2006

Kikimad is right. Saying 'Yoda was clearly the superior fighter' based on that fight (in which Dooku held his own, and, may I point out, did technically win - he escaped) is an opinion, which really shouldn't be there. -- 2nd Anon.

[edit] Undetected vandalism

Why, precisely, does this article include Dooku ordering a "Cum-Shot"???

Because some asses enjoy vandalizing Wikipedia. I've removed it. --Maru (talk) Contribs 00:00, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Categorization

I've been categorizing; and I am torn: should I add the Category:Dark Jedi to Dooku? The article is not clear as to whether Dooku went Sith immediately, or whether his studies in the archive corrupted him into a Dark Jedi and he later became a Sith. --Maru (talk) 01:32, 5 October 2005 (UTC)

Any objections to me categorizing this fellow under Category:Fictional racists?--Lenin & McCarthy 20:43, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Behind the Scenes???

The "Behind the Scenes" segment is pretty interesting and well written, but I don't think it belongs in the article on Count Dooku. We should delete it from this article and place it in Christopher Lee's bio.

Any thoughts? Ramsquire 20:58, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Ataru in Dooku?

Where can you find Dooku mastering Ataru? Please post it up or the section should be removed. All i could find is Dooku mastered Makashi. Darth Kevinmhk 04:21, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Please Verify the Following

The section "Lightsaber Training" has no verifiable source.

• Dooku learned Ataru during early life - No source support it as far as i concern
• Dooku second only to Yoda: Debatable
• Dooku tried to pass Form II to Jinn - Again no source
• Anakin always used Form V
• No source indicated Dooku further train his Form II during the war

I have checked the following sources:

• EP2 AOTC Novel
• EP3 ROTS Novel
• EP2 + EP3 Visual Dictionaries
• Wookieepedia: Dooku's page, Yoda's page and all the seven forms' pages
• Labyrinth of Evil
• Yoda: Dark Rendezvous
• The Cestus Deception
• Shatterpoint
• Republic Comic series up to Issue 81
• Jedi Comic the whole series
• Star Wars.com Databanks
• Star Wars Insider 62 (Lightsaber Combat)

It should be removed from the article if no one can provide the source. Darth Kevinmhk 16:21, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Bias towards Yoda

Ok, this a a re-occuring theme that I believe should be dealt with. A lot of articles refer to Yoda as being "the most powerful swordsman" I find this to be highly debatable. How can one be sure of this? Personally I believe Mace to be a better swordsman and Luke to be just as good at controlling the force, ie when he is Grand Jedi Master in the New Jedi Order. So comments like;

"His mastery of Form II indeed made him arguably the greatest swordsman of the Jedi Order (second only to Yoda, who was the greatest swordsman ever in the galaxy.)"

I believe should be removed or even made more subtle to;

"His mastery of Form II made him a great swordsman, rivaling some of the Order's best combatant's including Yoda."

This negates the somewhat bias opinion. Also it doesn't say he is better, it simply states he was a match for Yoda. My personal opinion is that Dooku could have won that fight, simply because Makashi is a much more suited form of combat for duelling than Ataru. Note: Anakin was using Form V which is also based on duelling when he killed Dooku on the Invisible Hand.

So yes, just something I think should be verified. I noticed a couple of people agree with me, as seen in previous topics above. If at the least simply add in argurably so, "His mastery of Form II indeed made him arguably the greatest swordsman of the Jedi Order (second only to Yoda, who was (argurably) the greatest swordsman ever in the galaxy.)

--Black Hope

"perhaps the greatest lightsaber master the Jedi Order has ever seen" (refering to Yoda) was mentioned in Fightsaber: Jedi Lightsaber Combat article in Insider 62. I know there was the word perhaps, but still, Dooku's name did not appear as another perhaps :) Anyway, Yoda / Sidious are the greatest KNOWN master of Form IV; a healthy Ani/Vader can get a level 9, as strong as Yoda & Sidious (Nick Gillard's words); plus Mace Windu become a unique and powerful swordsman with Vaapad; and while Dooku's Form II mastery is great, he cannot stand against strength move; Obi-Wan, a level 8 Form III master, use "simple is better than complex" and "perfect defense ensure safety" to deal with the other crazily powerful swordsman. In my opinion, the 6 of them are the greatest swordsbeings in the old Jedi Order, although Yoda/Sidious/Ani are arguably the better in the 6. Darth Kevinmhk 03:53, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

Yes Lucasarts has officially stated before that Darth Sidous and Yoda are just one step below the best lightsaber rating. No one is at the best rating though. Jedi6-(need help?) 03:55, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

Yup, both Homing Beacon and Nick Gillard had said so. Thus, the article favoring Yoda a little more is arguably justified. Darth Kevinmhk 03:58, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

Points taken. I'm just a edgy on it all. Sure Yoda/Sidious might be the best users of Ataru, but its not the best for lightsaber duelling either. But yes I see the points, one thing however the article says "second only to Yoda". I find that rather inaccurate to, taking Mace, Anakin and Obi-Wan (all at their peaks in episode III). I just think it all contradicts itself a little. Everyone has their opinions on things. Personally I see Mace and Obi-Wan being the better duelests. Still Majority rules :) so you guys are correct. --Black Hope

[edit] Tyranus or Dooku?

Vader has a different article than Anakin Skywalker, and Sidious has a different article than/soft redirect to Palpatine... Should there be a soft redirect for Darth Tyranus as well, since the fact that he's a Sith Lord isn't revealed until the end of Episode II? TTE 02:06, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

Nah. There isn't a real split in characters like for Anakin and Vader, and Sidious is a soft-redirect simply because apparently a fair number of people don't realize that Senator Palpatine == the evil Sith Emperor Palpatine/Darth Sidious. --maru (talk) contribs 22:31, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Height

The IMDB lists Christopher Lee's height as 6'5", not 6'4". Is Dooku supposed to be shorter, is this article wrong, or is the IMDB wrong? 70.50.55.19 21:27, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

Well maybe if Lee's grown since he played Count Dooku?

Anon

[edit] Deletion

I am going to delete this from the category Film villains because all sw villains are placed in the sub category star wars villains

[edit] Deletion from Category: Fictional Racists

I've deleted the category fictional racists from this article. Since there is no evidence of Dooku being a racist. In EP II, he worked with a diverse cast of aliens and humans, which would not support such a characterization. Ramsquire 23:15, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

You haven't read the Episode III novelization have you? It explictly states that he hated non-human species. Sure he was willing to work with them, but it certainly didn't mean he liked them. --Spencer "The Belldog" Bermudez | (Complain here) 08:02, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

Like most people, I just watch the movies, but if there is something in the novelization about him hating alien species, add it to the article. I don't want to get into an argument about whether the novelization is canon and other such issues. Ramsquire 17:31, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

It's already there. See the biography paragraph. --Spencer "The Belldog" Bermudez | (Complain here) 19:49, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

My mistake, I'll re-add the cat. Ramsquire 20:52, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

The SW films take precedent over Expanded Universe content. And in the films, Dooku is seen interacting with many alien races and no proof is shown of any racism.

The proof is shown in the Episode III novelization. Nothing in the films proves he is not a "racist." Jon Hart 18:03, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

___ That's something that didn't make any sense to me at all. That seems more like what the writers of the books wanted than what the wrters of the films wanted.

George Lucas went over the Episode III novelization line by line. Jon Hart 18:03, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Got a source for that assertion? Cheers --DarthBinky 18:06, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

http://boards.theforce.net/authors_artists/b10347/5816889/p46 - ". . . the REVENGE OF THE SITH adaptation has finally gone through its revision (including painstaking line-editing by Mr. Lucas Himself, who apparently wanted to make sure I didn't screw anything up) . . ." Jon Hart 23:13, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Outstanding! --DarthBinky 00:36, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Dooku in Video Games

Should there be anything about his appearances in Star Wars Battlefront II? I just noticed it was missing and wondered if it was revelant to the topic. Whetstone333 21:30, 18 November 2006 (UTC)