Talk:Cedarville University
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[edit] Drivel
This article is so full of propaganda drivel that it's barely even worth existing (and even that's debatable). It is a series of lists dressing up Cedarville as some sort of paradise of a college. Here's my own list. A list of topics that would actually make some sense in this sort of an article.
- History of Campus Development
- History of Presidents
- History of Founding
- Cedarville In-jokes
- An unbiased look/list of the rules (Chapel, curfew, dress code, etc.)
- Sports History/Statistics
That way some high school senior can get a real perspective of the school instead of being fed more polished up "facts."
Wikipedia is not a soapbox. This article serves as an advertisement rather than a objective look at Cedarville University. 131.238.229.154 28 June 2005 21:06 (UTC)
The previous Wikipedian (131.238.229.154) is absolutely right. In fact, if you visit Cedarville's website, the content was lifted directly from the "About Us" section. The changes made, though major, are an attempt to return NPOV and remove the marketing fluff. dkennert-7/11/05
You're stating the obvious, as your 'discovery' didn't require much sleuthing. Many statements on Harvard's wiki, for example, are lifted from harvard.edu, as school officials have campus data that cannot be obtained from an outside source - hence the revert. Structural edits to the page can be made, along with objective views of the school, however, removing multiple sections of the page simply because you don't like them accomplishes even less. Further, if you are cannot confirm your claims, do not vandalize the page with removed sections and added statements along the lines of "compulsory public service," which are absolutely false. -Gump (7/12/05)
Here's what I was attempting to do: I'm a CU grad, and stumbled upon the CU wiki entry. I was concerned that the page had a NPOV banner on it. I read the talk and thought the previous Wikipedian had a point. In fact, recalling the content of CU's website, realized that I had read the information before, so I went and checked. No grand sleuthing performed and none claimed. Instead, it was just a statement of fact. It seems to me that CU’s website is the place for the sales pitch, not Wikipedia, especially if that sales pitch is going to be watered down by a NPOV banner. Interestingly, though “statements” from Harvard’s wiki entry may be taken from their web page, it is not lifted in toto, like CU’s. Hence, your revert is based on an apples to oranges comparison.
Further, I did not remove “multiple sections.” I renamed sections to be less bias – and condensed where the section itself lacked objectivity (i.e., “Spiritual Growth”). Additionally, the "added statements" are not false -- I had to do my "voluntary service" just like every other student. They even highlight the "voluntary service" in their version of the wiki entry -- "volunteering for service in any of over 150 local and worldwide ministries such as. . . ." In my time at the 'ville the only voluntary part of service was choosing the ministry in which I participated. My participation in one of the approved services was never an option. In fact, it was compulsory . . . as were the Bible classes, as were daily chapel services, as were church services on Sunday and mid-week (we had to fill out a sheet every Monday!). Have these policies changed? If so, when? And, if so, I think an interesting section (and appropriate for Wikipedia) to add to this entry would be a history of Cedarville, including the “years of compulsory service.”
The assertion that my changes were vandalism is quite misplaced. In fact, in the spirit of Wikipedia, I was attempting to correct what appeared to be a pretty straight forward NPOV problem by the presentation of a less marketing driven statement about CU. Perhaps the way to do that is to comprise – remove the “official” Cedarville sanctioned language (they don’t own the content here) and come to agreement on what which words dilute objectivity (e.g., “Outstanding”).
dkennert-07/12/05
Interesting discussion- allow my two cents. First of all, a CU graduate from 1993, I was not surprised to see the marketing machine of CU in force here in Wikipedia. While the sales pitch of CU may in one sense be objective, the actually been-there-lived-it ojbectivity is very different. For instance, the "voluntary service" experience may, as mine did, prove to be excellent in and of itself. YET, the regulations placed upon each a paying adult to perform or attend religious services, with definite discipline if not documented correctly, left me eyeing the term "voluntary" with skepticism.
The flip side of the marketing spin is the rigid lines of thought that evidences itself in a dogma that pervades every facet of life at the 'ville. As long as this dogma is completely accepted and never questioned (irony- see definition of University) either in the classroom or dormitory, the student will find peaceful solidarity with the "objective" statements made in Wikipedia.
I am not saying that this is necessarily wrong, but should be advertised as being just as "objective" as the sqaure footage of the campus.
einzig- 07/16/05
[edit] NPOV edit on 12 August 2005
I've just made a major revision of this article. It was basically a complete rewrite because the original was a copyright violation from the University's website (and subsequently full of POV). This new article's still missing information on its history, and the athletics subsection could use a little expansion. -D. Wu 05:12, 12 August 2005 (UTC)
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Nice rewrite....question: is CU SBC? I thought they were GARBC -- when did that change? dkennert 8/12
- Cedarville's more closely related now to the SBC than the GARBC, although it retains a partnership with both. It joined SBC November 2002. I've added the relevant information. -D. Wu 03:35, 13 August 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Motto question
When I was there, the official motto of the school was "For the Word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ." A search of there website yields little when looking for a motto, although this copy of a program (http://www.cedarville.edu/inauguration/inauguration.pdf) notes that the Baptist Bible Institute took the surrounded the Presbyterian seal (Cedarville was originally Presbyterian) with "For the Word..." Did the motto change to the hearts/minds/friends/service when Cedarville went from a college to a university? dkennert 13 Aug 05 @ 19:30
[edit] History Section
Need to ferret out the details about Cedarville as a Presbyterian school, Baptist Bible Institute, and its years as a college prior to it being a university. dkennert 13 Aug 05 @ 19:50
[edit] GARBC
Cedarville is no longer affiliated with the GARBC. The GARBC dropped their support mostly because of its affliation with the SBC. I don't really know the details however, it would be nice if someone who does could edit the article. -2004 Cedarville Grad, 8-19-05
from the GARBC website:
"A motion was made and seconded that the Council of Eighteen present the reasons for the decision not to associate with Cedarville University with special attention given to the Biblical statements and principles that warrant such a decision; that this presentation be made publicly to the fellowship of churches at the 2006 GARBC Annual Conference; and that messengers at the Conference be given the opportunity by vote to express their support for or dissent from the Council's presentation. The motion further directed that copies of the Council's presentation be sent to all Fellowship churches not less than 90 days prior to the beginning of the 2006 GARBC Annual Conference. The motion passed."
This motion was dated June 30 -- the language implies that "the decicion not to associate" is a done deal, and now the leaders of the GARBC are proceeding to a fuller explanation of that decision before next summer. dkennert 9/12/2005 @ 15:30
GARBC considers fraternization with the Southern Baptists of Ohio to be "inconsistent with the Articles of Faith as adopted and practiced historically by the GARBC." An earlier example of their distancing themselves from Cedarville can be seen here: http://www.garbc.org/einfo/archives/2005/09/a_letter_from_t_1.html DaveGC 02/16/2006
