Talk:Cannabis (drug)

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Archives:

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• Talk:Cannabis/Archive 2
• Talk:Cannabis (drug)/Archive 1
• Talk:Cannabis (drug)/Archive 2

Taken from Talk:cannabis to explain the existence of this article. Please see this and Talk:Cannabis/Archive 1 Talk:Cannabis/Archive 2 for the sources and discussions of this article. Squiquifox 18:11, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Contents 1 United States v. Oakland Cannabis Buyers' Cooperative 2 Photo Caption 3 Cost 4 cannabis species 5 biased overview? 6 Method of Action 7 Fuel 8 Marijuana 9 vaporization 10 External links 11 Effects On The Brain 12 List of effects 13 Fertility 14 Aftereffects 15 Physical Effects? 16 Long term memory loss 17 Medicinal use 18 List of effects 19 Alternative names 20 Large revert 21 Khoi and Tobacco as burning aids 22 Tagged 23 Physiologicial Effects 24 Legality 25 Cannabinoid Receptors 26 merged? 27 #1 U.S. Cash Crop 28 Preparations for human consumption: Smoking 29 Legal status in Alaska 30 strains? 31 Requested move 31.1 Survey 31.2 Discussion 32 Requested move, additional comments 33 Eating raw grass is not psychoactive 34 Cost 35 Is 36 Number of Chemicals 37 Request for protection/semi-protection? 38 Illegal? 39 Terribly misrepresented information 40 UK definition of cannabis and citing UK studies 41 New Study Shows Absence of Long-Term Memory or Cognitive Impairment 42 Famous Users/Advocates 43 Article is not NPOV 43.1 Summary section dispute 43.2 About NPOV 44 Map 45 Resin Clarification 46 Colorados amendment 44 47 Psychological effects

[edit] United States v. Oakland Cannabis Buyers' Cooperative

Under the section 'United States' I changed the link for the OCBC ruling since the link wasn't pointing to any page due to a spelling error in the previous link. --Wikipedia420 19:05, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Photo Caption

The caption on the photo of "4 ounces" is wrong. Each of those bags is at least 4 times that, it's more likely 1 pound.

--What? Those bags are a little over half full, and it is pressed marijuana, not fluff. Its pretty obvious to anyone who has ever had a quarter pound of pressed thats what that is...A pound of pressed weed looks more like a small box of cereal...--Donnie from the mean streets of Boston, KY 14:36, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Lets just say 4 bags and avoid controversy, I agree they look more than an ounce each to me too, SqueakBox 23:30, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

What i don't get is how come it is illegal if it is used to treat illnesses like cancer and used to help tourettes syndrome etc. Surely it is also beneficial??? I think it is fine as long as it is not overused/bought from dodgy dealers etc.. it is maybe even more natural than normal cigerettes, if grown yourself surely??? Rebecca.

Yes well the dodgy dealers bit should be incorporated into the legality section if we could properly source it, drug wars go back to prohibition in the US and beyond, SqueakBox 21:45, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cost

Does anybody know how much a joint costs? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by The Right Honourable (talk • contribs) 06:18, 8 December 2006 (UTC).

well, assuming that this will somehow be integrated into the cannabis article, a joint can range anywhere from as little as $5 to as much as $15 depending on quality.

I've seen individual joints for as little as a dollar, but I've also seen a quarter-bag ($25) rolled into one huge joint or blunt. The variances listed above are actually only the middle of the bell curve.  E. Sn0 =31337= ^Talk 04:57, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] cannabis species

The genus consists of one species. It is all C.sativa L. . There are no other species. Can the text reflect this. The one reference that states that there are more than one species is NOT scientific. Melbob 04:50, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

Can you cite some sources for that? I've never heard it disputed that indica exists. Anyway, this should probably be on Talk:Cannabis, as that is the genus page. --Rory096 22:38, 3 May 2006 (UTC)

Indicas and Sativas are regularly crossed, bred, and re-crossed without losing fertility. Thus, the subspecies or landraces meet the requirement for being a single species. 71.106.126.123 08:31, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

Thats the problem with wikipedia its full of the half educated. As it stand it is wrong an makes wikipedia a laughing stock. Melbob 04:34, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

judging from your last post melbob, people like you are the ones who make wikipedia "a laughing stock". "As it stand it is wrong an makes wikipedia a laughing stock." how many errors can you count?

Cannabis Sativa, Cannabis Indica, and Cannabis Ruderalis are the three main species of marijuana. C. Indica is considered the most potent, followed by C. Sativa and C. Ruderalis. Sativa is the most commonly sought and referenced species. 207.210.130.105 19:05, 8 December 2006 (UTC)Stephanie, the Bud Queen

[edit] biased overview?

It looks like the article is made by the proponents of Marijuana use and legalization. Where is point of view of another side? [User:El] 9 September 2006

I agree. This page is in favor of cannabis legalization and most paragraphs end with a pro-cannabis conclusion. This could be harmful as it informs people that cannabis is a harmless drug, which has been shown recently in studies is false. I will begin to look for these reports --Mreaster 08:54, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

Most of the research on Cannabis have concluded that it's less harmful than Alcohol or similar legal recreational drugs, for both acute and chronic effects. The article is not pro-cannabis, so much as it is regards the illegality of Cannibis as overly severe.

       Which is POV.  216.114.249.246 02:55, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I fail to see any particular slant in this article, it conforms to most modern findings. --Jaymo 16:41, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

To whomever wrote " I agree. This page is in favor of cannabis legalization and most paragraphs end with a pro-cannabis conclusion. This could be harmful as it informs people that cannabis is a harmless drug, which has been shown recently in studies is false. I will begin to look for these reports --Mreaster 08:54, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

" If you can find any reports supporting what you are saying please post links here. I have done fairly extensive research on marijuana because I live in Denver, was a supporter of the city wide initiative, and am a supporter of the state wide initiative which will be voted on in five days. Marijuana, while it may or may not lead to cancer (research is ongoing; however, as of yet no correlation can be found) can not kill you. To overdose on marijuana is litterally impossible. If one were to try to smoke enough to overdose on THC (The active ingrediant in marijuana) they would litterally sufficate before sucumbing to the THC. Marijuana is safer than alcohol and may be safer than siggarets. (Anonymous)--November 2 2006 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 70.40.160.76 (talk)

This is wikipedia, people who are writing about marijuana are those with interest in it. I would be shocked if this article were impartial.--Loodog 04:12, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

I've put a POV tag on this article, since I agree, this article is biased.24.90.172.131 11:41, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Method of Action

Why is there no information on the actual method of action of cannabis? While the article does mention the presence of receptors, and where some of those receptors are, it doesn't mention the natural function of said receptors, or why an anonymous plant would interface the way it does with them. aubrey 03:53, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

Not much is known about the natural functions of cannabinoid receptors in the brain, or of the endogenous cannabinoid system as a whole; as such, this information cannot be readily supplied. All we know is that such receptors exist, and are antagonized by cannabis when used as a drug. Currently, research is being done on the natural functions of the receptors, the normal purpose of which still eludes us.,

[edit] Fuel

Can someone add the benefits this plant gives to fossil fuel technology? such as; its high fibrousity, slow burn rate, use in plastics, and how this plant is a much better alternative than corn due to how it grows wild without fertilization i.e. it's a low maintenance plant--Howmee 23:27, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

The fibers, fuel, and agricultural topics should all be covered under hemp. This article, Cannabis refers primarily to the cured flowers of the Cannabis_sativa plant, while the name hemp is usually used in reference to the plant when used for non-drug purposes. Mikeeg555 02:39, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Marijuana

So, why is this article located at cannabis (drug) rather than at marijuana? - Nat Krause^(Talk!) 18:46, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

See Cannabis_(drug)#Recent_history, Legalise_cannabis_parties#fn_afgh, and the external links on 1937 Marijuana Tax Act. —Viriditas | Talk 20:24, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

The external links you refer to seem to mostly use "marijuana" in preference to "cannabis". Can you elaborate on the point you're making? - Nat Krause^(Talk!) 21:44, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

The links above demonstrate that the misnomer "Marijuana" (actually "Marihuana") is a regional slang term, previously used in a politically loaded, racist anti-Meixcan, and propagandistic context in America during the "Reefer Madness" anti-cannabis campaign of the 1930's. "Cannabis" is the historical, botanical, medical, and politically neutral term, and hence, encyclopedic. —Viriditas | Talk 23:09, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

I don't see where the links above show that it's a regional slang term. The reason we would put the article at marijuana is that it's the common English name for the drug. The context in which it was used in the 1930s doesn't seem particularly important. - Nat Krause^(Talk!) 02:31, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

According to Harry J. Anslinger: "...the term "cannabis" in the Geneva Convention of 1925 and in the Uniform Narcotic Drug Act included only the dried flowering or fruiting tops of the pistillate plant as the source of the dangerous resin...we find then that Colorado reports that the Mexican population there cultivates on an average of 2 to 3 tons of the weed annually. This the Mexicans make into cigarettes, which they sell at two for 25 cents, mostly to white high school students...MARIHUANA IS THE MEXICAN TERM FOR CANNABIS INDICA....The plant or drug known as Cannabis indica, or marihuana, has as its parent the plant known as Cannabis Sativa...It is popularly known in India as Cannabis Indica,; in America, as Cannabis americana; in Mexico as Cannabis mexicana, or marihuana....It is all the same drug, and is known in different countries by different names. It is scientifically known as Cannabis sativa, and is popularly called Cannabis americana, Cannabis indica, or Cannabis mexicana, in accordance with the geographical origin of the particular plant....In the East it is known as charras, as gunga, as hasheesh, as bhang, or siddi, and it is known by a variety of names in the countries of continental Europe....Cannabis sativa is an annual herb from the "hemp" plant; it has angular, rough stems and deeply lobed leaves....It is derived from the flowering tops of the female plant of hemp grown in semi-tropical and temperate countries. It was once thought that only the plant grown in India was active, but it has been scientifically determined that the American specimen termed "marihuana" or "muggles" is equal in potency to the best weed of India. The plant is a moraceous herb....In the South, amongst the Negroes, it is termed "mooter"...In India, where the plant is scientifically cultivated on a wide scale for the drug obtained from it, the plants, when small, are separated, the female plant being used exclusively for the purpose of obtaining the drug." [1]

The term "Marijuana" is a regional slang term attributed to Mexico (sometimes others), as used in a racist and propagandistic context; the circumstances of 1930's drug prohibition are not only important, they are essential to understanding why the term is not used as the title of a neutral encyclopedia article. Notice, that Wikipedia naming convention policy is based upon NPOV, but has many exceptions. I would encourage you to also visit Wikipedia:Naming conflict and tally a score, as well as post your query on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Psychedelics, Dissociatives and Deliriants. All definitions of marijuana and marihuana refer to the dried flowers and leaves of the cannabis plant. See Wikipedia:Naming conventions (precision). —Viriditas | Talk 02:49, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

Marijuana is not a Mexican slang term—its use is quite common throughout the U.S. as far as I can tell. However, despite taking a while to get around to it, you have made a good point: "marijuana" is normally understood to refer to only the most common of the preparations one can make from the cannabis plant. So, cannabis (drug) is reasonable as an alternative that includes all preparations.—Nat Krause^(Talk!) 17:43, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

Whether it is common or not, the word "Marijuana" is thought to be a Mexican slang term for "cannabis" that was first popularized in "La_Cucaracha," a Mexican folk song associated wtih Pancho Villa. In the same hearings above, on H.R. 6385, Marijuana was described as Mexican slang by the legislative counsel for the American Medical Association, Dr. William C. Woodward: "The term "marihuana" is a mongrel word that has crept into this country over the Mexican border and has no general meaning, except as it relates to the use of Cannabis preparations for smoking. It is not recognized in medicine, and I might say that it is hardly recognized even in the Treasury Department...Marihuana is one of the products of the plant Cannabis sativa. L., a plant which is sometimes referred to as Cannabis americana or Cannabis indica...In other words, marihuana is not the correct term...So, if you will permit me, I shall use the word "Cannabis", and I should certainly suggest that if any legislation is enacted, the term used be "Cannabis" and not the mongrel word 'marihuana...You understand that marihuana is simply a name given Cannabis. It is a mongrel word brought in from Mexico. It is a popular term to indicate Cannabis, like "coke" is used to indicate cocaine, and as "dope" is used to indicate opium." [2] —Viriditas | Talk 20:41, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

I agree that "cannabis" should be used to refer to this plant, especially since it surfaces in both the scientific name and other references. "Marijuana", while widely recognized as a reference to this plant, is indeed a Spanish slang term that first applied to the plant during the Mexican-American War.Derryl C 23:27, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] vaporization

Is there any need for name dropping the "volcano vaporizer" this is a encyclopedia, and I don't think we have a need for it.-The Jordan

I think it should be noted that when making a lightbulb vaporizer the chemical substance inside is removed with salt. - AuraithX

[edit] External links

The external links was added about 3 weeks ago. When added, it contained just 1 link, to NORML, a pro-cannabis site. Soon after it was added, it proved to be a magnet for spam and pro-cannabis POV links. Any site with useful information should be cited inline, not as an external link in its own section, and having a section will end up being extremely hard to maintain. I see no reason to have an external links section, and so I removed the section. If there are any objections, please respond. --Rory096 05:54, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

I mean no offense or disrepect, but I prefer and intend to follow Wikipedia:External links instead of your personal preferences. —Viriditas | Talk 05:58, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

Erm, that says nothing about whether articles should have external links sections or not... --Rory096 06:14, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

Precisely. Have you thought about contributing to Wikipedia:External links or the proposed Wikipedia:External links/External links policy? Users will continue to add external links to this article. Your personal preference is for inline citations, and I am forced to agree that this is probably best, but any disinterested user may think you are asserting WP:OWN without referring to a guideline or policy. —Viriditas | Talk 20:52, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

That still doesn't say anything about whether or not articles should have external links sections. Like all disputed changes, they should be discussed on the talk page to see whether it's suitable for each individual article. --Rory096 23:15, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

It doesn't say anything about it, which is why I've asked if you would be willing to add your proposal to either of the above links. You say you see no reason to have an external links section, but we have guidelines for external links. Standard appendices appear to be agreed upon. Your argument could be made about any article (magnet for spam, POV, hard to maintain) which is why I've asked you to followup on the guideline page. —Viriditas | Talk 23:42, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

I don't see any reason for having it on this article. I think what sections should be in an article should be decided on an individual basis to avoid m:instruction creep. --Rory096 23:50, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

How is your rationale for eliminating the external links section particular to this article? Your argument could be applied to any article. In fact, I'm dealing with this very problem on at least three articles at the moment. —Viriditas | Talk 00:10, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

This article is specifically susceptible to spam and vandalism, as it is a very popular subject and hot-button issue that there must be millions of sites and blogs about. Nobody spams NP-complete or Willard Metcalf. --Rory096 03:17, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

This is a systemic problem. While it is true that popular and/or controversial articles may be more subject to spamming, unpopular articles are facing the same issues. I doubt polyphasic sleep, Heaven's Stairway, and Menehune could be considered popular articles, but they are suffering or have suffered from linkfarming. To combat this problem, you have proposed removing the external links section altogether, but you don't seem to have made any provisos other than requesting inline citations. Although you disagree, these ideas and related proposals are being discussed on Wikipedia:External links/External links policy, Wikipedia talk:External links/External links policy, and Wikipedia talk:External links. I don't think this article is the place for imposing your standards (which will be impossible to maintain over time) which is why I suggest discussing it in the appropriate place. I agree with your position, and I think your proposal will eventually win out (it has to or we will be drowning in links) but I think that general guidelines are best implemented from the top-down. —Viriditas | Talk 09:06, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

I would like to see external links. I kept putting in a link to WeedSpeak but I guess they didn't like it. /shrug.

[edit] Effects On The Brain

What are some of the effects on the brain? A long time ago I took it a couple of times and felt some pain in the frontal part of my brain. Does it damage or do better to the frontal lobes or so of your brain? And compared to alcohol, which drug damages the brain more. Does marijuana really damage the brain? Does marijuana really damage your brain? Zachorious 15:40, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Some claim not, that it helps make the brain more intelligent, intuitive and improving memory and focus, SqueakBox 22:37, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

There is no evidence of marijuana causing brain damage. While there is an intoxicating psychoactive effect, cannabis use causes no lasting impairment to motor-function, cognition or mental acuity. Studies have shown cannabis to actually have beneficial neuroprotective effects, potentially protecting the brain from damage. While it may be possible for cannabis use to trigger pre-existing mental disorders in some people, this trait is common to other drugs (such as alcohol) as well as non-drug related social situations and environmental conditions. To answer your question -- no, marijuana does not damage your brain. --Thoric 19:27, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

There's no evidence of marijuana causing brain damage, but there are correlations between cannabis use and some disorders

• • • "Cannabis use may affect population expression of manic symptoms (and subsequent risk to develop bipolar disorder)"[3]
    • "A clinically important withdrawal syndrome associated with cannabis dependence has been established"[4]
    • "Attention and memory deficits have been reported in heavy marijuana users" causing a "reorganized visual-attention network and cerebellar hypoactivation"[5]--interestingly, long-term abstinence may return one's function to normal in this study...
    • Cannabis users, long-term and short-term show "a higher proportion of deficits on verbal fluency, verbal memory, attention, and psychomotor speed. Specific cognitive domains appear to deteriorate with increasing years of heavy frequent cannabis use"[6]
    • "consumption of marijuana by women during pregnancy affects the neurobehavioural development of their children"[7]

This is all to say that cannabis is not without important central side effects, some rather long-term. It is addictive and heavy use especially can take a toll on one's mental faculties. I disagree with Thoric that "cannabis use causes no lasting impairment to...cognition or mental acuity", but haven't seen any evidence that motor function is overtly impaired long-term. -- Scientizzle 23:57, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

If you read some of the links you've provided, you'll find that cannabis has not be proven to have lasting consequences. Said cognitive impairment due to heavy use shown by the studies has been shown to reverse over time -- as you yourself even stated above "interestingly, long-term abstinence may return one's function to normal in this study" --Thoric 00:13, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

Of course correlation does not imply causation. In fact, (and I say this in all neutrality), the causation probably runs backwards, i.e. having a mental illness puts you at a higher risk to start using illicit drugs. My father is a psychiatrist at a state prison/mental hospital. He, of course, finds high incidence of illicit drug use among the inmates. Yet, there's no doubt in his mind that the drug usage is symptomatic rather than causal.--Loodog 02:29, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

This may be anecdotal, but I lived with a man who has Borderline Personality Disorder on and off for three years, and whilst under the effects of marijuana, he displayed much-lessened symptoms and personality traits of the disorder. He quite literally became a quite functional member of society when he was stoned off his mind, and absolutely impossible to deal with for any length of time while sober. I believe the marijuana had a strong antipsychotic effect. E. Sn0 =31337= ^Talk 02:40, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Is there any evidence long term cannabis users under the influence perform worse in cognitive tests? Sounds a bit far fetched. Ras Billy I 00:35, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

Thoric, I'm not sure if you have access to journal publications, but let me reprint much of the conclusions from the fourth reference I gave above. This is from the Mar 14, 2006, issue of Neurology:

Long-term (LT) users performed significantly poorer on verbal memory vs short-term (ST) users and controls. LT and ST users generated fewer words and demonstrated higher impairment rates than controls on both phonemic and semantic fluency. LT and ST users showed inferior performance vs the control subjects on psychomotor speed, attention, and executive functions. The greatest deficits regarding the LT users were seen on almost every trial of the RAVLT, indicating a generalized verbal memory deficit with impaired verbal learning, retention, and retrieval. LT users' performance was significantly poorer than the published norms (table 2) on most measures of the RAVLT. Our findings are in accordance with certain studies showing that heavy long-term frequent cannabis use leads to subtle deficits in specific neuropsychological domains.

Now, I'm delving a little out of my range of research (I could tell you a lot more about meth, coke and Ritalin), but I commented on what I perceived was subtle misinformation...while it hasn't been conclusively, 100%, smoking-gun, stop-the-presses proven that long-term cannabis use has significant cognitive effects--there are some studies[8] that see effects wash out by two weeks and other studies that found neuropsychological deficits in long-term cannabis users after an abstinence period of between 12 and 24 hours[9] and persistent neurocognitive deficits in heavy cannabis users after 28 days of abstinence[10]. What we've got here is an old-fashioned mess; these are good studies from good journals that give different conclusions, and there are plenty more that fit somewhere between. Now what does this mean? Well, if one's got an agenda for or against cannabis use, one can easily find ten studies that back up the stance of "weed rocks and it's so totally harmless" or "drugs are bad, mmmkay". In any case, I just chimed in to show to Zachorious, our thread-starter, that while there's really no risk of "brain damage" (a phrase associated with severe injury or impairment) there is data that suggest long-term cannabis use can impair cognitive function. As such, Thoric's statement, that "cannabis use causes no lasting impairment to motor-function, cognition or mental acuity" is arguably false. Additionally, "cannabis has not [been] proven to have lasting consequences" is accurate but misleading as one could easily say "cannabis has not been proven to have no lasting consequences" and be just as supported the scientific data. (One more point: "lasting consequences" is also confusing; it's pretty much scientific consensus that there are long-term consequences to cannabis use--even in the study above that saw a wash-out, users had cognitive deficits for at least a week, which is pretty "long-term", IMO--there's just a lack of consensus as to whether things return to "normal" on the day, week or month time-scale. "Lasting consequences" ≠ permanent, irreversible changes.)

I've no axe to grind in this debate, but I felt it important to point out the unsubstantiated and misleading statements above, if only because I've been brainwashed by WP:NPOV. :) -- Scientizzle 01:03, 2 July 2006 (UTC)

Alright then, I will restate my position as: "cannabis use has not been shown to cause permanent impairment, therefore I argue that there is no scientific evidence of brain damage". --Thoric 19:04, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

In the recent addition to cognitive effects: "minor brain damage"; I find no support for this assertion in the information referenced. Urania3 05:02, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

So do I. Removed as vague and generalised rubbish, SqueakBox 05:06, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

---

The so called "brain damage" that was being sited on this page represents a misconception about the use of cannabis (marijuana). The most prevalent brain damage related to this circumstance is caused by oxygen deprivation to the brain due to the inhalation of foreign particulate (i.e. smoke) in place of oxygen. This happens when smoking cannabis, or anything else for that matter. The practice of increasing the euphoric sensation and effect of marijuana by excessive inhalation with prolonged holding in of smoke for further heightened effect (i.e. head rushes) resulting in almost blacking out of visuals and physical effects such as a tingling sensation, all of which tend to result in a lackadaisical stupor afterward, are all signs of asphyxiation which is where the real threat of significant brain damage comes from. Even though this self inflicted act of suffocation most likely won’t kill some one, repeated practice of this over a extended period of time will no doubt result on the loss of numerous brain cells. My I reiterate for all those who might try and blast this post, there is NO proof that cannabis or any of its chemical components kill brain cells. But rather when administering cannabis through the act of INHALATOIN OF SMOKE, there is slight to significant brain damage caused depending on the technique used when smoking, as well as the instruments or paraphernalia used to smoke and/or filter the smoke when smoking cannabis.DaCaylen 19:56, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

---

I do not have any scientific studies to back up my assertions. However, I am a long time pothead and I think I can contribute to this answer through my personal experience. There is little question that THC will have an immediate and drastic affect on memory and cognitive functions while you are still high. In addition I have experienced that a reduction in short term memory will persist for for several days (even weeks) after chronic use. However, if I stay straight for a long enough period of time (roughly 3-5 weeks), my short term memory will improve drastically (back to, or approaching, normal - I am not suggesting that Marijuana can improve your memory). The biggest detriment I have found resulting from the use of Marijuana is inactivity. Being high makes it very easy (even enjoyable) to perform actions that a sober individual would find to be mind numbingly boring. Therefore, chronic users will often find ourselves in a situation where we have not been mentally stimulated for long periods of time. The mind, like the body, will deteriorate with inactivity. 72.1.102.240 8 December 2006

Which goes to show how differently people react to cannabis over a long period of time. Being physically and mentally inactive under the influence of cannabis is entirely an individual choice and not all cannabis smokers are lazy people or unstimulated or have problems with memory. How we use our brains and bodies on a daily basis is surely the measure of how mentally and physically fit we are. IMO whatever you do when you start smoking is what you will continue to do whether that is intense mental or physical activity or doing nothing. And it clealry is possible to learn and figure out new and difficult mental tasks that take years of study while under the daily influence. I strongly disagree that cannabis makes a mind numbingly boring life interesting or bearable or that one would accept mind numbing boringness solely because one is using cannabis. As an elderly Caribbean man said to me recently, "weed gives a man ambition", SqueakBox 02:17, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] List of effects

I merged the lists "List of effects" and "List of therapeutic effects" as there was lots of overlap between the two and not much of a point in maintaining separate lists. Instead I divided it into the three sections you see now: physiological, cognitive, and behavioral. A lot of the effects remain unsourced; I encourage anyone who is interested to source them. — GT 08:31, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Fertility

An oft (if weirdly) quoted effect of marijuana by the anti-drug advocates is its effect on fertility. That's not mentioned in the article as far as I can see. I think it should be, whether the effect is real or imagined since it gets touted so often. --ScienceApologist 14:38, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Its because it was a serious scientific bvelief till it was discredited probably 20 or more years ago. Perhaps someone could source this and write about it, perhaps in the history section. Ras Billy I 15:36, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

There was a very recent study in the Mar 2006 issue of the journal Fertility and Sterility that found THC had major effects on in vitro sperm motility. PubMed link. "The use of THC as a recreational drug may adversely affect male fertility." -- Scientizzle 19:11, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

Also, a study from 1990 concluded that "that smoking marijuana may cause a transient disruption of ovulatory function." PubMed link. -- Scientizzle 19:14, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Aftereffects

Hey, I tried to skim through the article but didn't find what I wanted. I heard from a friend that if you smoke marijuana, the smoke (or something like that) stays in your hair for 10 years. So if a job employer decides to give you a drug test, they can find out if you smoked marijuana in the past 10 years. Is this true and if (or if not) where in the article (or sub-article) is it mentioned? Thanks. sharpdust 05:14, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

Ten years? No way. A few months? Definitely. Here is some info. It really comes down to hair growth & its length. Cannabis use can be detected in hair folicles, but with hair growth ~1/2 an inch per month, it's unlikely that most people have more than two years of drug history on their heads. :) -- Scientizzle 05:48, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

And people with short hair will have considerably less. On the other hand it is highly likely that there will be far more sophisticated drug detection methods developing over the next ten years, SqueakBox 05:54, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

Geez, shave yourself bold before your next walk-in Zerocannon 04:30, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

1. They don't test your hair.
2. They only way it gets in your hair is from the smell anyway, i.e. it doesn't "grow" into your hair.
3. One month is pretty much the average turnout time on this stuff or so I've heard/read. That is, 2-4 weeks after you've smoked, all detectable amounts are out of your bloodstream. Do a google search if you want to research it. --Loodog 06:54, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

I for the longest time thought it was three days, since we have a "lay low" period to prevent results coming out positive when a cop decides to do sudden checks =x Zerocannon 11:04, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Physical Effects?

Under the Immediate effects of consumption by humans it states that:

"Anecdotal evidence suggests that the Cannabis sativa species tends to produce more of the cognitive or perceptual effects, while Cannabis indica tends to produce more of the physical effects."

However, later in the article lists the effects in categories:

Cognitive effects Behavioral effects Physiological effects

and no Physical effects are listed. I think that "physical" effects are a little broad to be simply stated not only here, but several other times throughout the article, and not listed or described.. so if anyone has some good information on expanding this article to include a more descriptive listing of physical effects of cannabis, feel free to add them to help improve the article.

[edit] Long term memory loss

I understand the explanation given for adding it as an effect, but personal experience is not enough to add to an article. Original research isn't suitable to present a fact; if you want to add this effect, there needs to be adequate citation, since even the anti-drug websites I've just consulted fail to list this as an effect. Cheers! --Chuchunezumi 22:20, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

Besides users report experiencing very different long term effects, some users report what they believe to be improved memory while others report what they believe to be memory loss, perhaps indicating that the cannabis isnt really either improving or destroying memory and certainly people's brains work very differently. People's widely different reported experiences is why cannabis research on the mind is such a controversial and difficult area, SqueakBox 22:29, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

I agree to the first paragraph. My guess is that everyone reacts differently. There was a recent study that said the effects of pot vary too much between users to be used medically. Anyway, I need to share this somewhere.... I was on my way home from a road trip. A week long road trip. I was sitting there trying to remember what we did but I could barely remember but a few moments from it. I have a photographic/cinematic/polygraphic memory so that was a major shock; I am used to remembering the sounds, entire videos, and everything of what I do. I tried to look back further and I couldnt remember what I did at the beginning of summer but one or two still photographs. I looked back further and realized that I couldnt remember anything in the past year but around 20 still images. That was when I broke down crying, trying to remember what I had done in the past year, only remembering about 20 things of no significance and of marginal vibrance in relation to my memory pre-pot-smoking. Then thinking to myself that it couldnt be the weed and that it must just be my age I looked back further and started remembering times when I didnt smoke, and even more shockingly they were entirely vibrant memories, full video and audio. I could remember entire videos of what people said as opposed to the past year where all my memory provides me are single pictures and maybe a few words of what somebody said without video. I have since quit smoking as much, and havent smoked since this incident (about 4 days so far) on grounds that I wish to remember the rest of my life. Peace. 65.2.198.163 22:39, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

>> But that just simply proves that they are not long term memory problems. Any memory problems, or any problem related to smoking Marijuana is TEMPORARY. I smoke weed every day and my memory of minor details about the day are indeed hard to remember, but if I were to not smoke tomorow I could remember everything 100% from that day. I think its the being high that messes your memory up. Also, some people such as myself enjoy a lifestyle without so many vivid memories. Theres nothing about pot smoking that is really all that memorable anyway, its usually just something done to pass the time and relax.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.187.14.54 (talk • contribs).

Having smoked heavily for 26-27 years my memory is in good condition, I have mastered many new skills over the last few years such as fluency in a foreign language and advanced computer/internet based skills. My Mum and my Aunt, neither of whom have ever smoked, commented recently (3 years ago) on what an incredible memory for details of long past events I have and I could tell you roughly where I was in my life at the beginning of any August over the last 27 years, or at any other time. Marijuana as an end in itself sounds pretty dull but as a means to an end, say using it while working in the way someone else might use coffee or cigarettes, it is what one is doing that becomes or remains interesting and the pot isnt the centre of attention. TV Genius 23:28, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

[EC]

Alright all, repeat after me: the singular of "data" is "datum," not "anecdote."

To address 65.2.198.163, It's entirely possible cannabis is partially or even fully responsible for your experience, it's also possible that other factors may be involved and you should probably consult a physician (who may also be able to offer advice and treatment options to help you quit cannbis as well). If this situation leads you to quit the drug, I wish you the best of luck--cannabis can cause profound addiction in some individuals and be difficult to boot. Decreased (or stopped) usage of most any drug will usually have positive physical & mental results in some time.

To address 24.187.14.54, your statement is filled with inaccuracies. 65.2.198.163's story proves nothing about cannabis-associated memory issues just as your story proves nothing. To say that "any problem related to smoking Marijuana is TEMPORARY" is a flat denial of considerable scientific literature (some of which I've cited on this talk page) and is as untruthful as Reefer Madness-style nonsense. The mechanisms by which long-term consequences may arise are certainly undefined, and the catalogue of testing paradigms often leaves more questions than answers, but there is a generalized set of long-term consequences that is largely supported by medical data. Every individual, however, responds differently, and nailing down the major effects of cannabis suffers from wide variability in user response, dosing, drug potency, delivery methods and (seriously) the notoriously unreliable self-reporting of cannabis use in clinnical studies.

I've been too long-winded, but I felt it was necessary to address these issues above before directing this talk page back to its specified mission: improving the article at hand as per WP:TPG. -- Scientizzle 00:55, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

We do also need to keep in mind that we are writing a general encyclopedia and not a scientific one but any anecdotal evidence is original research andd we need to keep the article sourceable in every statement it makes. TV Genius 01:03, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

It is absurd to post "Short or long-term psychosis/schizophrenic disorders" as the first line in the effects of cannabis. Get the fuck out.

[edit] Medicinal use

The edits made to this section were too outlandish to appear without reference. I'm not dispuiting that this could be fact, but I find these claims questionable enough to wonder what science backs them. Furthermore, use of verbiage such as "As a matter of fact," suggests a tone that is less than NPOV. Hence, I question the validity of these claims. I've marked them to give the editor a chance to cite sources, but otherwise, after a few days, I believe that this should be removed. What does everyone else think? Cheers! --Chuchunezumi 02:57, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

I've removed the dubious tag, as it seems that the citation needed tags are sufficient. — ዮም | (Yom) | Talk • contribs • Ethiopia 01:26, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

Again, I have to take issue with a passage newly entered into this section, and have added a ^{[citation needed]} tag. It uses weasel language, completely lacks reference, and is too esoteric to be considered widely recognized fact, and therefore needs citation. I feel this should be removed if not corrected. What does everyone else think? Chuchunezumi 05:59, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

The "citation needed" tag is not a free pass to allow unverified content to remain in an article; it is a challenge that the statement does not meet WP:V and is suitable for deletion. Absolutely the "citation needed" tags are appropriate for unsourced information, especially when contrarian to the established view, and if it remains for more than a few days then the material should be deleted altogether. Wikipedia is about verifiability; unverifiable statements have no place here, end of story. The Crow 23:59, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

Who removed the part on alzheimer's that was added last night? It was verifiable fact researched from a prestigious lab and also appeared on CNN and other news organizations. It had references directly to the research companies press release. The Floyd

[edit] List of effects

I added a {{unreferenced|date=August 2006}} tag to this section because it seems to be littered with related personal experiences and very few cited claims. I feel very strongly that every listed effect should have a citation, especially considering there are volumes of data on the effects of cannabis use. -- Scientizzle 16:33, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

I think this section is pretty ropey and perhaps should be rewritten so it isnt a list. TVGH (formerly TV Genius) 16:47, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

I felt free to add "psychosis" to the listing (well, somebody removed it, here it is again) since it's more or less (more more than less) undisputed that this kind of thing can happen - and happens frequently - from smoking marijuana or the like. A friend of mine got psychotic from it (he jacked a car and drove a 200-mile ride home because he was convinced the government wanted to kill his mother...so...he will have to take pills for the rest of his life...oh well). Of course the majority of consumers will never be bothered by things like this, but it's a very real risk, so I thought it would be worth mentioning, no matter what you bunch of 15yo shitheads think...

Apparently you feel quite free to consider your anecdote universal and state outright that anyone opposed is a "15yo shithead." It's an encyclopedia, so a little more than your anecdote (which would be anecdotal even if you gave names and dates, which of course you can't since you made it up) is required for us "15yo shitheads."24.33.28.52 15:58, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

why should fits of laughter not be listed on behavorial effects. it is pretty much common knowledge among groups of teenagers that after smoking marijuana, people laugh much easier, and sometimes if not often people will break into fits of laughter at the most simple jokes. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.199.162.154 (talk • contribs).

1. Unsourced. 2. Unencyclopedically stated. 3. Seems so be phrased in a way as to condone use. 4. Your own comments suggestOriginal research. ReverendG 07:11, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Alternative names

Is there a reason why "cannabis" was the only name mentioned in the intro? I thought it appropriate to at least add the common alternative name "marijuana", especially since the article uses the word to refer to cannabis several times. G Rose 09:07, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

It used to be there, people keep taking it out. --Rory096 19:39, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Large revert

In the past month, the article has been taken over by vandals, false information, and bad format. I've reverted back to July 31, which was the last decent version I could find (then I went through that and fixed some things). I'm sure not all of the edits in August were bad, though, so feel free to add back in any good faith ones. I'll probably go through them later and do it myself, too. --Rory096 17:57, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Khoi and Tobacco as burning aids

The 'contributors' and the 'topic experts' who find the most used supplements with cannabis not worthy to mention in the Wikipedia, please come forward with your reasons and lets discuss it here.

It should go in the smoking article. Tobacco at least is reasonably common, khoi isnt. I also disagree with some of your statements, ie it seems riddled with errors. Most tobacco use is to mix joints with hash which wont burn in pure joints (hence the commonness of a tobacco mix in Europe) and people get accustomed to it so they also smoke it with grass. The idea that tobacco improves the high is laughable so the content would need major changes to stay. Most people use tobacco because they are addicted. El Rojo 20:13, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

I agree with El Rojo. It's too specific for this article, put it either in cannabis smoking or tobacco. You need to get sources for it first, though, see WP:V and WP:RS. --Rory096 22:29, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

I am defending the Tobacco for its proper place as a separate sub-article. Because it is common in some places but ubiquitous in the rest. The hash in a joint is ALWAYS mixed with tobacco (not just in Europe but EVERYWHERE) And pure joints in Europe is pretty rare if seen, the same is in Africa and Asia. So as a rule, when it comes to joints the tobacco is a considerable part of the picture. Therefore as a major part of the cannabis consuming culture the tobacco has to have a separate article. Hash is a fare shot to explain the tobacco's place in most of the joints around the world. The reason tobacco is common in Europe is because the amount of weed the average user puts in a joint is not enough to hold a good joint and tobacco is added to compensate volume. But tobacco addiction is most likely also a underlying reason. I also think (whoever wrote that, I am not the author of the "Tobacco as a burning aid" article) the part where the Fonta is reported to increase the high is not credible; even though the Jamaicans might believe it to have that effect, but that is not a reason to wipe out an entire article!!! About the Khoi being not common.. Not common where, El Rojo??? In the country where you live? The article (which I wrote) says "In South-East Asia". Pardon my stereotyping but it is blatantly obvious you are an American. Here I would like to warn everybody to do your research and homework before you delete something imagining it as false! Just because you never heard anything about it and making an immediate assumption that it is not true is a very stupid thing to do. If your research and common sense does not help you just attach a "(citation needed)" to it. I know just deleting is lot easier than to do your research but it only hurts the article that we are all trying to build. I thought the Khoi needs an article because it is as part of the bong gear as the cannabis, specifically in Thailand, Laos and Myanmar. This makes it the next most burned supplement with the cannabis and as such I think the Khoi wood deserves the article. Besides I believe the use of Khoi will spread around the world sooner or latter as it already being sold by some street shops in Amsterdam as a very popular product. The tobacco article needs editing not deleting!

Read my user page and you will see where I am from. I am definitely not living in an English speaking country right now nor have I been in one since I was last in the UK, so I fail the being an American test miserably, not even knowing the country at first hand. Khoi certainly should go in the sub smoking article and predictions about its popularity are irrelevant. Why are you being so aggressive? That wont help any of us. I see you rudely removed the dispute tag without resolving the dispute. Let me remind you this is the encyclopedia anyone can edit not just you. El Rojo 00:34, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

I have moved both disputed sections to Cannabis smoking which the consensus here warrants and that is clearly the right article for this material if there is one. El Rojo 01:57, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

Isn't the basic idea that the article must go over all the aspects of the drug? Then how is the fact that the one ounce of cannabis is legal to possess in Alaska is more relevant to the whole article than the fact that the cannabis on this planet as a drug is consumed largely as a mix with tobacco? I don't think there is relevance balance here. If I am wrong with this thinking then please somebody explain it to me where exactly. (I did not remove the dispute tag, I don't even know how to do that)

In majority of the counties smoking pure cannabis is not practiced at all. And in the very few countries (like Australia) where pure joints are rolled it is still not the rule. As you guys believe the article should look like, on the entire body of the text the word tobacco appears only once. Just ones! And that is under Psychological effects, where it is suggested that cannabis enhances the effect of the tobacco. Now, that sheds light on the cannabis-tobacco relation!

For good or for bad, you like it or not Tobacco is an integral part of the cannabis consumption. How can't you guys grasp this angle!?! El Rojo, if you move this piece of information away from the main article you might as well go to the Corn flakes article and move into the Breakfast or Cow article the bit of information about the corn flakes being in general served and consumed with milk. I am saying it again, the main article MUST contain all aspects of the cannabis drug. There must be a structure of body as much complete as it can be from where all the related and sub-articles should proliferate from, so that the info is not broken up into places like Cannabis smoking or Chewing cannabis leaves under a moon light in Finland and so on. As it is, there is not a single piece of information about the use of tobacco with cannabis on the article and not to mention the absence of a link that suggests and leads to that particular information.

Can you source your claim that tobacco is mixed with cannabis in the majority of consumption cases as I for one am highly sceptical of the truth of this. But if you can source this information it can be put in the article. There is a link to Cannabis smoking which is exactly where this information should be otherwise this article will be overwhelmed with information so we dont have space to cover all the myriad aspects of cannabis use here. There are far more important bits of info that are in sub articles such as the use of hashish. Milk gets a brief mention in Corn Flakes, juice doesnt even get a mentyion, tobacco gets nmentioned once in our article and khoi not aty all so these cases are in fact equal. El Rojo 15:22, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tagged

The list of effects section should be removed and replaced with normal paragraphs. These lists are contradictory, unreliable and hopelessly biased. El Rojo 21:29, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Physiologicial Effects

Under the heading "Physiological effects" the statement regarding the dilation of blood vessels may benefit from some clarification.

By listing "Increased blood flow..." and "Reddening or drying of the eyes" as sub-compenents of "Dilation of blood vessels..." suggests that these points are addressed by the reference [21] when this is not the case. The cited reference does support the idea that some cannabanoid receptors and substances may be implicated in some vasodialation responses; it does not make mention of increased blood flow, tachycardia or reddening or drying of the eyes.

It may be misleading to list "Reddening or drying of eyes" as a single statement since different physiological processes could likely explain each phenomenon independently (eg. reddening could occur as a result of vasodilation or as a result of a 'drying of eyes' [Keratoconjunctivitis sicca or otherwise]; reddening could occur independent of drying, but not neccessarily vice versa). These statements would also benefit by including some references.

Although according to reference [21] there may be some involvement of cannabinoid receptors or substances in the vasodialtion associated with reddening of the eyes it may be worthwhile to note that carbon monoxide (CO) is produced by smoking marijuana (or any carbon based substance) and that CO can also result in vasodilation.

Great work on maintaining the ever-important integrity of this topic.

24.69.212.30 17:49, 3 September 2006 (UTC) ___________________________________________________________________________________ Sample being discussed ___________________________________________________________________________________ Physiological effects

     * Dilation of blood vessels (vasodilation),[21] resulting in:
         o Increased blood flow and heart rate (tachycardia)
         o Reddening or drying of eyes

[edit] Legality

I think that having a legality section in this article is pointless. The legality issued should be left for the Main Page [Legal issues of cannabis]. This section should be considering the uses and abuses of cannabis as a drug only. Legal issues for recreational, spiritual and medicinal purposes should have the own pages.

Lethaniol 15:51, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

No way. "Legality" is a big part of this article considering its existence is practically banned in many places. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.68.1.132 (talk • contribs).

[edit] Cannabinoid Receptors

I work in the field of cannabinoid research (making improved synthetic cannabinoids), and we known for a fact there are at least two Cannabinoid receptors in humans (possibly more). I think when talking about cannabis as a durg we should at least say how they agonise the known cannabinoid receptors (CB1 and CB2) which are G protein-coupled receptor. From a scientists point of view the overall feel of this article is very amateur - and it needs a more detailed content on the science.

Lethaniol 15:52, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] merged?

There is no way this should be merged with hemp, i dont know who put up that suggestion but the context's of the 2 pages are completely different Javsav 15:01, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] #1 U.S. Cash Crop

According to The Guardian, cannabis is now the United States's number one cash crop.

I believe I found the Guardian article in question here, but the #1 cash crop estimate is attributed to an ex-narc. Steve White used to be a DEA agent, and more recently trains law enforcement officers in undercover techniques (according to a PBS Frontline interview of White here), but other than that experience, I couldn't verify White's background or basis for making the claim. The NORML study, however, is available in its entirety here, and I believe it's a stronger reference for the article. For this reason, I replaced the above sentence (added 22:07, 7 July 2006 by 162.84.192.143) in the United States section with one referencing the NORML study, but I'm preserving it here in case there's a better Guardian article that I missed. Matt Fitzpatrick 05:38, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

A 1998 study by pro-legalization lobby [[National Organization for the
Reform of Marijuana Laws|NORML]] estimated cannabis to be the largest cash
crop in ten states, all of which lie outside the [[Great Plains]] and
[[Midwestern United States|Midwest]].  Nationwide, the study estimated cannabis
to be the fourth largest cash crop.<ref name="cashcrop_NORML">{{cite
web|url=http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=4444|title=NORML Report on U.S.
Domestic Marijuana Production|date=October 1998|accessdate=2006-09-08}}</ref>

Removing the above sentence and citation to talk page. Can someone find the right context for this? It doesn't quite seem to fit in this article, but there are a lot of other cannabis articles to go to. (The sentence was taken out of context; it describes the cannabis market in the United States.) Matt Fitzpatrick 18:34, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Preparations for human consumption: Smoking

This entire section is worded very poorly and I just cleaned up some horrible spelling errors within. The article Cannabis smoking is a lot more professional, perhaps Cannabis can simply state the different ways to smoke marijuana and link to Cannabis smoking for more information? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Memorygap (talk • contribs) .

You didn't make any edits, as far as I can tell. The section isn't too bad, and exists as a short summary of cannabis smoking (which was broken off from that section a while back). A few minutes prior to your post, I removed a couple non notable smoking techniques that shouldn't have been in that section, and it seems fine now. --Rory096 16:05, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Legal status in Alaska

The article contains conflicting statements about the current legality of cannabis in Alaska, so I'll try to help sort them out.

(→ United States) "The state of Alaska formerly allowed residents to legally possess up to four ounces for personal use, but it was criminalized on June 2, 2006; possesion of up to four ounces is now a misdemeanor."

(→ Decriminalization and legalization) "Also, in Alaska, marijuana was decided legal for in-home, personal use under the Raven vs. State ruling in 1975. This ruling allowed up to four ounces of marijuana for these purposes. On July 17th, 2006, that amount was reduced to one ounce due to an 'increase in potency' since the Raven verdict."

By my understanding, Ravin v. State (1975) was the Alaska Supreme Court decision finding the Alaska state anti-drug law to be unconstitutional, at least insofar as the defendant's right to privacy outweighed the state's public health interest in banning marijuana.

This makes the June 2006 statute, basically, a legislative end run around the Ravin decision. Subsequently, a superior court judge ruled, rather quickly (July 2006), that the June 2006 law is still unconstitutional. This puts Alaska more or less back where it was in 1975, while the issue winds its way back up the appeals ladder. Matt Fitzpatrick 00:10, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

Alright, I got the facts mostly straightened out and mostly cited, but the organization still has serious problems. To be honest, my edits may have inserted a bit too much stuff about "legality" for a "medicinal use" section. Part of it might need to be merged into a more appropriate section or article. Unfortunately, I won't have time this week to clean up the organization. Hopefully someone can pick up where I left off. Matt Fitzpatrick 21:07, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] strains?

can somebody compile a list/description of strains whether it be on this or a seperate page? if there is such a page can somebody link it at the bottom of this one? thanx.

[edit] Requested move, additional comments

I missed the discussion, but I have to say that this argument has come up quite a number of times in the past couple years. Maybe there should be a better way of handling requests for renames when the issue has already come up in the past. Personally I cannot see why some people are so adamant at trying to rename articles to suit their political agendas rather than allow them to remain with proper neutral (NPOV) international scientific terminology. --Thoric 22:18, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

I'm the editor who recently nominated the article to be renamed, and I'm confused how you're inferring a "political agenda" from anything that I wrote; please clarify. The reason for my nomination was purely linguistic.--The Fat Man Who Never Came Back 01:58, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

As the person who named this article I agree with Thoric. In the UK and most of Europe as well as other places where hashish cannabis is not called marijuana as that would imply that hashish is also called marijuana or that hashish is not cannabis, both self evidently not so, SqueakBox 23:40, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

Furthermore Google is not a source for wikipedia, ie it is not published material, nor is that US search engine rewriting history, SqueakBox 23:43, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Eating raw grass is not psychoactive

according to many sites, eg [11], eg "Marijuana must be heated before being consumed to activate the cannabanoids so one cannot simply eat raw grass.". Many sites including our own correctly state that marijuana is not soluble in wayter so needs heating with fats to release the psychoactive properties, SqueakBox 00:08, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cost

I think it would be useful to add typical costs of cannabis, and the ammount of cannabis given for the costs, so it can be compared to cigarrette addiction.

Where? The price of cannabis varies greatly between places (which is part of what makes it so profitable for criminals transporting it between one place and another), SqueakBox 02:05, 14 October 2006 (UTC)

This would probably lead to many people just trying to show the prices in their specific area, which could get complicated unless it was organized by country, state, and city? or an average price per wieght, which to be usefull would most likely have to be organized by the location also. johnskate17 14 October 2006

I read an article recently about the differing prices in the regions of the UK, SqueakBox 15:55, 14 October 2006 (UTC)

Wait,...: That does seem very dangerous.

If it is from a longterm historical perspective, well, that seems fine. However, anything more updated could get wiki fined. Now, I do have many complaints about wiki; but, that would be one huge boobytrap {not brassiere}.

I am even annoyed when ordinary product articles list updated prices. Even there, I would say, only list them from a historical perspective, not as a catalogue {not even cattlelog}.

hopiakuta ; [[ <nowiki> </nowiki> { [[%c2%a1]] [[%c2%bf]] [[ %7e%7e%7e%7e ]] } ;]] 05:16, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Cannabis generraly sold in "1o bags" which are supposed to weigh 1/16 of an ounce(1.7g)Often it is under this amount it all depends on where you get it. Fisk

The whole idea of listing prices is unworkable. Not only will it be unverifiable, there is also too much variance. Not only do prices vary from city to city, but they also vary considerably by quality. Add to that the fact that any discussion would have to give equal attention to prices outside of the US and UK, which is absolutely unmaintainable. Regardless, since you aren't going to get good, verifiable sources it can't be added anyway. You could use price estimates from police/governmental sources, but those are usually quite a bit off-the-mark. --The Way 11:40, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Is

this true, false?:

< http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Cannabis_%28drug%29&diff=82143001&oldid=82142607 >.

Would that put the can into cannabis, or cannabis into can? Or canknot? I am certainly not familiar on the subject, as I generally avoid fertilizing weed. I, generally, toss weeds into the dumpsters behind my home, rather than other dumps. Getting high?

I do, occasionally, hear of the confluence of marijuana & formaldehyde. Is this worthy of an article? Considering the other applications of formaldehyde, the consequences do seem important. However, we, likely, put much more dangerous chemicals inside of our bodies all day.

hopiakuta ; [[ <nowiki> </nowiki> { [[%c2%a1]] [[%c2%bf]] [[ %7e%7e%7e%7e ]] } ;]] 05:16, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Weed is much less dangerous than tobacco. No body much knows what they put in cigarettes. Weed is grown maybe with some plant fertilizer, CO2 to pump up the buds, a water and peroxide mist to kill parasites. thats about it for a simple weed crop.

[edit] Number of Chemicals

Can we get an accurate figure for the number of chemicals contained in cannabis? It states four under the 'Active ingredients, metabolism, and method of activity', which is obviously incorrect. 24.209.129.107 04:05, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Request for protection/semi-protection?

Methinks there's a lot of IP vandalism recently. What's some input on requesting protection/semi-protection for this article? Urania3 20:08, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Semi-protection seems like a very good idea. -- Chondrite 05:50, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Illegal?

After reading sme of this stuff, it seems o me that this drug s beneficial to teh body and brain in several ways. It also ave some negative effects, but so does motrin if you take enough. I don't understand why this is illegal when cigarrettes seem to be much more harmful. Anyone have an answer? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by MADmike253 (talk • contribs) 02:17, 31 October 2006 (UTC).

You may be interested in reviewing Legal issues of cannabis and Medical cannabis; try proposing critical suggestions for improvement on those talk pages. If you need a particular question answered, you may need to be more specific. The talk pages are used for improving the article, not for general discussion about the topic. —Viriditas | Talk 03:24, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Terribly misrepresented information

I just changed an extremely apocryphal representation of source information.

What the source says:

Marijuana interferes with blood flow to the brain. People smoking less that 70 joints a week will show improvement from the irregular state caused by the marijuana usage.

What the page said: "Although studies have not proven altogether conclusive on the subject, recent work suggests that the cognitive effects of cannabis use under 70 joints a week are wholly impermanent, and that most afformentioned effects subside after about a month."

I scoured the article for anything remotely like that. Nothing. I therefore suggest that all cited sources be checked to make sure they say what they are represented to say. Also, a page number needs to be on any source that has them. The UK report, for example, is 179 pages long. I've been trying to find where this report says "using cannabis is less dangerous than both tobacco and alcohol in social harms, physical harm and addiction", and I can't.--Loodog 05:50, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] UK definition of cannabis and citing UK studies

You need to be careful when citing UK studies. In the UK, 'cannabis' is synonymous with a mix of marijuana and tobacco. Since marijuana is a vasodilator, it seems nonsensical that it would constrict blood flow to the brain. However, if you consider that this is a UK study and they may be referring to cannabis laced with tobacco, it makes perfect sense, since nicotine is a vasoconstrictor. However, this study tells us nothing about the effects of cannabis itself since it is tainted with a confounding variable. Runderwo 19:03, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

Well in the UK people smoke cannabis and not exclusively marijuana. There are a lot of people who mix tobacco with cannabis unlike in other places like the US but to claim cannabis is synonymous with tobacco in the UK is simply not true, SqueakBox 19:29, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

So I took a look at that study to see what's going on. It actually took place in the States, not the U.K., with research listed as coming from: Molecular Neuropsychiatry Branch, National Institute on Drug Abuse, National Institutes of Health, PO Box 5180, Baltimore, MD. So, I don't think this is a problem with the U.K. definition of "cannabis". I see how you thought that though, since the source listed is a news report on the BBC. On the other hand, I'm looking over the full text of the study and there are some important things to note.

1. Taken from the abstract: the study is "to determine possible effects of prolonged marijuana use on the cerebrovascular system during a month of monitored abstinence." So any observations are in subjects, who are monitored in a research facility, taken after cessation of cannabis use.
2. The study only has a sample size of 54 users (11 light users, 23 moderate, and 20 heavy) and 18 control subjects. This is not a very large study.
3. The study claims to control for tobacco smoking (which appears in users and control groups), stating: "neither alcohol nor tobacco use contributed to any of the differences in blood flow velocity observed between the control subjects and marijuana users. Furthermore, preliminary data from this laboratory have documented that chronic cigarette smoking does not alter PI [results]."
4. The study, by its own admission, states "the present observations suggest that more research is needed to study the effects of chronic marijuana use on cerebral and peripheral vascular systems."
5. There are many possible reasons for the results, but the study states: "It is more likely that the changes in blood pressure and blood flow velocity in the anterior and middle arteries might both be associated with withdrawal from the prolonged use of marijuana."

I propose taking out the BBC source (which is obviously going to editorialize the results) and replace it with the primary source. I think maybe this info belongs in a withdrawal or tolerance heading, rather than the list of effects. --Howrealisreal 20:08, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] New Study Shows Absence of Long-Term Memory or Cognitive Impairment

http://www.umcutrecht.nl/research/agenda/2006/10/Ecstasy+leaves+memory+intact.htm

Occasional use of ecstasy (an average of a total of two pills) or frequent cannabis use (several marijuana cigarettes a week over a period of an average of four years) does not lead to long-term abnormalities in memory or ability to concentrate, or related brain activity. These are the main findings in Gerry Jager’s doctoral thesis. She studied the long-term effects of the popular drugs ecstasy and cannabis on brain functions (memory and ability to concentrate) using functional magnetic resonance imaging (fMRI).

Jager will receive her PhD from Utrecht University on October 31. The title of her thesis is, “Functional MRI studies in human ecstasy and cannabis users.”

When this article becomes available someone might want to add in some of the information in it. Its useful for discussing long-term negative effects.

I agree the thesis could be interesting once accessible. I included other references that indicate impairment of short-term memory functioning and abstraction in heavy users but no impairments or even improved test scores in light and intermediate users. It was problematic a little to access articles, but this conclusion appeared to be a common finding. I linked to one article (and one abstract of an article) that support it. --Ben ^T/_C 12:06, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

And I changed the indication that this would affect all users with the corrollary that this is found in some users as there is clearly no consensus on this conclusion in the scientific world, and nor should there be, SqueakBox 15:33, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

I just read a review on the topic, and it seems as if there are more problems with chonic use than said here. Additionally int he article when they talk about increased blood flow to certain areas and increased activation they say it has to do with chronic smokers "working harder." Otherwise, without stating this it seems like increased activation and blood flow are a good thing. The review is by Lundqvist T, Feb 2005 in Pharmachology Biochemistry and Behavior. Someone else who knows more should consider reading this and adding more to the article. Thanks. Rjkd12 01:28, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Famous Users/Advocates

Is there a list of celebrities and famous people who claim openly they use regularly or are advocates?

I think there should be a list, for example, Bill Maher, Sarah Silverman, Willie Nelson, Snoop Dog, Bob Marley, Woody Harrelson, etc. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 65.2.42.208 (talk • contribs) 04:44, 6 November 2006 (UTC).

Category:Cannabis activists currently fulfills this role. —Viriditas | Talk 06:08, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

Try List of iconic smokers, SqueakBox 15:38, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

List of iconic smokers is a list of tabbacco smokers and Cannabis activists and famous smokers are very different. That list is incomplete. Someone should pull the names from that site, or just list the site as a link.

Why did I get a message saying that the link I posted and was talking about above is inappropriate?? It's exactly what this section is about...We're talking about important and famous people who openly use or have used the drug and that's what that site is. Who sent that message and did they even bother going to the site??

I sent the message and I went to the site which seemed to have lots of pics of famous people who have allegedly smoked cannabis; yet this article is not about famous people who use cannabis, for that you need to go to List of iconic smokers. Spamming isa big problem in wikipedia, SqueakBox 03:47, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Article is not NPOV

This article is not NPOV. Sources have been carefully cherry picked to only pertain to one point of view. Edits contrary to the view of marijuana advocacy are edited out. Perfectly legitimate research data are contradicted with claims from spurious sources. The scientific consensus is that cannabis is a dangerous drug with long lasting effects. In my opinion, a group of marijuana legalisation advocates have conspired to control the information presented on Wikipedia so that it appears to support their beliefs. Please consider adding more sources that identify the dangerous effects of marijuana to balance the bias in the article. See below for examples:

http://www.marijuanaaddiction.info/effects-of-marijuana.htm http://www.nida.nih.gov/MarijBroch/parentpg15-16N.html http://web4health.info/en/answers/add-cannabis-psychosis.htm http://ncadi.samhsa.gov/govpubs/phd641/ http://foxnews.webmd.com/content/article/100/105717.htm?src=rss_foxnews http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2004/03/040309071927.htm http://science.howstuffworks.com/marijuana4.htm --Darth Borehd 23:47, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

All these articles you have furnished us with appear to be politically motivated stuff from prohibitionists, ie it doesnt appear the kind of serious, rigorous stuff that is actually in the references section. Perhaps you should try to edit the article rather than just sticking a pov tag on it, and do so in a way that doesnt itself contradict pov. I disagree that a group of legalization advocates have conspired to do anything whatsoever re the article. The only scientific consensus is that there is no consensus and to try to claim that there is is simply to ignore the debate going on on the issue. Almost none of the claims in your articles have been scientifically validated, and certainly not scientifically validated in those articles themselves. An NPOV article takes in all sides of the debate, if you think the prohibition arguments are poorly presented then please edit the article but dont do so in a way that the article would conveys solely the prohibitonists pov, SqueakBox 00:06, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

Your comments support my statements. You dismiss contrary evidence out of hand by calling them "prohibitionists". Are you seriously trying to tell me that the NIDA, a government agency, is a political advocacy group? And in response to your comment about editing the article, I have tried to revise the article to bring it more into line with NPOV but I have found myself stymied by the same group of editors changing it back to the biased condition. So, now I'm trying to open a rational dialog in the discussion session and to bring attention to the egregious pro-marijuana bias in this article. --Darth Borehd 00:20, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

I, for one, agree with squeakbox, and say that upon looking over NIDA's site that they seem to have formulated their opinions before reviewing the scientific evidence, and therefore present an extremely biased view based on preconcieved notion. A political advocacy group? Perhaps not, the other sites were however, and this one is a very politically motivated group. ReverendG 01:26, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

Who's going to edit an article on marijuana? People interested in it. Bias is therefore unfortunately expected. For example, some asshat keeps misrepresenting the article about blood flow to the brain to mean that it has no long-term effects. As a occasional user, I assure you there are adverse effects. It doesn't mean anyone editing this page will go out of his way to find articles showing that, like this one, this one, or this one, these were the first three results of a google search that somehow didn't make it to this page.--Loodog 01:47, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

Perhaps your edits are being opposed because, like the content in the links you have offered, they dont fit NPOV. If you want a discussion perhaps you could propose some changes to the article and see what other people think. Personally I dont want a pro cannabis article that will be dismissed by many out of hand, I want a balanced, objective article. Accusing people who have smoked a lot of cannabis over many years of being brain damaged and having learning difficulties, the classic stance of the prohibitionist, wont create that balanced article. Learning difficulties indeed, lol, SqueakBox 02:05, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

That wasn't meant as a personal attack. As a fact of wikipedia, people will write about what they're interested in. This creates bias. E.g. someone from Los Angeles will take an interest in the Los Angeles wiki article and just might insert a few things about the better parts of LA. This is why is article is biased. There are no intended insinuations of brain damage. --Loodog 17:21, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

Not from wikipedia no, the attacks on cannabis users come from the type of prohibitionist material Darth brought to this talk page, SqueakBox 17:31, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

Your continued characterisation of such studies as "prohibitionist" material is typical of the bias I am referring. NIDA is a government agency attached to the DHHS (http://www.hhs.gov/). Their continued stance, substantiated by research, is that marijuana is harmful. Equating research showing marijuna to be harmful with prohibitionists of the 1920s and 1930s is not only inaccurate but misleading as well. The consensus of medical and scientific experts is that THC may have some legitimate uses under medical supervision, but it's illegal use, expecially when done through the inhalation of combustibles, is dangerous to human health. My point, which you have been so helpful in helping me make, is that the sources cited, the conclusion, the tone, and the diction in this article have been crafted in such a way as to give an impression of pro-marijuana legalisation bias. --Darth Borehd 21:45, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

Just because research is cited by prolegalisation groups doesn't make it false. Similiar, just because research is "prohibitionist" doesn't make it false. There are enough ad hominem circumstantial fallacies here to kill a politician.--Loodog 22:01, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

And indeed then fundamental problem we face when writing about cannabis as a drug is that it is a highly charged political issue, SqueakBox 03:40, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Summary section dispute

Cannabis (drug)#Health issues and the effects of cannabis is a summary of Health issues and the effects of cannabis. In keeping with the guideline, material pertaining to this topic that is included in Cannabis (drug) should be a WP:NPOV summary of the information presented in the detailed article. Expansion should occur in the detailed article, and, if appropriate, summarized in this article with due weight. A {{POV-section}} dispute tag would be appropriate in the section (rather than a {{POV}} tag disputing the nuetrality of the entire article) if the section does not properly summarize Health issues and the effects of cannabis. I have replaced the dispute tag accordingly, but further discussion in this talk page should focus on whether the section accurately summarizes the detail article with appropriate weight. Content of the detail article should be discussed at Talk:Health issues and the effects of cannabis. Chondrite 06:15, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

---

What you did was very important, and I think everyone agrees. My question is - why was the {{POV}} tag put there in the first place? If this isn't a good summary of Health issues and the effects of cannabis (and I have to admit I haven't read this full article just yet, so I don't know), maybe it should be re-written or receive a {{review}} or just a simple {{cleanup|{{subst:CURRENTMONTHNAME}} {{subst:CURRENTYEAR}}}} tag?

Any thoughts, anyone? --Odedrim 23:09, 23 November 2006 (UTC) ѕ

[edit] About NPOV

I happened to bump into this page and I have to concur that sections of this page is nowhere near NPOV. It is obvious that different sections have been written by different people, but the sections focusing on the medical effects of marijuana is not well written. My skin crawled when I read some of the stuff on this article.

I found the prose was sometimes too vague for a medical discussion. There is no clear cut (and simple) description for their effects. The section sometimes lacked the word "may" when it would be expected (such as in new or controversial research). There is no list or discussion on the official position of the medical (and scientific) profession, especially in regards to the dangers of smoking. At all. Instead, we get a list of all the beneficial things cannabis MAY have, with little on the other side of the coin or counter-evidence. This section should be rearranged into 1) indications of cannabis/THC, 2) known effects, 3) contraindications (there is nothing sensical on this, but reads vaguely towards anti-prohibition), 4) Adverse side-effects. All of these should be taken from the offical position of the medical profession. Then you should have separate sections to discuss controversial medical issues surrounding cannabis, and give both sides a section to present their case. Like all research, there are people and papers that disagree with that position, but it is unwise to throw the baby out with the bathwater when such research papers come along. Doing so is misinforming the very people many of us are trying to educate from the so-called "War on Drugs".

A good example of where this page fails completely is the misconception (that is, different to the position of the medical profession) by some cannabis users that cannabis is "less dangerous" than tobacco in regards to COPD and lung cancer. The only reference supporting this quite stunning claim is a website discussing a non-peer reviewed talk given at a low-profile conference. The second reference in another sentence refers to a newspaper article about the first reference. Since talks at even the best conferences are not peer-reviewed, I would strongly suggest that this claim be removed unless a peer-reviewed reference (or preferably two by two separate groups) can be given. It may still play a role in this article though, perhaps as a footnote in the controversy section highlighting the weakness of some "evidence" used to promote cannabis agendas. The point is that it needs a serious rewriting before you could justifiably say that this article deals with the medical issues legitimately. Volantares 19:08, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

Can I reiterate that the Health Effects section of this article is supposed to be a summary of Health issues and the effects of cannabis article. If the section in this article does not accurately summarize Health issues and the effects of cannabis then it may be an NPOV issue for this article. However, if you dispute the content of Health issues and the effects of cannabis then the appropriate place to discuss your concerns is at Talk:Health issues and the effects of cannabis. -- Chondrite 19:31, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

Having flicked through the larger article, I can say with great confidence that it does not reflect the larger article, since there is virtually no mention of the much more substantial content of negative effects (apart from a very non-descript sentence), and a relatively large incoherent (due to the lack of mentioning the negative effects) discussion of one section that promotes the idea that cannabis is "not as bad as tobacco". This is the biggest issue I have with the section, although I have significant reservations of the conclusions on both pages. The reference used in the summary page should be the same as what is in the major article, since it is peer-reviewed, if not yet reproduced by another group. I believe that claiming cannabis has: (a) "fewer" effects on the lungs on the suggestion that it may be different for two lung function properties and more importantly, (b) the general public tend to treat the word "fewer" as implying that it is "safer". The tone of that section also encourage you to form that conclusion because of no mention of negative evidence, and no emphasis that fewer does not equal safer. I will post something on the other page, giving much more detail why I think that you cannot conclude cannabis does not cause COPD, nor other similar airway damage and disease from this abstract. Volantares 04:53, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Please do edit the health effects section of this article to accurately summarize the detail article. Can I suggest that if you plan major edits to the detail article, it might be best to achieve a stable version there before attempting to summarize here? Chondrite 06:47, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

I've reworded some of the references and sentences used in that section, but I haven't gone through and provided a summary that represents what is in the more detailed article. I may do that at some stage, but this article is not strongly linked to my interests or knowledge, so someone else would be more than welcome to write it (and I'd be happy to agree or disagree with its content). Volantares 13:32, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Map

Image:World-cannabis-laws.png may contain unsourced info. Can anyone confirm the info in it? While I agree that Hondurass has laws that for the most part arent enforced I think the Honduran government would not be happy with this. Please can wee get a source for it or I'll remove the map, SqueakBox 00:41, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

I am the creator of this map. Where shall I list the sources? This map doesn't have its own page... I suppose if there was a page called "International Cannabis Laws" I could put them there... CL8 01:35, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

The source for the Honduras map is from the Medical cannabis page. It says: "Sick people caught with cannabis are claiming it is for medical purposes but the government and the law does not recognise this and punishments remain harsh, though enforcement for consumption is lax." CL8 01:43, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

Ho hum, I wrote that myself, while the first bit was from the local news the second is possibly original research. Its a bit of a tricky one and I see the basic problem as being there is a lot of potentially controversial info in the map presented in a very concise way and with no real way of changing the info on a country by country basis. Anyway, good work, and we can discuss this at Image talk:World-cannabis-laws.png, SqueakBox 01:47, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

Source list has been started. Please view, comment at: Image talk:World-cannabis-laws.png. CL8 04:39, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Resin Clarification

I think the methods and preparation, specifically resin to include it's true nature and common misconceptions.

"Resin is essentially condensed smoke and is commonly, but incorrectly, thought to contain a higher concentrations of tar and other carcinogens."

Thanks! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 74.115.142.211 (talk) 20:31, 5 December 2006 (UTC).

[edit] Colorados amendment 44

Colorado's Amendment 44 didn't pass. This means that marijuana is illegal to all ages in any amount when it comes to recreational use. I am unsure of whether or not it legal in medical usage. The world map showing where it is legal and illegal is wrong. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 1950salvador (talk • contribs) 06:55, 8 December 2006 (UTC).

[edit] Psychological effects

There is currently no discussion whatsoever on the subjective psychological effects of marijuana. There used to be. Why was this removed?

I noticed too but didnt put it back as it was always very controversial but by all means do so. i have no idea whether the removal was well or badly intentioned, SqueakBox 20:36, 9 December 2006 (UTC)