Talk:Brain shiver
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[edit] Unsorted Chatter
I would like to know about the mechanism involved in the brain during this phenomenon - has anyone done a study on this and measured brain activity using an EEG? I have experienced these brain shivers after heavy periods of MDMA use (which I no longer use, and am glad of it!), and I can add that a visual flash is also present, along with the "zing" that is heard in the brain, so the impulses must be going through at least the visual and auditory cortexes. These seem to only happen when I am just about to go to sleep ie. my brain is switching from one wave pattern to another. Very rarely did they happen while I was awake and doing things. Your comments please...
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I wonder if it should be mentioned that sometimes zaps can be the last symptom left over from a successful SSRI withdrawal? I know that I got zaps one about a year after I'd stopped taking Paxil when I got the flu, but I've never had them since (thankfully.) 71.110.172.13 06:26, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
This withdrawal seems to occour more often in patients who often see no improvement in thier depression while on the medication. I have personally gone through the "tapering" of both Zoloft and Effexor, and can testify to the severity of the latter. These shocks in the brain woke me from sleep, and eventually they went away. My advice to anyone on Effexor (or an SSRI at a higher dose) is to pencil in at least a weeks "vacation" to get over this. Good luck.
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This is strange, but I get these in very, very reduced form while still on regular therapeutic dose of Effexor. Usually in the evening, if I move my eyes rapidly or "hard", I get a shivery, tingling sensation that feels like it's in my brain. However, at such a low strength it just feels sort of interesting / strange ... even a bit enjoyable. I'm wondering, regarding the post above, if it IS related to eye movement (my withdrawal effects from Paxil were as well), do you think your REM (rapid eye movement) while dreaming could have triggered it? Just a thought. 65.247.225.96 01:23, 8 December 2005 (UTC) irayna
- Well, the eyes are directly connected to the brain. Protrusions! -- 194.89.2.50 18:36, 28 December 2005 (UTC)
- I experience something like these brain shivers normally. I have never been on any medication and never consumed any drug. Most of the time they are very reduced, but sometimes it can get quite strong. The strong version always starts when I'm in a specific (quite obscure) situation... I thought this feeling is absolutely normal. It's not? --Alkrow 20:11, 7 March 2006 (UTC)
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FWIW, I experience these during Effexor withdrawl, but I've also experienced them (in a much less constant sense) after LSD and MDMA usage. Anyone else with anecdotal information? Canar 18:29, 12 January 2006 (UTC)
- The reason LSD and MDMA does this to you is because they are both serotonin affecting drugs. The effect to me seems so similar to drunkeness, one night I couldn't tell the difference. I thought four beer was making me tipsy but it turned out to be a missed dose. --Cheers
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The effect is serotonergic in nature, which explains MDMA. It does not appear to have been reported with the tricyclics, however. It is also linked to half-life, as a long half-life gives the CNS more time to readjust itself. SNRIs are somewhat worse than SSRIs. Administering another SSRI with longer halflife alleviates the symptoms; using lexapro seems advisable, as it has a 30 hour half-life, and is available in a liquid form that can be titrated more easily. Benzodiazepines also alleviate the problem, and can be used if the patient cannot tolerate a regular withdrawal. Note that administering an SSRI to counter this when it is caused my an MAOI is extremely unadvisable and potentially lethal. Zuiram 10:42, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Other medications
I'm just coming off of a relatively new drug called Cipralex (I believe it's called Lexapro in the States) and I think I'm having a similar reaction. I don't feel it in my hands and feet and fingers, but it goes down to my shoulders. It's kind of like a shock and like your brain and your eyes keep moving after you've stopped, but it also kind of feels like you're standing on the side of a highway and a gigantic truck just zoomed past you. Since it's so new, there isn't a lot of information on it's side effects, but I wonder if anyone felt like this on this drug or on Celexa, the drug it's derived from.
Yes, I have had it on (Celexa, Cipramil)citalopram (mix of the two mirror molecules). Cipralex, Lexapro is just one of the mirror molecules and called escitalopram.
- I only experienced the shivers when on Citalopram, but extremely swiftly after not taking a course - sometimes as quick as the day after missing one. The sensation is incredibly difficult to describe - try describing the sensation of your ears popping to someone who's never experienced it - but I have tried to explain to various people in a variety of ways. Probably the best way I've been able to articulate the feeling is of "missing frames", as if you're watching a movie and it suddenly skips a fraction of a second - although it's a tiny happening, it is enough to disrupt and disturb. The other analogy I've used is a strange one, but makes sense to some people - in several SNES RPG's (specifically Squaresoft-made ones) the effect of poison is to momentarily distort, bulge and pixellate the screen with an off key buzzing noise - given the momentary sense of distortion, and the 'pulse' feeling in the inner ear (especially when jolted, such as walking down steps, I found) makes this effect recognisable to certain people.
Does anybody know if zaps are a known after effect of taking MDMA (ecstasy)? I have not seen this mentioned anywhere else but the symptoms seem very similar to those detailed here.
^Yes, brain shivers are reported after MDMA usage; this generally happens after periods of frequent use. Debollweevil 19:27, 15 September 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Not pleasant
I've been taking Effexor XR for about three years now. I first experienced brain shivers on Paxil, I quickly realized that it occurred after I had missed a dose or took a dose later than usual. Effexor has produced the same effects. They're not painful, but they can be annoying. Usually with me, when I turn my head or eyes rapidly, I receive audio and visual stimulation. Usually I hear two or three "beeps," and they occur simultaneously with a 'bumps' in my vision, sort of like my eye jerked in a direction. That's why I don't forget to take doses.
Richardevan March 14, 2006
[edit] Misdiagnoses
I had brain shivers along with other symptoms about three years ago, after I first started taking Effexor. I went to two different doctors about these problems. One thought it was anxiety (because my heart was beating quickly, but the anxiety was from her looming over me). The other thought it was an inner ear infection. Apparently, neither doctor knew about the withdrawal side effects of Effexor and neither did I. As I have seen through my own research into my symptoms, brain shivers do not occur with either of the conditions I was diagnosed with. I finally looked at the side effects of Effexor on its website and found that the "electric shock" sensation was a symptom of withdrawal. I think that these misdiagnoses happen quite frequently. I would be interested to know if this has happened to anyone else. Rdbrd82 March 20, 2006
[edit] Extremely unpleasant
After coming off Efexor Depot after a year of 75mg x 2 depot capsules a day, I started to experience brain shivers - I couldn't figure out how to explain it do my doctor, but it felt like someone punched an imaginary funnybone inside my brain, causing it to spasm. It wore off a month of so after I stopped taking the medication, and I printed out the brain shivers article on wikipedia to show to my doctor. I don't think it's listed as a side-effect in the inlay.
- It is a listed side-effect. They just call it "paresthesia", which many doctors do not realize can apply to something as severe as this. FWIW, tapering from Efexor is fairly mild compared to tapering from 200mg/dy tranylcypromine, which was my first encounter with this as anything more than a mild annoyance. Zuiram 10:37, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Bad Link
I have removed the following link, because it's 404 now.
- Wyeth's list of Effexor withdrawal symptoms --Overand 23:47, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
Just found what appears to be the proper info, and replaced the link. --Overand 23:52, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Withdrawal vs Discontinuation
There is a very confusing distinction between withdrawal and discontinuation symptoms - this article would probably best be worded using the latter. It would certainly change the tone, however I think that most of the literature indicates that while these symptoms are unpleasant, they don't also include a serious lust for the drug that has been discontinued. I'm not interested in making these modificiations nor being the target of the firestorm that would ensue- so, I'd just like to start a dialog with anyone else interested/watching this article. --Overand 23:49, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
- The term "withdrawal" has been used extensively in the literature, and the term "discontinuation syndrome" is a reframing to avoid the (erronous) assumption made by laypersons that "withdrawal" implies addiction. Zuiram 10:39, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
