Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Montreal West High School

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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep, high school. Mailer Diablo 16:02, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Montreal West High School

This looks like a school. The article lacks any notable references and even has no references or links at all!! It seems vanity to me. I do not think we keep articles about every high school. Beralighthand 14:08, 25 July 2006 (UTC) user's 3rd edit [1]

  • Speedy Keep Beralighthand, High Schools are notable. Also on a side note, you have not been on Wikipedia long be sure you know what you are doing before you nominate, in fact you only started editing today. A user should have more Wikipedia experience before nominating anything for AfD. Valoem talk 14:19, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
    • I disagree. Wikipedia:Deletion_policy says, "Anyone except blocked users is welcome to participate in nominating articles for deletion or discussion of existing nominations". If you think new editors shouldn't nominate articles, get the policy changed first.--Xyzzyplugh 14:39, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
      • It should, but unfortunately is not, this is an example where a new user nominated an article before fully knowing the criteria for deletion. Valoem talk 14:49, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
        • Valeom, I would like to direct you to WP:Assume good faith. I see no reason why this editor's nomination is improper. Agent 86 17:13, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
          • Comment Absolutely agree with Agent; see also WP:BITE. It is also altogether likely that a user who properly nominates an article for deletion on the day he arrives is somewhat familiar with the project from his having contributed anonymously/under a different account, such that the ascription of the term new user (especially where intended derisively) is inappropriate. In any case, the question of the notability of secondary schools is probably well-settled (notwithstanding that some, as I, disagree with a categorical rule, as evidenced by some users' supporting delete), but it's eminently unlikely that even a longtime user who doesn't frequent AfD would be cognizant of the relevant history, and, so, where a nomination is sincerely essayed (with encyclopedic purpose in mind), it seems better to advise than to upbraid the nominator, especially where an AfD isn't particularly disruptive; our discussing an issue a bit more isn't harmful. Joe 06:06, 26 July 2006 (UTC)
  • yeah, personally i think keeping all these high school articles is bs but the precedent has been set. many times. Keep. Benji64 14:30, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Delete per nom. Benji64, please point me to any policy page confirming any such "precedent." I don't believe there is one; it is all "proof by repeated assertion." There is no established policy or consensus about what schools should be included and it is perfectly appropriate to discuss them case by case. Dpbsmith (talk) 15:41, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
    • Comment There is an overwhelming predecent established over the past 2 years where not a single, verifiable high school article has been excised from wikipedia. Remember, this is a discussion. Benji64 never said he was stating a "policy", he was giving the rationale behind his vote - which is that there is a clear precedent that high school articles are not deleted through the deletion processes on Wikipedia. Stating that no high schools are deleted is not "proof by repeated assertion", it is a fact. Wikipedia:Watch/schoolwatch/Schools for deletion archive clearly shows the results since January of 2005 (as I am sure you are well aware). I would also like to note, since you referred to it another AfD discussion, that Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/High schools includes many nominations from the year 2004 which ARE NOT high schools (despite the title) and that the great majority of high schools which are listed on that page that were indeed deleted have since been re-created and in some cases survived subsequent AfD discussions. With all due respect, the only "proof by repeated assertion" that I see in this context is that you have stated mulitple times that it isn't true that high schools are not deleted, however as the record shows, high school articles are indeed not deleted through deletion processes on wikipedia (obviously hoax, copyvio or non-verifiable schools notwithstanding).--Nicodemus75 23:23, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Keep; having been around since 1894 is notable enough, I think. Kirill Lokshin 15:49, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Keep its a high school. Check the school project I believe. Concensus was reached that all high schools can have articles and notable middle or elementary schools can have them as well.--Crossmr 16:06, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Keep — This meets my personal standard of notability for high school articles (since there is no accepted group standard). Sorry but I don't find the usual repeated arguments for deletion compelling. :-) — RJH (talk) 16:16, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Delete, per nom and Dpbsmith (I also agree with Benji that (blindly) keeping all school articles is, ahem, bs, but disagree that we are bound by any "precedent"). There is no inherent notability for schools. Each school article ought to be judged on its own merits. This article is not sufficiently encyclopedic. Agent 86 17:13, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Keep -- It's a high school and should not be deleted. The school project has established that no school should ever be deleted. Notability has nothing to to with it. Capit 18:31, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
    • Comment user created brand new account specifically to participate in (or influence) one particular vote or area of discussion, see [2] "I got involved with Wikipedia because I was told there was extreme hostitity toward high schools and that it was very necessary for me to vote to defend them." Hipocrite - «Talk» 12:29, 26 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Comment Hipocrite used this (see his comment above) to block me as a sockpuppet because a friend got a Wikipedia news letter warning about school deletionism so I did sign up and enter a vote as my friend told me to do -- he had to help me because when you are new at Wikipedia, it's hard to figure out voting. So Hipocrite put a big ugly yellow banner on my page that I was a sockpuppet - and I still don't know what that is, but I do know that is how these school deletionists treat you when you are new. Why should I have to defend myself for signing up and voting? Capit 13:51, 26 July 2006 (UTC)
    • Comment Who is your friend? Hipocrite - «Talk» 14:04, 26 July 2006 (UTC)
    • Delete. If the school project has established that, then they're wrong. Notability is (almost) everything. - fchd 18:43, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Keep as per Wikipedia:Schools/Arguments#Keep. We do keep articles about every high school, welcome to the complete sum of human knowledge. Silensor 18:37, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
Two of those are primary schools, not high schools, and all of them are quite old discussions. --Skeezix1000 19:15, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Sorry, let me wratchet myself down a bit. No verifiable article about a high school has been deleted for nearly the past two years. P.S. If you think "many" is equal to 2 (out of hundreds), you can spare me the lectures on accuracy. And thank you for the pointer to the Eastern Technical High School article, I thoroughly enjoyed reading it. Silensor 19:36, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Keep on the issue of precedence. Once one goes, they all will be nominated for AfD. -Royalguard11Talk 18:39, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Keep. This issue has been decided many times before. --Skeezix1000 19:13, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Strong Keep - All verifiable high schools have been kept for two years. That's a fairly strong precedent. Please see WP:AFDP (education section). Srose (talk) 20:32, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

*Keep - on the issue of precedence as stated above. If one goes they will all be nominated. We have been warned before about this type of attempt to delete schools. Do not let these school deleters win, per RJHall above. Trunk 21:50, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

  • Keep- The tradition of all high schools being kept really needs to be turned into an official guidline, as per above, noen have been deleted in years. --PresN 22:13, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
    • Well, please turn it into an official guideline, then, and establish that this is really the Wikipedia consensus. Dpbsmith (talk) 15:48, 26 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Keep, the article conveys the historical importance of the school. Yamaguchi先生 22:37, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Bicycle for all the usual reasons.--Nicodemus75 23:15, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
    • Huh?
  • Keep, and list at WP:EiC#Cleanup needed...which I've just done. --Stephane Charette 23:31, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

Keep - I've seen quite a few people with good intentions and miserable writing. This is probably just one of them. It does need cleanup though. Thanks for putting it up for cleanup, Stephane. Badbilltucker 00:54, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

  • Keep Schools are notable per consensus reached @ This page -- Librarianofages 02:05, 26 July 2006 (UTC)
    • That's a not a policy or guideline, that a subpage of a user page. Dpbsmith (talk) 15:48, 26 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Keep, not a speedy candidate. General cosnensus is that high schools are notable. --badlydrawnjeff talk 11:02, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

*Keep - Notability is not applicable to schools per School Project. The general consensus, as stated above, is that the fact the school exists is enough. As Dpbsmith noted above, many many schools have been deleted by the school deletionists who rally together to delete all schools. Listerin 12:54, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

  • Keep. High schools are not inherently notable, but a high school with a long and well-established history such as this is. --Kuzaar-T-C- 14:57, 26 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Delete Not just a school, but a school that no longer exists. Catchpole 17:09, 26 July 2006 (UTC)
    • Comment: Should we delete all articles on things that no longer exist? The fact that the school has closed doesn't mean the article goes away. --Stephane Charette 17:50, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
      • No just delete articles on things that no longer exist that aren't very interesting or useful. Catchpole 20:13, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Keep Wikipedia should cover the past as well as the present. Piccadilly 17:13, 26 July 2006 (UTC)
  • keep please this school is historical erasing this makes no sense at all Yuckfoo 13:49, 27 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Keep I'm always up for keeping school articles. A storied school is definitely notable. Mikeeilbacher 00:40, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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