Talk:Biuro Szyfrów

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Contents 1 Terminological inexactitude (two versions) 2 Missing discussion 3 1942? 4 Retitle as "Cipher Bureau"

[edit] Terminological inexactitude (two versions)

The differing inappropriate terminology in English (codes are sloppily used to mean both code and cypher, while the reverse is true in Polish) and Polish is fascinating, but perhaps doesn't belong here. I think it is a worthwhile thing to retain in the English WP as so many readers will have no sense of the oddities of other languages. perhaps it should be rather in cryptography where such confusions have been noted in the introduction. Very interesting however, as two advanced nations' languages should be each wrong and misleading, but inversely so. ww 21:02, 24 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Missing discussion

I seem to recall that, before this article was moved here (to a closer approximation of the Polish), there had been some discussion on the talk page. If those comments could be recovered and transferred, it would improve the combination of article/talk. Worth doing if anyone understands the underlying nuts and bolts sufficiently. ww 21:02, 24 October 2005 (UTC)

I looked at the history of the article, but it seems that it has never been moved (maybe it was merged?). If you could recall the name of the other, older article, you may find the comments (I can copy the comments the talk page in the unlikely event it was deleted).--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus ^Talk 02:27, 21 November 2005 (UTC)

If I recall correctly, this was once called Polish Cypher Bureau and then Bureau Syzfrow sithout the accent mark. Does this give enough hint? ww 10:57, 21 November 2005 (UTC)

There are two redirects (Biuro Szyfrow, Cipher Bureau), neither of which has a talk page. There never were articles Polish Cypher Bureau or Bureau Szyfrow, so we are back to square one.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus ^Talk 16:15, 21 November 2005 (UTC)

Piotrus, If you're familiar with the writing of the recently late Hunter S Thompson, you will also be familiar with the off-hand observation -- after an extended analysis of something outrageous or another -- that "on the other hand, it may have been the drugs". Since my drugs are all legally prescribed unlike many of htose Thompson was concerned with, perhaps I should talk to the doctor about hallucenogenic issues that haven't, somehow, come up before....

I distinctly remember at least two discussions, with non-native speakers of English, about the contrast between the way their language used words akin to crytography and cypher and code and such and the way English does. One of those discussions, I'm almost sure, was in the talk page for a prior version of this article. But, as I note above, it may be the drugs, ...

What I'll do is go through my contributions list, as far back as it goes, and try to winkle out something helpful. But the relevant entires may be more than 500 edits ago, however, so anyhting halpful may have already gone up with the flapping shade.

At this point, having successfully dodged learning anything about the backroom operations of WP (eg, finding redirected pages, as in this case) since 2001, I think I'm beginning to see that an exclusive concentration on article content for my spare time WP participation has its disadvantages.

Let this be a lesson to others. ww 15:25, 22 November 2005 (UTC)

What about checking talk pages for articles related to this one? I do recall seeing your contribs on Enigma machine talk page as well. Still, going through (talk) contribs may be useful - and you never know what useful tidbits of info you can dig up (like answers to some old questions).--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus ^Talk 05:51, 24 November 2005 (UTC)

There are some possibly pertinent discussions on the Ultra and Bomba (cryptography) discussion pages, and there may also be some on other related discussion pages. logologist 08:06, 24 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] 1942?

What happened in 1942? This article could benefit from some conclusion, summarizing the fates of its personnel.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus ^Talk 02:27, 21 November 2005 (UTC)

Done, a couple of days ago. Further details are available in articles on individual members of the Polish cryptological team. logologist 08:06, 24 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Retitle as "Cipher Bureau"

Since there currently is no Wikipedia article titled "Cipher Bureau," I propose that this "Biuro Szyfrów" article be retitled — "moved to" — "Cipher Bureau." logologist|Talk 05:41, 5 April 2006 (UTC)

Particularly as the templates relating to the Bureau already are Englished to "Cipher Bureau." logologist|Talk 06:14, 5 April 2006 (UTC)

Is there any reason to prefer the Englished name? We typically use the name of organisations in their own language: Direction Générale de la Sécurité Extérieure, B-Dienst, Bundesnachrichtendienst etc... — Matt Crypto 07:00, 5 April 2006 (UTC)

I'm with Matt here. And there's a further point for English speakers. Cipher Bureau is blandly innocent of any additional informatino. Biuro Szyfrow (w or w/o accent marks) is mildy exotic and carries the useful information that we're not dealing with standard English use here, watch for curves. ww 15:06, 5 April 2006 (UTC)