Talk:Carson City, Nevada
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Carson City and interstate highways? Is it just me or does all the information about "carson city not having an interstate highway" not appropriate for such a prominent place in the article. I agree that this information is valid for an article on Carson City, but belongs farther down, perhaps in a transportation section or trivia. Any objections to moving it? davemeistermoab 2 May 2006
Wondering how to edit this U.S. County Entry?
The WikiProject U.S. Counties standards might help.
Hmmm... I don't know about the claim that Carson City is an independent city is correct. I've been under the impression that it is a consolidated city/county much like San Francisco. I'm trying to find a source (either city charter or NRS) that will back one or the other of these views. --- Sdp 04:57, 19 Aug 2003 (UTC)
- Ok here is the Carson City Charter (http://www.leg.state.nv.us/CityCharters/CtyCCCC.html .) I'm going to edit according to what it says. --- Sdp 05:03, 19 Aug 2003 (UTC)
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- For future reference this is the paragraph that I'm using to defend the independent city -> consolidated city-county change that I am about to make.
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- Any powers expressly granted by this charter are in addition to any powers granted to a city or county by the general law of this state. All provisions of Nevada Revised Statutes which are applicable to counties or generally to cities (not including chapter 265, 266 or 267 of NRS) or to both and which are not in conflict with the provisions of this charter apply to Carson City.
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Carson City is not just a consolidated city/county, it is clearly an independent city. This is what the U.S. Census Bureau defines it as, because its what the State of Nevada defines it as. See http://www.bartleby.com/69/90/C02790.html where it says "Ormsby co. was put out of existence, making Carson City an independent city, not part of any co. and statistically having county equivalent status." See also Google at [1] for the 340 pages where both "Carson City" and "independent city" are mentioned. radiojon 05:52, 2003 Aug 19 (UTC)
- Ok there is clearly some confusion in the Wikipedia as to what is/isn't an independent city. From the independent city page
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- a consolidated city-county ... is both a city and a county under the laws of the State
- Carson City clearly fits this definition from the above City Charter. The Census Bureau has a logical but different definition
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- An incorporated place that has combined its governmental functions with a county or sub-county entity but contains one or more other incorporated places that continue to function as local governments within the consolidated government.
- This is confusing to me (and possibly others) because the Census Bureau defines Carson City as an independent city while some of the Carson City government documents that I've found refer to themselves as a consolidated city-county. And the Wikipedia definition from the independent city node seems to muddy the issue.
- So I guess what I'm checking is that the Wikipedia stands by the definitions made by the US Census Bureau on this sort of issue. And if that is the case then the proper definition for what these entries are needs to be in the independent city and consolidated city-county. Correct? --- Sdp 07:13, 19 Aug 2003 (UTC)
I think the most practical definition of independent city is a city which is not defined (under state law and constitution) to be a part of any county. I suppose that consolidation would be a necessary step toward creating one though.
A true consolidated city/county would be like in Miami, which has for a very long time had a unified government with Dade County – to the point that the county name was changed by vote of the city/county council and referendum of the voters to Miami-Dade County. What makes this different is that other incorporated cities exist within the county, outside of Miami, including Homestead and Miami Beach. Based upon what Florida allows, these cities are autonomous and can pass their own laws and zoning, while responsibilities that Florida specifically delegates to the counties only (even within the cities) are still handled by the combined Miami city and Miami-Dade county government.
Another situation is at the other corner of the state, where Jacksonville incorporated all of Duval County in 1968, and the two governments were combined. In this case, there aren't even any other city governments to consider, but technically Florida still considers the city and county as separate entitites, even though they are jointly run.
In Nevada, by whatever agreement, law, and/or state constitution, the state considers that Ormsby County no longer exists at all, therefore automatically making Carson City an independent city. Apparently this is a legal distinction or necessity in that state. Otherwise, it would be the same as Jacksonville, though I'm sure Florida has its own legalities, either not defining or not allowing: (1) a county to be abolished, or (2) the formation of an independent city.
In Virginia, every city is independent, even those which are the county seat of a county (oddly enough).
The ultimate example of an independent city is Washington, D.C., which is the only city in the country that is not an any state at all — it's strictly the city and federal governments. This is probably the distinction that most states use, simply a city under the state with no county "middle-man" in between.
In the end, it's essentially a matter of semantics and what each state's law defines. Typically, counties are extensions of the state, with responsibilites such as voter registration and elections, public schools, public health, enforcement of state laws, and collection of sales taxes; while cities are more autonomous, and have powers of annexation and sometimes ETJ which counties do not.
-- radiojon 08:21, 2003 Aug 19 (UTC)
- Ok this is making more sense to me now. Based on your explanation -- which is much clearer and helpful than the text of the independent city page -- I may make some edits to that page clarifying what is meant by independent city. It's also a good start for a consolidated city-county page. --- Cheers, Sdp 14:47, 19 Aug 2003 (UTC)
Miami and Miami-Dade County, Florida are not consolidated. Miami-Dade County was renamed from Dade County to highlight the fact that the entire area, not just the City of Miami, is often identified as Miami ("to acknowledge the international name recognition of Miami"- from miamidade.gov link below). Miami-Dade County is made up of 30 municipalities and an extensive unincorporated area. The City of Miami is still a separate municipality within, and the seat of, Miami-Dade County. Miami-Dade County acts in many ways as a city government, calling its executive "mayor" and providing fire, police and other traditional "city" services to many areas of the county, including some municipalities and all unincorporated areas. However, the City of Miami still has its own mayor, police, fire, etc. (http://www.miamidade.gov/info/about/government.htm )(http://www.ci.miami.fl.us ) 21 Oct 2003.
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