Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/FM Toyohashi

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was no consensus. Ingoolemo ^talk 05:48, 10 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] FM Toyohashi

nn Japanese radio station. ♥♥purplefeltangel♥♥ 00:38, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

• abstain for now, will wait until some editors with more knowledge on Japan vote. Youngamerican 01:54, 3 November 2005 (UTC) weak keep based on my analysis of the arguements below. Youngamerican 03:13, 8 November 2005 (UTC)
• Comment: this is an extremely low-power station, which are usually not notable, but since it is in a relatively large city, it may have a large audience. -- Kjkolb 02:50, 3 November 2005 (UTC)
• Keep, potential audience of over 800,000 according to the Japanese page. Kappa 04:46, 3 November 2005 (UTC)
• Weak keep per above comment by Kjkolb and vote by Kappa. -- NSLE _{(Communicate!)} ^<Contribs> 05:45, 3 November 2005 (UTC)
• keep per kappa --Isolani 10:26, 3 November 2005 (UTC) I change my vote to 'abstain' as long as it isn`t cleared up, thanks for pointing the Wattage issue out kjkolb. --Isolani 11:39, 3 November 2005 (UTC)
• Comment No vote because I'm not sure of the policy on radio stations, but is 'potential' audience really relevant? Something's potential audience can be huge but that doesn't mean anyone watches/listens to it - websites are the extreme example of this. --Last Malthusian 10:59, 3 November 2005 (UTC)
• Delete: that's why I didn't vote keep. Even the most non-notable station in a big city has a big potential audience (though some have such a small range, it might not be that big). I'm voting delete for now because it doesn't make sense for a notable radio station to have such a low transmitting power. It's only 20 Watts. The well known local FM stations in my area are 3,000 to 25,000 Watts, and they're not big city stations, which are often more powerful. If someone from the area says it's notable or some other evidence is found, I'll reconsider. -- Kjkolb 11:30, 3 November 2005 (UTC)
• Weak Keep PJM 13:58, 3 November 2005 (UTC)
• Delete. A "potential" audience is not the actual audience; for example, NHL on cable TV in the US has a potential audience somewhere in the neighborhood of 60 million. It has an actual audience generally less than 500 thousand. As for 20 watts, my local (population approx 15000 ppl) radio station broadcasts at 50000 watts.--Scïmïłar ^parley 18:25, 3 November 2005 (UTC)
• Keep. Article claims that this station was the third ever community FM station in Japan. Also claims that it is a leader in the low-power community FM movement and is an 'opinion leader'. To me, that sounds sufficient for it to have an article on Wikipedia. This probably has as much listener-ship as most college radio stations in the US, and it is generally considered that a college radio station is notable enough to have an article. Cleanup of this article would be a good move, though, I think! —Morven 19:02, 3 November 2005 (UTC)
• I'm a keep here. A bread and butter entry. Marskell 22:40, 3 November 2005 (UTC)
• Delete. A 20-watt radio station has a "potential audience of over 800,000"? Leaving aside the nonsensensical handwaving about "potential audience" (every website, by that logic, has a "potential audience" of billions), there's no way 20 watts is going to cover that many residents. Urban Japan may have a high population density, but it ain't THAT high. --Calton | Talk 01:14, 4 November 2005 (UTC)
• Delete per Scimi and Calton. encephalon 01:50, 4 November 2005 (UTC) Further comment. I should have said this earlier. In common with most problematic pages on Wikipedia, this one does not meet WP:V and WP:RS. There is a self referential external link, but there are no references to any independent, reputable publications (newspaper, magazine, book, thesis, monograph or other) that focus on this subject (ie the station): if someone had off-loaded spam onto Wikipedia, it will not look much different. That is the main reason this page should be deleted. In addition to that, the wattage of the station raised concerns about whether the unverified claims and projections might not be entirely incorrect: however, this is a technical issue, and its answer, whatever it is, is of secondary importance to the central weakness pointed out above. Fg2's comment seems to suggest that it is possible for a 20W statio to broadcast as widely as the blurb on the page claims. I'm willing to go along with the claim that this is true in principle, although I'm not convinced that this station actually manages it. Be that as it may, this is peripheral to the problems of the page. My vote remains unaltered. Regards encephalon 01:11, 9 November 2005 (UTC)
  • I've added a couple of external sources now. Probably no one that helps verify the 20W claim, but at least I found evidence for the existence of the station (and a one-hour Portuguese-language programme on it) Sam Vimes 07:38, 9 November 2005 (UTC)
• Keep This is verifiable, honest information. Deleting this article would diminish Wikipedia's encyclopedic nature. For reference, note that the city of Toyohashi has an area of about 260 square kilometers (the same as a circle with a radius of 9 km or 6 mi) and a population of 380,000. Fg2 02:27, 4 November 2005 (UTC)
• Keep per Morven Sam Vimes 09:21, 4 November 2005 (UTC)
• Delete Obviously. If this survives AfD, it needs to be relisted and the nominator needs to a better job pointing out the 20W issue, which is less than a lightbulb. That may, however, be a mistake for 20 MW. Dottore So 12:14, 7 November 2005 (UTC)
  • Comment: a mistake for 20 kW perhaps, but not 20 MW, as that would probably make it the most powerful station on Earth. However, some small stations are actually 20 W or less. I believe the FCC requires a license at 10 W, so unlicensed stations, in the U.S. at least, would be even less. -- Kjkolb 14:38, 7 November 2005 (UTC)
    • lol. Thanks for correcting the error. I believe you are correct about the cut-off; iPod and other digital music player attachments that work over FM are about 10 are they not? And those barely have enough juice to get picked up by a car antenna. It makes a 20w station highly unlikely and definitely not noteworthy.Dottore So 16:42, 7 November 2005 (UTC)
    • Walkie-talkies (hand-held transceivers) are in the milliwatts, and have ranges of a few hundred meters. Radio amateurs, with bigger antennas, can communicate halfway around the world with five or ten watts. Yes, that's comparable to a night light. See this link. A high transmitter tower is a key to success in an FM station. Fg2 21:09, 7 November 2005 (UTC)
• Delete nn Radio station --JAranda | watz sup 02:00, 10 November 2005 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.