Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Modojo

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete, discounting socks. Ingoolemo ^talk 06:10, 10 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Modojo

Article about a non-notable website (Google: 235), content at the end is bordering on patent nonsense [[User:Mysekurity|Mysekurity]] ^{[[additions | e-mail]]} _{04:26, 3 November 2005 (UTC)}

• Keep. This article should not be deleted. Modojo is one of the only websites that focuses solely on mobile gaming. In addition there is a fairly large and active community behind Modojo. Update: Please keep in mind that the Modojo Forums were perviously called Cloudchaser and XenGamers. Modojo is rather a recent name, which is why it produces unimpressive results in Google. Also keep in mind that Modojo is one of the only gaming sites that is devoted exclusively to handhelds. plucas 05:09, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

Please note that Modojo contains no puppets, especially meatpuppets. Modojo is not a disgrace to the internet.plucas 18:00, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

• Delete. I don't see how this particular little-known website is any more important than the zillions of other Internet forums out there, and the article doesn't seem to be able to establish any importance beyond quoting some unimpressive statistics. —HorsePunchKid→龜 06:18, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

For what it's worth, Cloudchaser and XenGamers get a comparable number of hits on Google. —HorsePunchKid→龜 06:57, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

• Keep. It's not so much the site itself but the community/group of people there and the rather interesting history it has; i.e: a lot of metamorphesis of the site has occured but the original community for the most part has stuck together. 220.236.33.103 06:28, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

• Keep. HorsePunch- The website is differenciated from the "zillions" of other gaming sites/forums because of its strict mobile focus. It fills a specific online niche that very few (no one else?) is focused. Not all websites can or should be gauged solely on their google rank. Modojo is very relevent in the ever-growing mobile gaming scene. Cell phone gaming is EXPLODING in popularity, and I don't know of any other site that examines in so closely. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 72.254.35.179 (talk • contribs) 2005-11-03 01:36:49.

• Delete the article and Ignore the meatpuppets.-Sean|Black 06:50, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

• Delete the article and Eat the meatpuppets, they're delicious with gravy. Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 12:06, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

• Delete the article and don't play with the puppets. feydey 12:11, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

• Delete per nom. --JJay 14:35, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

• Delete nn. Marcus22 15:58, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

• It's somebody's website. I have a website too, but I don't write articles about mine, and neither should other people. Delete for lack of verifiability and significance. Friday (talk) 16:12, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

• Keep. 7300+ people could make a midsized town - even if the internet is incomprehensibly large, why should any part of it be ignored? (preceding unsigned comment by 129.21.41.2 (talk • contribs) ) - Dalbury 18:11, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

• Keep. The website is looking to pioneer in creating communities for gamers. They are looking to differentiate themselves from the zillions of forums out there by building a community with MySpace like feautres for people who share a common interest. Sites with similar social networking features may become common in the future but this site is one of the first in a potentially new area. While they may be small now there is potential for this website to become significant. mcwiggin Please use four tildes instead of three, so that a time and datestamp may be applied. Thank you, [[User:Mysekurity|Mysekurity]] ^{[[additions | e-mail]]} _{03:31, 4 November 2005 (UTC)}

• My delete vote (per nom, nn +/- vanity) becomes strong delete votes when puppets are involved. Cut the strings. Ifnord 17:48, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

• Delete per nom as non-notable. --DropDeadGorgias (talk) 18:28, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

• Delete --Optichan 19:06, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

• Delete Not sifficiently noteworthy to satisfy WP:V, WP:RS encephalon 22:52, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

• Keep. The forum has existed for over 6 years and effected thousands of peoples lives. Give it some time and it think you will all see the merit of the page. (preceding unsigned comment by 66.166.232.206 (talk • contribs) ) This is the fourth edit for this user; the first three were in the article Modojo. - Dalbury 03:20, 4 November 2005 (UTC)

• Keep The community use to be one of the leading video game media websites on the Internet. This isn't a website by Joe Schmo who wants some free advertising, and the forums were at one time were the official community of a print magazine. There are other, less notable websites on Wikipedia (see Talk page), so if you vote to remove this entry then by default those other entries should be removed as well. JTrost 02:10, 4 November 2005 (UTC)

• Keep With a little touching up, I don't see why not. Besides, "Ignore all rules, including this one." Toupee I edited the article recently without logging on. My mistake.

• Keep This website has become MoDojo only recently. There is a large community with a long, interesting history behind it. Besides, how many other sites devoted exclusively to mobile gaming do you know? (preceding unsigned comment by 71.57.120.22 (talk • contribs) ) This is the first edit for this user. - Dalbury 02:51, 4 November 2005 (UTC)

• Keep because it's one of the top gaming forums in population as well as being the best mobile gaming exclusive sites. Mirthoneist (preceding unsigned comment by 66.177.213.74 (talk • contribs) ) This is the user's first edit. - Dalbury 02:55, 4 November 2005 (UTC)

• Delete as per nom Olorin28 02:49, 4 November 2005 (UTC)

• Keep This site actually has a history, a fairly long and complex one. It has encompassed many sites and Modojo is the most recent one, the forums are a mainstay of the website and have included members from all the forms Modojo has taken. For the fact that Modojo deals with mobile gaming is what sets it apart and makes it worthy of keeping. Barnolde Please use four tildes instead of three, so that a time and datestamp may be applied. Thank you, [[User:Mysekurity|Mysekurity]] ^{[[additions | e-mail]]} _{03:31, 4 November 2005 (UTC)}

• Comment To save all you Modojo supporters some wasted effort, please read Wikipedia:Sock puppet, and particularly the section on "Meatpuppets", before posting. - Dalbury 03:05, 4 November 2005 (UTC)

• Delete. Non-notable website. *drew 03:09, 4 November 2005 (UTC)

• Comment Modojo members who have actively participated in Wikipedia have been encouraged to vote to keep this entry, however they have no control over people who are not members that vote here. JTrost 03:25, 4 November 2005 (UTC)

• Keep. It may be non-notable to you (*drew, et al), and I'm afraid I would have agreed with you, but I took a look at the category this article is in, and if you put up an AfD for this article, you should do it for the likes of GiveNGo and FOK!Games as well. For all I know, Modojo seems much more well established than either one of those two and some of the others in that category as well. I'm most certainly not a meatpuppet, and this is my honest opinion. janey the crazy 06:37, 4 November 2005 (UTC)

On a sidenote, in reference to mysekurity's google count, [1] turns up almost 100k results. the difference between 235 and 76100 is quite huge. janey the crazy 06:42, 4 November 2005 (UTC)

Yes, but that counts vast quantity of links that shouldn't be; for example, links from modojo.com to itself. I don't know exactly what Mysekurity's search was, but I tried several and kept coming up with numbers in the hundreds. —HorsePunchKid→龜 05:48, 5 November 2005 (UTC)

Mysekurity's search omited several articles outside of Modojo linking to itself such as the Business Week and Sports Line articles. On a related note, doesn't the fact that highly reputable publications such as the LA Times and Business Week cite Modojo make it all the more noteworthy? It also makes Modojo the subject of national media attention outside of the Internet, which means the website meets 2 of the 3 requirements to be a notable website (according to Wikipedia's policy, it only needs to meet 1). Jtrost 06:02, 5 November 2005 (UTC)

• Comment: I'm not sure what, exactly, my search was, as looking through my Search History on Google brought up no real indicator (the search looks to be indeed 76100). I'm not sure why the descrepancy happened, but in any event I'm sorry. I'm not an inclusionist, and personally think that Wikipedia doesn't really need articles on sites such as these, but I think I'm willing to let it slide. I'm going to be neutral on this, because I'm not really sure of the merits of having an article on this site (why not have a history page on the forum?), except to drive traffic. What normal encyclopedic article, may I ask, would link to this site? What are the merits for keeping it on Wikipedia as opposed to having this information on the site? -[[User:Mysekurity|Mysekurity]] ^{[[additions | e-mail]]} _{20:16, 5 November 2005 (UTC)}

Here is an example search that shows only a couple hundred results, though it may be too restrictive. This gives about 18,000 hits, but includes a lot of irrelevant garbage. For what it's worth, my lame personal website, which I make no effort to advertise, gets over 30,000 hits. —HorsePunchKid→龜 21:56, 5 November 2005 (UTC)

First, I would like to establish some credibility for this website. It isn't made by a bunch of people sitting at home on their computers (not to say that's a bad thing, several websites with entries here are made in that sort of environment). Modojo is a real business that takes in revenue. Look at the business's address: 268 Bush Street in San Francisco. Google can show you that hundreds of reputable businesses are located here, including the IGDA San Francisco Chapter.

Now to answer the bigger question of why Modojo deserve its own entry on Wikipedia. It's already been established many times on this page and on the talk page that there are other, less notable websites with entries here, so I won't go into that again. The WP:WEB states three requirements for websites. Modojo meets all of those except for the Alexa ranking, which is understandable seeing how it's a newer website. However, Cloudchaser Media, the company that the community derives from, was in the top 10,000 during 2001. Even if you omit that fact, this website is still notable according to Wikipedia's standards.

However, you bring up a good point about if this still merits a Wikipedia article. I can see how people who are unfamiliar with the website can easily dismiss its entry on Wikipedia because it does look like blatant advertising. Please look at the current article again. The vast majority of the text deals with the history of the community, not the main website (the idea of creating an entry here was to tell the story about the history of the community, not a seven month old website). At its peak, the community had over 11,000 members, and during highly publicized events such as E3 and the Game Developers Conference, it's common for there to be HUNDREDS of active users on the website at the same time. The current record is 544 members who were on the forum simultaneously on 02-07-2005, which was around the time of a big announcement that is escaping my memory at the moment.

This community has a long and interesting history, and it's a story that many people here (even if you omit the meatpuppets) think should be told. Why should this be on Wikipedia instead of a page on the website? I think it's for the same reason that every other of the 800,000 articles on Wikipedia should be here. Wikipedia is an online encyclopedia of everything notable. Over the years this community and all the websites it has been associated with has had several million viewers. It's part of the Internet's history. Jtrost 22:08, 5 November 2005 (UTC)

• Keep. In addition to the citations in news media mentioned by Jtrost, Modojo's official industry contacts make them seem noteworthy. Also, the history is interesting enough on it's own - even to someone like me who had never heard of the site before today. 63.224.187.10 04:39, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

Note: this is the user's first edit [[User:Mysekurity|Mysekurity]] ^{[[additions | e-mail]]} _{04:54, 7 November 2005 (UTC)}

• Delete nn, sockpuppets. Dottore So 12:25, 7 November 2005 (UTC)
• Keep 7000+ forum members meets informal wiki requirements. What's the argument here? 63.224.187.10 18:19, 9 November 2005 (UTC)

Note: This user's only contributions (4 at the time of this post) have been to this AfD and another, Origenxbox360, which was deleted. -[[User:Mysekurity|Mysekurity]] ^{[[additions | e-mail]]} _{03:09, 10 November 2005 (UTC)}

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.