Talk:Beard

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Archived picture for future use

I'm a young man with a beard :) i grew mine for two reasons - to look older and also my face droops slightly from the stroke that crippled me not long after birth and the beard helps hide that.

PMelvilleAustin 18:52 Feb 8, 2003 (UTC)

Would someone please get rid of that disgusting beard pic on the page and replace it with a picture that's more attractive? Acornlord 13:57, 29 Feb 2004 (UTC)

As the person who took the photo, I'd be interested to learn what exactly you find "disgusting" about it. <KF> 20:18, 29 Feb 2004 (UTC)

The beard is visually disgusting. It is not aesthetically pleasing to the eye. I would much appreciate a more appealing beard picture. The beard is scraggly, old, hairy, discolored, worn by a snickering geezer. Please get rid of it. Acornlord 01:40, 1 Mar 2004 (UTC)

I certainly won't exchange the photo for a "more appealing" one, but everyone here at Wikipedia is of course invited to do so without further ado. As the photographer, I was wondering about the technical aspects of the photo rather than the object itself.

But I must add here, Acornlord, that I find your attitude rather strange. They say that beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and the corresponding text definitely says that bearded men are frequently considered less refined, cranky, etc. I don't know how old you are, but I sincerely hope ageism won't get you anywhere. Also, although I don't really consider this a slippery slope, anyone could argue they find all kinds of images disgusting and repulsive and demand their removal (see, for example, the photo illustrating the psoriasis article).

Looking forward to seeing a "more attractive" picture here soon. All the best, <KF> 09:55, 1 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Well, that's just my opinion. Where possible, attractive pictures should replace ugly pictures. For example, in the article human, would you rather have an old, balding, fat, cancerous, disgusting, frothing man as a picture for the article, or a pleasing-looking man instead? Acornlord 14:30, 3 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Please, someone, remove that hideous beard picture from the article and replace it with something half-decent! Acornlord 20:59, 6 Mar 2004 (UTC)

I agree with Acornlord. The picture is not the best. Need better picture.WHEELER 13:58, 8 Jun 2004 (UTC)

This is a fine example of a Garibaldi beard, well on its way to becoming a Full beard, as evidenced by the strands beginning to hang downward. The man is a distinguished looking gentleman, likely an Amish type. It is a fine picture and does this page justice. [[User:Whiskers|whiskers (talk)]] 23:39, 14 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Acorn, not everyone looks like the millionaires you see on television. I think it's a fine beard on a healthy-looking gentleman. Not all of us want or feel the need to alter our appearances to suit others. Ralphael

I thought the picture was fine. I think the one there now might be better because it shows the whole face, but yours is not an ugly picture KF and I'm sure you aren't either.72.59.10.103

I must agree that beard is hideous and certainly does not merit being placed right at the top of such a standard article. KF, quit changing the picture back, by now several people have complained. Wikipedia is not a place to attempt to make your face famous. Drop it already. If you continue with this nonsense I will file a report with the administrators. 68.11.46.146 16:36, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Source for quote?

Maybe it is just traditional, in which case a specific citation would not be necessary, but that Greek quote about being neither a boy nor a woman really sounds like it was said by someone specifically. Anyone know if this is the case? Zhankfor

[edit] Breadth of coverage

No, not of the chin, but of the topic- could the article be expanded with more discussion of the significance of beards in other places, since there's currently quite a bit on the U.S.? FZ 22:11, 23 Jun 2004 (UTC)

There ought to be more discussion of of the influence of politics and religion on the hair and beard. Charles Mackay's Extraordinary popular delusions and the madness of crowds [1] is in the public domain and portions could certainly be summarized here. Gdr 17:26, 2004 Aug 12 (UTC)

[edit] Photo of reference work

Why does there have to be a picture of the One Thousand Beards book? It looks like an advertisement. Also, there is another book by Helen Bunkin called Beards, Beards, Beards that has received very high reviews and is to be the first of two, but it is not listed. I have taken the liberty of adding it. [[User:Whiskers|whiskers (talk)]] 23:54, 14 Sep 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Women and Facial Hair

I don't believe that this is the place to talk about women and facial hair. My reasoning follows.

A mention of women and facial hair is made on Facial hair and links directing interested readers direct them to the appropriate page, Bearded woman. Also, I have added appropriate links under 'See also' on Beard and Moustache. Before I created that page and moved the relevant information that had previously been here, the link 'Bearded woman' automatically redirected to Hirsutism. This is not fair, as what is commonly believed to be a beard on a woman is not a beard at all, but simply dark body hair. This new page allows us to discuss the subject sensitively and scientifically, before sending the reader off on a journey into disease and disorder.

The famed bearded women of the circus sideshows were usually fakes. In a few rare cases, it is a case of Hirsutism or an even rarer genetic disorder, for which a page does not yet exist (but links on Bearded woman and Hirsutism do, should anyone care to research the topic). This is not an attempt at segregation. Here we are not talking of female authors, where it makes little sense to segregate them and their works, but of curiosities and medical disorders specific to women. There are men with breasts, too (gynecomastia), but we would surely not talk about them on a page devoted to mothers and infant feeding, or to buxom blondes on the silver screen.

Furthermore, to have a natural male feature discussed in the same breath as hormonal imbalances and sideshow freaks is a gross disrespect to manhood. This furthers the distaste for things male and manly that has crept into modern society. It is often the case today that one does not refer to men as men, but as people. To be a man has become something androgynous and sexless, as if it were something freakish to be diluted, hidden and ashamed of. These pages, Beard, Moustache, Goatee, Sideburns etc ought to be done in honour of men and manhood. It is a subject of male pride.

[[User:Whiskers|whiskers (talk)]] 06:35, 15 Sep 2004 (UTC)

[edit] More about Men

I just happened to catch the last 15 minutes of Dr. Phil after work today. Cher was on briefly. Talk was about her still being single and the difficulties she has with relationships - being a star and all. She said that she was looking for a "person." She did not say she is looking for a man. Refer to my comments above under 'Women and Facial Hair'. This is exactly what I am referring to. [[User:Whiskers|whiskers (talk)]] 03:23, 28 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Not making much sense here. To me, you're talking lesbians and women with (normal) facial hair-- ya might be tryin' to make a connection here. Are you? Mdoc7 16:28, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

Is a French beard same as the goatee ? Jay 15:10, 19 Oct 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Excellent beard picture!

I think the picture is excellent. Who ever this man is I would be proud to meet. Of course I have quite a full beard my self. Family photo found at http://www.livethewordministries.info/modules.php?name=whoweare taken back in June. As anyone who has a full beard knows you certainly get a range of looks from poeple when they first see you. From happy to afraid and all points in between. The man that is speaking so negatively should put his own mug up if he thinks that one is sooo bad. :)
I was very happy to find another site (this site) with information on beards. This one definately goes into more detail than mine. Thanks! Gary

I would like to see a picture of what i think is one of the greatest beards in history, Karl Marx on this page. I think it really captures what a giagantic beard looks like.

[edit] Pogonology

Such a long article, I've only skimmed it for now, but it neglects the word pogonology which seems entirely fitting: the study of beards. --Elijah 02:26, 2004 Dec 10 (UTC)

I'm inclined to agree, as I came to this article specifically looking for that word! Added. Mule Man 20:23, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Christianity?

What is a section related to christianity doing in an article about beards?

Yeah, the article only talks about beards in christianity and no other religion. That's pretty partial. Either remove that section or things about beards in other religions should also be written.

Well, then make it balanced by adding something yourself. Add whatever other religions viewpoint on beards that you find appropriate. Someone already has stepped up to the plate from the Christian perspective - what's your contribution going to be?

[edit] Boxing

Beard is also a boxing term. A fighter who can sustain powerful punches to the face is described as having a "good beard".

Heres a link to an article using it in that context: The Chin, The Beard, The Knockout

[edit] Crimean War

I have read several times that beards became fashionable in England when many soldiers from the Crimean War returned wearing them. See: [[2]] . SimonLyall 03:14, 19 Mar 2005 (UTC)

That would seem about right. The English soldiers would have come into contact with many different cultures, especialy people like the Hungarians who're known for their beards. But you can't forget about the signifigant influence that service on the Indian sub-continent would have had on British soldiers and 19thC fashion in general. (many examples of amazing Indian Beards can be seen in paintings and photography of that time) OzoneO 13:12, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Arf

At present the article contains the phrase "Full beards nonetheless remain a fringe phenomenon". This is clearly in error. Full beards extend all over the bottom of the head, not just the fringes.-Ashley Pomeroy 11:04, 10 May 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Dionysus rarely?

I've removed the mention of Dionysus 'rarely' being represented with a beard, as he frequently is. (In two of the four representations over at the Dionysus article, for example.) Arguably he is almost always bearded when he is not represented as a youth: "Artistically he was represented mostly either as a youth of soft, nearly feminine form, or as a bearded and draped man, but frequently also as an infant, with reference to his birth or to his bringing up in Nysa." (source: http://28.1911encyclopedia.org/D/DI/DIONYSUS.htm) --10:07, 29 May 2005 (UTC)Blorg

[edit] Added note on shaping of beard... should this be in a wikibook?

Thinking of removing the addition, as it's a howto (and may not fit with intent).

Will research and come back later. Quiettype 07:47, 13 July 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Famous beards

As the Moustaches entry has a list of famous owners, why not beards?

Could also include beards in fiction/mythology.

Jackiespeel 17:51, 31 August 2005 (UTC)

Famous beard list is coming along nicely. Is there a reason why it's been changed to alphabetical order by first name rather than surname? If not I'll just change it back to normal. Nick 00:27, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Biology

What might be cool is a section on which hormones in the body encourage beard growth. I'm sure something interesting could be written about it, but unfortunately I know very little about it myself. Maybe someone's interested? --Michiel Sikma 21:58, 25 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Beard length maximium

I was recently asked if beards keep growing indefinitely, or stop at a certain length. I couldn't answer for sure, and it seems that there's no mention of that here. It could be worth mentioning, unless the answer is obvious and I'm just missing it. --Kizor 23:53, 6 November 2005 (UTC)

My understanding is that facial hair, just like head hair, has a genetically determined length. For instance, my mother has not trimmed her head hair significantly in over ten years. Shawn M. O'Hare 16:15, 17 November 2005 (UTC)

Yes, everybody has something called a Terminal Length. Some people can't grow a few inches from their face and others can grow down to their bellybuttons. It's all predetermined. Dynendal 08:12, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Different Human Races

I reckon a new section needs to be written about beards and the different human races. It is my understanding that most southeast Asian and central African men cannot grow beards because of "low" testosterone levels.

There should also be a section explaining the beard through evolutionary psychology. --82.21.18.117 04:30, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

That would not be true at all, quite apart from the fact that 'race' is an entirely subjective and artifical term. The most likey explanation for a lack of beard growth among those people would be cultural. It is true that the facial hair of many peoples from South East and East Asia tends to be thin, but rather than a general lack of testosterone the likely cause is simply a slight genetic predisposition, ie, the same that causes some to grow black hair and others to have red hair. OzoneO 13:23, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Beards in Halakha

To User:70.156.183.68 or anyone who questions the legitimacy of permissible shaving under halakha:

First of all, there is absolutely no question that shaving or trimming with scissors is permitted, as this is brought down in the Shulhan Arukh (Yoreh Deah, 181).
Second of all, most poskim do allow shaving with electric razors. Rabbi Moshe Feinstein and Rabbi Yosef Eliyahu Henkin are just two very sufficient examples. Indeed, some poskim prohibit their use, like the Chazon Ish, so I added a sentence to note this.

Please do not revert material without knowing the facts first. --DLand 23:09, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

I am sorry that I reverted the article anonymously. However I am afraid that I will have to argue with your first point; a large number of Poskim pasken differently from the Rema and hold that trimming with scissors is forbidden.

The Tzemach Tzedek in Shaalos UT’Shuvos Tzemach Tzedek, Yoreh Deah, Tzadik Gimmel gives an 8-page teshuva on the subject, concluding that any trimming of the beard is an ISSUR D’ORAISA on the grounds of Halacha, among them: -

1. ‘Peyos HaZaken’

2. Lo Yilbash Gever Simlas Ishah

3. it violates Taam Hamitzvah

This is upheld and quoted by the Munkatcher Rebbe in the Minchas Elazar and the Sdei Chemed.

The following Poskim also held independently that ALL trimming of the beard is categorically forbidden, including with scissors:

The Chafetz Chaim on the basis of ‘Lo yilbash gever simlas isha’ and also ‘bechukoseihem lo teleichu’, as written in Sefer HaMitzvos HaKotzer. His opinion is brought down by Rabbi Chaim Kanievsky.

The Baba Sali.

Shlomo Eliezer Alfandari the “Saba Kadisha”.

Yaakov Chaim Sofer, the “Kaf HaChaim”.

Rabbi Yosef Rosen the Rogatchover Gaon - Shaalos UTeshuvos Tzofnas Paneiach, Vol. 4, teshuva 258.

All of these opinions are treated at length in the sefer ‘Hadras Ponim Zoken’ by Moshe Wiener. I have only quoted those which are quoted and sourced on http://www.koshershaver.info/ , and an explanation of the teshuva of the Tzemach Tzedek, as well as the opinions of the Zohar and the Arizal, can be found on http://www.chabadtalk.com/forum/showthread.php3?t=193 .

I changed the article to reflect the fact that many Jews refrain from trimming their beards on the grounds of halacha, and not in order to make a cultural statement or following the kabbalah. I agree with your second point, and hence left the beginning of the article as-is.

I rephrased the wording from ‘attributes holiness to those who wear the beard’ to ‘attributes holiness to the beard’, as the Zohar says that the hairs of the beard themselves correspond to the ‘Yud Gimmel Tikunei Dikna’, a level of G-liness. It also avoids Jews people seeing bearded Jews as being hypocritical.

I removed the reference to Chabad-Lubavitch because the practice of having an untrimmed beard is common to almost all Chassidishe Groups, based on the Teshuva of the Minchas Elazar which is mentioned on koshershaver.info

(Yair-Aaron 14:18, 16 June 2006 (UTC))

Regarding your changes:

The article already mentions the fact that some poskim hold that shaving is completely assur, at the end of the first paragraph. More than that would be both belaboring the point and giving undue credence to the stringent psak.
I haven't seen the Zohar inside, so I'll take your word for it.
You may be right that it applies to all Chasidim, but it is well known that Chabad puts a very heavy emphasis on the issur - most likely because of the Tzemach Tzedek that you quoted. As you probably know, he is primarily a Chabad posek.

Let me know if you still have a problem with this. Please discuss here before making further changes.--DLand ^TALK 15:19, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Higher Quality Beard Photo...

...if you do say so yourself, Triddle! :) --DLand 05:40, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

Indeed I do - its the difference of being able to print out the photograph at 4x5 inches versus about an inch by an inch. Maybe the beard isn't as high quality (but "short trimmed beard" is also already represented) but its quite neutral to say that the photograph itself is higher quality as if you care to (and I can't see why someone can, but it is fairly remarkable to me) you can actually see each strand of hair from my beard in that photograph; now that is high quality. :-) Triddle 11:28, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Beard color?

Does a beard's color be the same color as the persons hair? The reason why I ask is because when I let my beard go uncheck it starts chaging colors as it grows at the frame of the face and on a portion of my neck it gets blackish, but as it goes up the rest of the neck portion to the mid-chin gets orange then, it gets brown(my hair color) on the rest. Merc25 08:19, 23 April 2006 (UTC)

Yes, that's perfectly normal. My beard is much redder than the hair on my head. My father's is the opposite. Ştefan 12:49, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Expanded coverage?

At what age can one determine with finality the beard coverage they will have on their chin/cheeks for the rest of their days? I have heard of people developing more beardage in their late 20s and 30s, but I couldn't find anything definite. Any idea? Am I doomed to this patchy chinstrap-only coverage for the rest of my life, at 22? --130.126.67.39 00:03, 26 April 2006 (UTC)

I'm 36. The only thing that's changed about my beard since my early twenties is that there are more gray hairs. My sideburn and cheek growth has always been sparse. Your ear hair will probably increase as you get older, so at least you have that to look forward to. Your mileage may vary. 209.213.216.42 00:12, 26 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] List of famous bearded people

The list of bearded people on this page is getting ridiculously long, so much so that it detracts from the article itself. I propose the creation of a new article, ~~List of famous bearded people~~List of bearded people, to include the list, and merely link to it here in the See also section. Please comment. --DLand ^TALK 16:30, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

Done. --DLand ^TALK 06:37, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] beard picture

Picture of me; lots of pixels, will print well, high quality photograph. I disagree that I am ugly.

Less pixels, grainy, short-trimmed beard is already represented in article.

Ok lets try to figure out what beard picture belongs at the top of this page. An anonymous editor has decided that my picture is too ugly for wikipedia. All the other contenders I've seen are not suitable for print (not enough pixels). Is wikipedia here to define beauty or to provide open-content that others may use? I believe the focus of wikipedia is the later, rather than the former. Rather than get in an edit war I've decided to open the forum for discussion since it seems there is a problem with consensus. I'm going to revert for now - opinions? Triddle 18:55, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

First, let me note that I don't find you, simply your beard, aesthetically unpleasing. However, that really has nothing to do with my point and I apologize for noting so in my reverts.

Now on to my point: I've looked into the history of this page and you have switched this picture back many times after it has been removed by other users. It is arguable whether or not we even need a picture right at the top of the page as many other examples of beards are given further down the page. Yet as can be seen in earlier discussion, whenever there's been a suggestion of removal you argue that individual is attacking your personal appearence. So my question is this: Why do you think it is so important that your face be on the top of what is likely a somewhat high traffic article? :This is a clear attempt at self promotion and therefore through both this and your continuous reverts a violation of wikipedia policy (see sections on "what wikipedia is not" and "3 revert rule") I have removed the image so we can have a neutral discusion. I am not against reposting it after our discussion has concluded, but to insist on its use while it is being disputed is shameless. I look forward to your response. 68.11.46.146 20:49, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

You are wrong on many accounts. First, you are confusing other people's comments with mine. Second, I've reverted because in all instances the picture has been replaced with one that is lower quality; I define quality as the number of pixels in the image or the image clarity. Do you have any examples of a beard that can printed at least 4 inches wide with out any degradation of quality? Third, the comments you are speaking of are for another and completely unrelated picture. Fourth, I don't care about your definition of shameless; I care about the quality of wikipedia. I'm going to revert again, and as you so aptly point out, another revert from you will violate the 3 revert rule. Fifth, there is no need to get an admin involved here, one is already present: me. I'm not going to comment on your definition of beauty because it is pointless. You really have no arguments against the picture aside from you don't like it. Triddle 21:00, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

Your bully tactics will get you nowhere. As an admin is it your reponsibility to act in wikipedia's best interest. Behind your thinly veiled argument of image quality lies nothing but shameless self promotion. If you care so much then find a quality picture of a famous beard, many of history's greatest figures have sported them. I agree, beauty has nothing to do with it and in particular individual's varying perceptions of it. However, in spite of what you may think, your beard is not a good representative of the entire history of facial hair.

Honestly, it would be a shame to lose all the respect you've gained through many good images you have uploaded in such a ridiculous arguement. However, if you decide to abuse your power and continue with this nonsense, then congrats on a life of constantly monitoring this page to make sure your image remains. 68.11.46.146 21:30, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

What ever. A snippet from my user page, which is much older than my picture: I believe that Wikipedia has potential to wind up in print in the future so I'm trying to make as many photographs as possible ready to be printed in high quality. To me this means it should be 300 dots per inch and around 4 inches (1200 pixels) minimum either measurement or at least big enough that if printed it would be easy to make out the features. You can see this philosophy in the photographs I've taken and the images I've uploaded. I've replaced lots of photographs on wikipedia with ones I've taken myself. You are the first person to refer to any of them as disgusting. Triddle 22:51, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

Hmmm... they both look fine to me. Why not just use both? It shows two different kinds of beards. Aesthetics is beyond the question, it's all about information. --The Prophet Wiz ard of the Cray on Cake 21:31, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

Ok, I've been a bystander of this edit war and I have a few things I would like to say. I mean this in the nicest way possible and I have a lot of respect for you, Triddle, but I don't think that is a good photograph of you. Your other photographs are very good and I admire them, but this particular one can definitely afford some improvements. It's not a matter of beauty at all, but photographs are worth a thousand words, and if you can't stand the ridicule, then you shouldn't be pushing your photograph so much. Maybe if you improved the subject in the photograph it wouldn't receive as much ridicule and removing. Some things I would improve in the current photograph are: The baseball cap. It's not clean, and it wouldn't be so distracting if you didn't have it on. Secondly, your glasses look foggy, and they would be better cleaned, or taken off. Thirdly, you shouldn't have taken the photograph inside - using cameras inside invites artificial lighting which makes skin shiny. Speaking of camera techniques, that angle is not the most flattering you can pick. I would suggest holding the camera up more, and not a foot away from you. You remarked at one point, halfway down this page, that you can see each strand of hair in your beard. Is that really important to see each strand? Maybe I'm just thinking of the Gestalt theory, where the whole is greater than the sum of parts, but something farther away would be nicer if the "information" of the article is the beard and not each strand of beard.

I hope I'm allowed to speak my mind on wikipedia, and I might or might not have put words into the mouths of many - but again, I do not think that it is a good photograph of you. When Wikipedia is "printed" like you predict, and 50 years down the line, some 7-year-old boy finds a copy of this so-called printed version and flips to the beard section because he is interested in beards - would you want him to be frightened? At this rate I think children would be scared of the picture if you kept it as it is whether you like it or not, due to small telltale signs of standard human grooming and photography ability. Humans are fickle, and every human has the potential for attractiveness if they work at it. I'm not saying you're ugly at all here, I'm just saying the main points of the photograph could liken you to a homeless person.

Take this all as you will, and hopefully not personally. After all, this is just something on the internet, and the elevation of this situation has been ridiculous. Whether or not it gets printed, that will still be a photograph that needs improvement and, I quote for emphasis, doesn't deserve to be on the top of such a high quality article. As a fellow beard wearer, I encourage you to take my points into consideration. Thank you for your eyes. Dynendal 06:06, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

Well holy molly I had no idea I scared children! Anyway, the 3 revert rule exists for a reason. I'm out of reverts - if anyone else had ever stepped up to the plate on any of the previous attempts (or even this one) they could of out-reverted me. That means to me there has been no consensus for removing the photograph. If there is a consensus for removing it then I'll abide by it; Its that easy! Triddle 07:04, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Beard as second pubic hair

The beard grows when the man could become in need for it, namely at puberty, for oral sex reasons.

Then, he could use his tongue on her. That way she does not get pregnant, a four million old contraception method. This kind of sex was used far more than the putitin form over the next million of years, so he grew a huge beard over the time. With a beard the man has a protection from rubbing off weakened, wet skin during long lasting plays. At some recent time, however, he lost track of why he had become the beard, and since then sex at all seems difficoult for mankind to cope with.

There are two reasons to seek sexual activity, and there are two corresponding ways to go through it.

1. To produce children. Do: putitin.
2. To have a good time but no children afterwards: Do not put it in. Use fingers and tongue. The latter made the existence of our beard to a fact.

Some sources would be useful for an argument as unique as this one. JakGd1 23:35, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

Sorry, there are no sources even if the allegation is correct. I am the source. Mankind really forgot his second sexuality on the way. That is why sex is completely misunderstood and hence problematic. KS.

Hillarious. The beard is simply an obvious sign of a sexually mature male. That's as far as it goes. Just like cheek pads on a mature male oranutang, The domed head of a mature male moutain gorrilla, a lion's mane, a deer's antlers, etc. A beard is also a remmenant of the full coat of hair which once clothed all human beings, from scalp to the toes. -Definitely NOT something we grew to accommadate a secondary sexual practice. OzoneO 13:39, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

LOL - maybe there is some other excuse we can find to put the words "become the beard" into the article? No? oh well. I have to agree, with previous posters, this "fact" does not seem to hold much merit, and is certainly the first I have heard of it. Lostsocks 22:56, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

The voice defines the male. The beard is protection. You 'hilarious' and 'LOL' knowers: How come that the expectation of sex is much higher than we can fulfill? Tell me: where do these deep inner expectations really come from? We are born with a high expectation, and we are all disappointed. I tell you: This is because the expectations are correct, the official practice of intercourse wrong (for enjoyment). Try this out: For one year: stop the putitin. Men: concentrate mentally on not coming, she plays you with hands. Or whatever. Stop the stupid putitin. If you do come: next time it's easier. In one year we'll talk again. Ya? KS

KS - maybe your expectation is higher than you are able to fulfill. But unless you are able to back your opinions with some credible sources I'm disinclined to believe them Lostsocks 23:33, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

KS- you do not understand male sexuality. Proverbs 30:19 Mdoc7 13:58, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Beards in Eastern Religions

A couple of points to discuss 1) Why are eastern religions listed seperately to the others? 2) Whilst I myself have a beard, it is nothing to do with my faith as a Zen Buddhist. Zen Buddhists are really no more inclined to grow a beard than anyone else, whilst a few famous zen practitioners may have had beards, plenty more have been completely clean-shaven. There is really nothing specific about beards in Zen.

I would suggest firstly combining the "eastern religions" section with the other list of beards in religion, and also seriously consider removing any reference to beards to in Zen or Daoism lostsocks

[edit] Beard defined as a verb

Y'might provide this in the religious (Christian) section. For the definition, see Leonard Ravenhill article (search on "beard" and see the footnote); or see wiktionary definition. There are also Biblical examples. Mdoc7 15:52, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Sources?

I am reading a book on the cultural history of beards, and I can't find any proof of this, "Queen Elizabeth I, succeeding Mary, is said to have disliked beards and therefore established a tax on them." In seems that, Elizabeth I actually sent two bearded courtiers as envoys to Moscow, which Ivan the Terrible got a huge kick out of. Does anyone have a source or should we remove it?

Most of her advisers and favourites were bearded in any case. Burghley, Walsingham, Leicester, Essex, they all had beards. -- Necrothesp 20:10, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Needs references

Lots of historical facts here, only one reference for the entire page. That seem right to you? 69.94.199.146 17:20, 10 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Stay healthy, grow a beard?

Under prohibition, there's this bullet that describes an exception on Israeli prohibition of beards:

The soldier requires a beard for medical reasons; this claim must be accompanied by medical documentation specifying the period of time during which his beard is medically necessary.

This naturally leads me to wonder: what medical reasons could there be for having a beard? I could imagine some sort of disfigurement the beard is supposed to hide and the patient having a psychological need for this, but is this what is meant? Can someone elaborate? 82.92.119.11 21:00, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

Many people with thick, curly facial hair suffer from painful ingrown hairs after shaving. Physicians routinely offer medical permits to such individuals who are employed in beard-unfriendly fields (i.e., military, police). Grahamattacks 17:28, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

As well, haemophilia can make shaving prohibitive and small nicks from the razor can be life-threatening. Zhankfor

Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org../../../b/e/a/Talk%7EBeard_78fb.html"