Talk:Convoy PQ-17

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Shipwreck-related priority open tasks: Contents 1 To Do 2 Done 3 Origin of supply 4 Finnish radio intelligence 5 SS John Witherspoon [edit] To Do Shipwrecks Clean up typos Improve Grammer Add any additions if needed Discuss disired additions Cattewater Wreck Needs expansion [edit] Done Shipwrecks Re-wrote the first paragraph Cleaned up Types of Shipwrecks it felt a bit jumbled Cattewater Wreck Started the article

[edit] Origin of supply

PQ-17 was a convoy supplying the USSR... from where? The US, presumably.

No, Iceland. PQ indicated the Iceland - North Russia route from September 1941 to December 1942, then JW. See [1]. Folks at 137 22:14, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

A while back there was a conversation about this on Talk:Arctic convoys of World War II. Iceland was used as a gathering point for most convoys. Others started from various North American and British locations. Folks at 137 23:01, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

See the article on David Irving--I believe the majority of his work has been discredited. Someone ought to make clear what is known and what is controversial, if possible. --Tpcraven 03:15, 26 July 2005 (UTC)

Have look at the Wiki page on Irving. Folks at 137 22:14, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

David Irving. Great, just great. Don't know what to trust in that work. (SEWilco 21:31, 8 December 2006 (UTC))

Irving's book does use footnotes which are linked to 15 pages of notes. It at least may provide direction to a primary source, so reported facts can be confirmed. (SEWilco 05:25, 10 December 2006 (UTC))

PQ-17 had supplies from the U.S. The preceding QP convoy contained a gold payment from Russia for the material. Ah, here it is: HMS Edinburgh's Final Voyage (SEWilco 21:31, 8 December 2006 (UTC))

And Irving returns to in this issue also although indirectly. His father survived the Edinburgh sinking but left the family. (SEWilco 05:22, 9 December 2006 (UTC))

[edit] Finnish radio intelligence

AFAIK Germany got the information on PQ-17 from the Finnish radio intelligence.

I agree. This information was published in Finland in the early 1980s. The only information in Wikipedia on Finnish radio intelligence is on Operation Stella Polaris, the evacuation of the organization to Sweden and the USA. -- Petri Krohn 15:25, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] SS John Witherspoon

This vessel is said to have turned back early in the convoy's voyage due to ice damage. Later in the narrative it is sunk by a U-Boat as part of the convoy. These two facts are not incompatible; but there needs to be an explanation, if only a sentence to the effect that the Witherspoon rejoined the convoy, explaining whether the Witherspoon sped up to catch the convoy, or the convoy slowed down for the Witherspoon, assuming that the Witherspoon caught up with the convoy at all. -Ashley Pomeroy 23:15, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

According to Irving's book, the Witherspoon was a part of the convoy until sunk. Her convoy position was in the southern rear section, just ahead of the southernmost rescue ship. List of Liberty ships by hull number, 1 shows her as hull 31, sunk during this operation. Irving says the Liberty ship Richard Bland holed on Iceland rocks and returned to port. Early on June 29, four ships got serious damage from ice; the SS Exford returned to port, while the Gray Ranger was slowed to 8 knots. According to one online tale[2] the Exford hit ice on June 29, although the teller thought that was after the scatter order. I'll replace the Witherspoon mention in the article with Exford. (SEWilco 06:01, 9 December 2006 (UTC))