Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Hazelwood Central High School

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was keep. Mailer Diablo 01:07, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Hazelwood Central High School

I am a graduate of Hazelwood Central High. I attended the school for the fall of 1995 to the Summer of 1999. I have a lot of fond memories of the school. With that having been said, however, I feel there is no need fot this article. Whomever wrote this article simply copy the section on history from Hazelwood School District. Therefore I move that the article on Hazelwood Central be removed. Christian_Historybuff Steve 17:06, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

• Delete as per obviously qualified nom. Bobby1011 17:14, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
• Keep per generally accepted consensus that High Schools are inherently notable. Will put a cleanup on it though.--Isotope23 17:27, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
• Keep and clean-up, per above. PJM 17:30, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
• Comment I wasn't aware that there was such a consensus. Why only high schools? Bobby1011 17:31, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

• Comment. See WP:SCHOOL. Basically, any school article gets automatic immunity the moment it's created. I don't think the policy makes any sense either, but you wait and see; there's no way this article will get deleted. --Aaron 17:35, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

• Comment Even WP:SCHOOL says that no consensus was reached as to the validity of the proposal. There may be too much doubt to delete this article though. Bobby1011 17:40, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

• Comment. Consensus was never reached (and never will be reached IMO) but one of the things that in the past was generally agreed upon by quite a few people was that High Schools were notable. This was never accepted as a guideline for a variety of reasons and I'm not going to branch off on a rant about that. Suffice to say there is a strong enough school inclusionist movement that this will likely be kept. At least it isn't another Elementary or Middle school.--Isotope23 18:20, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

• Delete. The global importance of this school is not addressed, see WP:NOT. Cdcon 17:42, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

• But there is no new information on this page that is not on the Hazelwood School District page. In fact that information and wording is the same. I would not object to a Hazelwood Central High Page that talked about Hazelwood sports, prinicplas and individual school history. However, this page is not any of those. This page could be renamed "The History of Hazelwood School Distict", but then this article is unnessacary since the district's history is on the District's main page. (Steve 17:42, 20 February 2006 (UTC))

• Comment I'll just sit here and watch this school article get kept, as usual --Ruby 18:01, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
• Keep High school --Jaranda ^{wat's sup} 18:20, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
• Keep For consistency and thoroughness. Honbicot 18:21, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
• Keep Better written than a lot of existing HS entries. Besides, I had two dates with a girl from this school in 1973. Fan1967 18:46, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
• Comment Wasn't the newspaper from this school the subject of a Supreme Court free speech decision sometime in the 1990's? Perhaps someone more familiar with that can incorporate it into the article to help establish its notability. TMS63112 19:34, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
  • Close, but the Kulhmeier decision (1988) involved Hazelwood East, not Central. Same district, wrong school. Fan1967 19:47, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
• Delete Frack WP:SCHOOL; let's vote reasonably. Adrian Lamo ·· 20:52, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
• Delete per my unwavering deletionist view towards unremarkable grammar-/middle-/highschools. -- Krash (Talk) 21:15, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
  • Unwavering is a pretty strong word. Surely there are some school articles that you consider notable? Turnstep 04:41, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
    • What on earth is your point? Read what I wrote again. It's only unwavering for the non-notable/unremarkable schools. Like this one. Importance and notability must be asserted. This school has neither. -- Krash (Talk) 14:54, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
• Delete per Adrian and Krash, though I doubt it would matter if we collected 4000 delete votes. --Aaron 22:26, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
• Comment Welcome, Steve, to the wonderful world of Wikipedia, where schools are a religious issue and no school article may be deleted, however bad it is. Guy 23:48, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
• Keep naturally Jcuk 23:55, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
• Response to Comments I'm sorry, Guy. I do not understand what you just said. What possible way is deleting a page on a school a religious issue. As to thus who vote to keep the page: This issue is not reallly the deleteion of a High School Page. The issue is: "Do we really need a page that is merely a Xerox of another page. If you will read the history section of the Hazelwood School District main page and then read the Hazelwood Central High School page you will see that they are identical. This is why the Hazelwood Central High Page should be either written with material about the school or deleted entirely. (Steve 00:02, 21 February 2006 (UTC))

Long and detailed discussions were held to try to agree a protocol for merging minor and unremarkable schools into larger articles for the school district. A small number of people refused on principle to accept anything other than having a separate article for every school and absolutely would not countenance compromise. No article on a verifiable school, however poorly written, however trivial, however small the stub might be, no article on a verifiable middle school or above will ever achieve consensus for delete, because there will always be schools inclusionists who will vote keep. You have, in essence, poked the anthill with a sharp stick. On the plus side, having insisted on saving every single school article, they are also pretty good about cleaning up the abysmal ones and at least leaving only verifiable information, albeit this is often simply a stub.

Just as nominating any Southern Baptist preacher for deletion will have you castigated as an atheist who wants to expunge all Christianity from Wikipedia, nominating a school can attract unwelcome attention from those who assume you know the history and are nominating in contempt of what they see as consensus (actually the consensus was simply to stop arguing about it and get on with writing an encyclopaedia). There really ought to be a section in the guide to deletion warning people never to nominate schools, it only ever generates acrimony. Just zis Guy you know? 13:16, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

• Keep Alot of schools are on Wikipedia. Just because you don't like the format means you have to delete. It can quite simply be solved by editing. I don't see any reason why it should be deleted. Vain? Possibly, but that should be viewed as POV, and warrants edits. Schools are all over this website, they are institutions of education and hence should be on this site. I think you would have to try VERY hard to find a school that is not on Wikipedia. Yanksox 00:23, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
• Comment Not trying to turn this into a forum for the WP:SCHOOL debate, but...I tested Yanksox's hypothesis and the first high school I searched for, Runcorn State High School, doesn't exist on wiki. Maybe he meant only schools in the states or whatever, but that's irrelevant; most schools are probably not on wikipedia at all. The second one I tried, the Gymnasium I attended in Germany Friedrich-Ludwig-Jahn Gymnasium doesn't have an article either. Nor does it deserve one. Are we going to list every department of transport and centrelink as well? Bobby1011 02:51, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
• Delete as Copyvio of this [1]. ergot 02:59, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
• Comment: I've taken out the history section, which was not only a copyvio as noted, but a duplicate of the other article (as also noted above). It was also poorly written and somehwat POV. The article is now truly a stub, where it could be argued that it was not before. Turnstep 04:36, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
• Delete nn school Catchpole 12:57, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
• Keep and expand. If it is deleted it will be recreated at some time and probably not randomly selected for deletion nomination next time around, so what is the point of deleting this start ? Choalbaton 18:26, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
• Keep Lots of high schools have articles and it seems like a good way to bring people to Wikipedia. Scranchuse 18:35, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
• Keep as a verified school stub. The article no longer duplicates the district page information, for those who raised that concern. Turnstep 19:05, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
• Keep all valid High Schools. — RJH 19:42, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
• Keep as high school. Pepsidrinka 21:06, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
• Keep all high schools. Honbicot 16:20, 22 February 2006 (UTC)
• Be bold and merge with Hazelwood School District, per Steve's comment. — Rebelguys2 ^talk 23:26, 23 February 2006 (UTC)
• Keep per Scranchuse. Kappa
• Delete. At present this article has nothing which can't be found by reading the school district article. Sjakkalle (Check!) 07:44, 24 February 2006 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.