Talk:Bertolt Brecht
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I added the bit about his influence over the cinema. I am amazed that this point was missing from the page. Anyway, I'm no Brecht expert (hence reading the article), if you can elaborate on his influence on the cinema please do so. I notice that the Godard article had a point about Brecht, as it must, and was shocked to see no Godard reference on this page. As a side note, if you are a Brecht fan or want to see what the alienation effect is all about check out some Godard films or early Fassbinder films.
--Collingsworth 22:36, 16 October 2005 (UTC)
yo yo yo brecht is the man
- You don't know what you're talking about. Brecht served only one purpose (that I believe was his ultimate aim in life), simply to alienate. He did not wish to only alienate the audience but also to get the general public to a state of such boredom with the theatre in general that they would cease to go to it. Brecht attempted to destroy theatre.
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- you are exactly the type of person brecht was worried about being too ignorant to understand his plays
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- Only those who don't care about the big 20th centuries issues like war and peace, wealth and poverty, progress and barbarism, democracy and tyranny can be bored with Brecht. Have you tried his poems? - Stephan
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[edit] Sian says:
Dear Stefan (pardon me "yo yo yo", Stefan)
I think you will find Brecht's main aim was to distance the spectator (not alienate). He believed theatre should be 'a force for social and political change', reacting against 'culinary theatre': only fit for eating, food that causes indigestion. Any learned human can appreciate the fact that Brecht changed the face of theatre. Without Brecht there would be no political theatre. Brecht stuck two fingers up the fascists without getting caught. So don't be insulting a man who influenced the majority of theatre today. Brecht's theories are practised everywhere, all over the world. Here in Britain the Royal Court's young writers project, was brought about by a group of directors going over to see the Berlin ensemble in the 1940's! London's fresh, 'shocking', provocative writing today exists because of Brecht's alive and kicking direction! Vanessa
I don't want to interrupt the name calling and "yo yo yo"s, but I don't understand why there is a redirection from "alienation effect" to this article. Granted, Brecht founded this method, but is it not a subject that can stand on its own? Are there not other uses of the alienation effect employed elsewhere? This is found commonly in many modernist (to include "post-modernist") literary and dramatic works, and certainly not just those written by Brecht. Just a thought. Oh, and did anyone else realize that the Epic Theatre (founded by Brecht to present his plays) is still around? Who would have thought something so counter to the socially acceptable concept of theatre would survive fifty years? Thus proving that "alienation effect" deserves its own Wiki entry. 8)66.245.200.216A Dead Cat
"After the war he moved to Berlin where an influential critic, Herbert Ihering, brought him to the attention of a public longing for modern theater. Already in Munich his first two plays, Baal and Drums in the Night, had had performances, and he got to know Erich Engel, a director who worked with him off and on for the rest of his life. "
Who is the "he" in the second sentence referring to? Brecht or Ihring? Brecht. - Lewis
"He married the opera singer and actress Marianne Zoff in 1922. Their daughter, Hanne Hiob, born in 1923 is a well-known German actress. One year later they had a son, Stefan. In 1930 he married Weigel, and their daughter Barbara was born soon after."
What Happened to the marriage to Zoff? This makes it sound like he had two wives simultaneously. At least one sentence is needed explaining their divorce, and hopefully a word on why.
"Although he lived in the DDR, a copyright on his writings was held by a Swiss company and he received valuable hard currency remittances. "
Remittances? Payments? Clarify please.
scazza 18:04, 28 August 2005 (UTC)
This refers to Saint Joan of the Stockyards as "Brecht's first great play", but later on it says "Brecht would later uses elements of Happy End as the germ for his Saint Joan of the Stockyards". That's confusing... unless it means that everything before Saint Joan wasn't great. Teiladnam 07:08, 9 October 2005 (UTC) Yeah, that's what it means. From the POV of Brecht's theories regarding the theater, or the POV of Brecht's international reception, it's a valid claim. - Lewis
[edit] cleanup tag
A cleanup tag was added to this article a couple of weeks ago by an anonymous editor, and there's been no rationale posted to this Talk page. Since the article seems decent and not too messy to me, I am removing the cleanup tag until an explanation of what needs fixing is given. -- Rbellin|Talk 01:36, 7 February 2006 (UTC)
The talk page, though, could use a cleanup...
[edit] Art, hammer, mirror
Is Brecht the source of the quote which goes something like "Art is not a mirror held up to society, it is a hammer by which to shape it."...? A5 01:20, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
- Wikiquote attributes it to him, but it would be nice to see a source. It seems to be extremely mis-attributed. If it is him, maybe this article should mention the quote? A5 01:24, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
How odd that Brecht, who was an Austrian citizen all his life, is listed among "American communists".
- well... as the article states, he was a german citizen, and acquired the austrian citizenship only late in his life, and never actually lived in Austria; plus he lived on the US east coast for several years in exile, so he can probably be referred to as kind of american, although his relationship with america was a difficult one. -- 790 08:24, 29 March 2006 (UTC)
On the East Coast? I seem to recall he lived in Santa Monica. - Lewis
[edit] Fix this.
There's a whole section on the term "Brechtian" (which if I'm not mistaken is spelled "Brechtean" anyway) which says nothing except that it is an adjective comparing things to Brecht. Thanks, Wikipedia. How about someone more familiar with the man than I am edits this section to describe what a person would actually mean when they use that term, so, as a good encyclopedia should, it does not require that the casual reader looking up that word read the entire article on Brecht. Also, the word "Brechtian" when linked to other pages does not link to that particular section, but merely redirects to the top of the article. Thanks. Rufusgriffin 22:06, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Major works
I'm surprised to see in the list "Herr Puntila und sein Mann Matti". The work is generally known - and often performed - under the title "Herr Puntila und sein Knecht Matti". I don't know whether Brecht revised the title himself, or whether there is simply a mistake here. Anthony Mellor-Stapelberg, Hanover 84.130.162.114 12:29, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Date error
from the article: "After Adolf Hitler won the election in 1933". Hitler won the election in 1932, and became chancellor and dictator in 1933. I don't know which it is supposed to be, but this is wrong. Mtijn 00:28, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
A bit hair-splitting, this. According to my Brockhaus, after the election in November 1932 the Nazis held 196 out of 584 seats in the Reichstag. True, they were the largest party, but "winning an election" looks rather different - which is why Hitler didn't become Chancellor until the following year. In March 1933 they won 288 seats. Anthony Mellor-Stapelberg, Hanover
[edit] Cold War and East Germany
This section is a bit of a mess. Brecht was not one of the Hollywood Ten, he was one of the many people to testify at the same time. He was not cited for contempt for the simple reason reason that, entirely truthful or not, his testimony did not establish that he was in a position to "name names". The chronology needs work as well.--Dhodges 14:17, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Pronunciation
I usually hear Brecht's name pronounced "Brekt", but the German language page suggests that "Bresht" is the correct pronunciation, though I've heard only one person use the latter pronunication. Perhaps the proper pronunciation should be given on the page. --Scottandrewhutchins 05:59, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
- It depends on where you are in Germany, Austria, Switzerland, etc. Some places "ch" is a hard k, others "sh", still others, kh (like you're going to spit--German is such a pretty language). I'm not sure if there's an "official" pronunciation other than High German, which would make it the last option I mentioned (It's like "ich": some say "ick" or "isht" or "ikh" or "ikhsht" or some variation of any of these). Any native or professional German speakers out there? Freshacconci 13:50, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
