Talk:Biomedical engineering

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Contents 1 For expansion 2 Facts? 3 US Bias 4 University list 5 Major revision needed 6 Is that template still necessary? 7 Pioneers in BME 8 Mechanical Bias

[edit] For expansion

Biomedical engineers rule the world and they also operate under two basically different regulatory frameworks.

What are the two frameworks? The article as it currently stands does not mention them, unless it is the FDA versus European approach (which also needs expansion, since the European approach is not explicitly detailed).

[edit] Facts?

Is this a dictionary or a soapbox? Is the diatribe against the FDA really that important to define biomedical engineering?

[edit] US Bias

No European Universitys listed, lets see some european salery estimates too and labor estimates. Also ive read sources placing the UK as a world leader in Biomed engineering, it needs to be talked about along with other prominent countries in the field. Discordance 15:15, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

I don't have the background to add information about other countries, but I did do a few edits to at least try and remove some of the US biased language... Cquan 19:17, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] University list

Would this not be better as a separate article? I'm also not sure what value it brings - it will go out of date quickly and is not encyclopedic. Comments? Jimmyfixme 18:04, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

The field is still relatively new and since there is a section on training, a list of universties is useful since they serve as a good gateway to a lot of information as most of them have more information on their educational programs and research. Listing universities for other fields may not be as useful since who knows how many schools are accredited in say, electrical engineering...a lot. The number for BME is still pretty small, so it's worth listing imho. Cquan 19:17, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

Ok on that line, listing the "top programs" is an inherently biased thing, especially without citations or reasoning for it (removed). I also go back on what I said about keeping a list...I think it's too tempting for people to mess with and doesn't especially add anything. I left the link to the ABET list and if anyone knows about BME/BE accrediting in other countries, please add a link so the coverage is more representative. Also having a selected list of schools to link to at the end is a bit biased unless every single school is listed, so that's gone. If anyone has a better idea how to handle this, please feel free. Hope this doesn't ruffle too many feathers.Cquan 22:34, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Major revision needed

This article is in need of a serious overhaul. The intro needs to be shortened significantly to a single overarching paragraph with the details - the bit about universities, the large-ish bit about clinical engineering - and re-worded to sound more professional. There should be more talk about the specifics regarding the different types of bioengineering - biomaterials, biosignals, medical devices, imaging devices, implantable chips. The whole discussion about the FDA could probably be cut down to a single short paragraph. In general, the electrical engineering article, which has been a featured article, is a great template for what this article could be.

I'm not sure what the policy is around here for major revisions. I could re-write it, but I'd hate to go through all that work to have someone just revert it. I'm just thinking that making a bunch of small changes won't really cut it here, so we might as well change the whole thing at once. I'll watch this for a few days, and if no one objects, then I'll try to make some large changes. -eykanal, 4/24/06 16:07 EST

[edit] Is that template still necessary?

The artice has been changed and now seems to cover both Europe and the united states equally, eliminating the u.s bias which was the reason for the template.

[edit] Pioneers in BME

I would appreciate expansion of the article with a section on the history of the field and pioneers in the field, including Einthoven, John Webster, Otto Schmitt, etc. Exploring a field's past is intrinsic to understanding how and why it is defined presently and the directions for its future. Robert K S 18:21, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

Another person to consider is Y. C. Fung who is considered to be the founder of biomechanics. His textbooks on the subject were quite pioneering. Also, BMES recently came out with an inaugural class of "fellows" who are supposed to be very highly respected biomedical engineers. I've been looking for a complete list, but cannot find one online (only selected individuals who posted the honor on their sites). Although it would definately have US bias, it might be a good starting point to better identify the leaders in the field. Biomedeng 17:20, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Mechanical Bias

When I majored in biomedical engineering, the curriculum emphasis was more on electrical and electronics aspects. I'm sure it depends on the school and your elective classes. Biomedical engineers are working on research and development of electronic applications such as myo-electric control of limbs, signal processing for imaging applications, biomedical instrumentation for EEG and EMG and cardiac vector imaging, etc. Basically there are two kinds of engineers in the world: mechanical and electrical. Engineers either identify with one or the other: so maybe we could recognize both in the introduction. I'd be glad to help if I may. Mbbradford 08:30, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

Anything you can do to reduce the bias of the article would, of course, be helpful, however, I think you will find little agreement that there are "two kinds of engineers" or that an appreciable percentage of engineers fall into electrical and mechanical categories. Software engineering, quality engineering, process engineering, industrial engineering, chemical engineering, etc. are all examples of engineering disciplines that fit neither category well. Robert K S 19:03, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

I would like to add some images (from other places in WK) which are examples of biomedical engineering. I think this would be a fun way to expand the article and would also address my thought about a mechanical bias. I bet there are other images on WK also that others might like to add. mbbradford 07:09, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

I added the images to the article today, and removed them from the discussion page here. mbbradford 14:18, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

yeah I think if you go around calling all engineers either mech or electrical, a lot will get mad...I reworded the sentence in question in the article to remove all this engineering variety bias.Cquan 20:32, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

no turf wars were intended, I was just making an observation about the bias, and thanks for the rewording. I should have ended the mech and EE comment with a ;-) Mbbradford 20:42, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

Could we discuss how biomedical engineering draws upon the knowledge and expertise of other areas of engineering? I'm in my second year of my combined degree of chemical engineering and biomedical engineering at the University of New South Wales. At UNSW, biomedical engineering is a postgraduate degree which can be combined with certain undergraduate engineering degrees. The combined biomedical engineering degrees offered are bioinformatics, chemical engineering, computer engineering, electrical engineering, materials engineering, mechanical engineering, mechatronics engineering, software engineering and telecommunications engineering. When I was trying to decide what field of engineering I was going to combine biomedical engineering with, I spoke with the head of the school. I asked him whether or not some of the combined biomedical engineering degrees were really relevant to the field of biomedical engineering. He said that they would not have developed every combined degree if some of them did not offer students decent career prospects after graduation. Which explains the obvious reason why there isn't a combined civil engineering/biomedical engineering degree! In conclusion, I'd have to say that biomedical engineering is quite a broad field and isn't limited to single fields like electrical engineering and mechanical engineering.Just James 04:31, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

I am crossposting this from the chemical and biomedical engineering wikiproject talk page, but wanted to gather input from the users here. BMES recently published a request for the NRC to consider expanding the taxonomy of BME research doctorate programs [1] (see page 10). The list is as follows:

• Bioelectrical and neural engineering
• Biomedical imaging and biomedical optics
• Biomaterials
• Biomechanics and biotransport
• Biomedical devices and instrumentation
• Molecular, cellular and tissue engineering
• Systems and integrative engineering

Since there is always a question of what is biomedical engineering (is it mechanical, electrical, or chemical engineering) and what research encompases it maybe this would be a good starting point for discussion? Please share your opinions. Biomedeng 17:24, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Thats an excellent list to include within the BME article, perhaps in the biomedical disciplines section. All we need is someone to do the writing?? mbbradford 19:38, 7 December 2006 (UTC)