Talk:Black Patch

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A point of clarification: I have heard the patch referred to as both 'The Black Patch' and 'Black Patch', and have wondered if there's a preferred use. I ask because it might mean changing the title of this entry.

[edit] Disambiguation page rather than a redirect

It seems that rather than a redirect to Black Patch Park, this page might serve better as a disambiguation page. The two articles (and likely more in the future, since it has been said that "Black Patch" is a common name) that would be disambiguated are Black Patch Park and Black Patch Tobacco Wars. While Black Patch Tobacco Wars isn't directly named "Black Patch", I feel like there are not many people who would know to search the entire four terms to find the article, and that by placing it on this disambiguation page, both articles would be easier to find. Thoughts? -- Natalya 15:56, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

Yes I've gone ahead and done that. Even included a red link ;-) --Commander Keane 16:18, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

Lovely! Thanks. Is it general usage to include the link to Wiktionary, even if there is no entry? There does not seem to be one for "black patch", so I don't know how useful it will be. -- Natalya 16:29, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

With the link to Wiktionary link I was trying to avoid having a dicdef on the page. Simon (Sibadd) told me that "black patch", in the UK, means an old industrial site. I imagine that dicdef will make it onto the page someday, but hopefully someone will use Wiktionary instead.--Commander Keane 17:16, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

Sounds good. Thanks for explaining :) -- Natalya 19:39, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Distinguishing 'Black Patch' and 'Black Patch Park'

Hi, Just checking in after a long hiatus, an seeing that the Black Patch page seems to have been merged with the Black Patch Park page. The answer to the question at top is that while both 'The Black Patch' and 'Black Patch' are used with reference to Black Patch Park/Black Patch Recreation Ground, '(the) Black Patch' predates the park, and refers to an area that was a) older, larger than and/or not contiguous with the park, and b) served as a basis for naming the park. So, for purposes of historical and geographical accuracy, a distinction needs to be made between the park and the older/larger entity known as (the) Black Patch. (An apt analogy would be in the relation between Manhattan and New York City. The conflation of Black Patch with Black Patch Park is analogous to making New York City synonymous with Manhattan, or making the West Midlands conurbation synonymous with Birmingham. There are good, if subtle, reasons for keeping the two distinct, despite the fact that popular use often conflates the two!)

Whether this means that '(the) Black Patch' and 'Black Patch Park' pages should be separate is an important question. The issue would be whether discussion of the Park should be a subsection of the 'Patch' page, since the park developed from part of the Patch. Personally, I think the Park merits its own page, while '(the) Black Patch' is an historic entity covering a somewhat wider area and perhaps spans a particular period of social and industrial history. On this basis, distinguishing the two in an appropriate manner seems to mean having separate pages for each. I'm thinking that the simplest thing to do is reverse the changes made to the Black Patch page, while keeping a disambiguation page. e-tat 15:06, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Checking In

A few weeks have passed since I added my comments here, though there has been no response to them. I will leave this page as is for now, but intend to re-create the original page under the title (The) Black Patch, to distinguish it from 'Black Patch' more generally, as explained in the discussion page at Black Patch Park. I think the disambiguation should either remain with this page, or get reassigned, but not deleted. e-tat 08:17, 7 October 2006 (UTC)