Talk:Antifreeze
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"Antifreeze's use is limited to times before the engine is running in cold climates, as friction progressively heats the engine." This is an interesting statement on two counts. (1) antifreeze is a component of the engine coolant at all times. It's present not only to depress the melting point but also to provide anti-corrosive properties against the complex electrochemical composition of the engine. (2) the engine, whether internal combustion or diesel, functions by burning fuel in air in a series of small explosions. This process generates heat. Friction contributes only a very small proportion of the total heat generated.
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[edit] Name change and disambiguation
This disambiguation seems unnecessary since we only have two articles that have been written and one meaning is used far more commonly than the other. This usually calls for a note at the top of the most popular usage instead of a disambiguation page. I suggest that this article be named antifreeze and that its content include antifreeze for engines and probably that of plumbing and deicing (when they get written). A link to the antifreeze protein article could be added to the top of the article or the whole article could be included in the main article if it doesn't get too big. -- Kjkolb 05:21, 19 December 2005 (UTC)
- Agreed, this seems like a "primary topic" disambiguation case. (Properly renaming this requires administrator attention to do the rename/delete/move combo, right?) Femto 11:56, 19 December 2005 (UTC)
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- Yep. Let's see if anyone else has a comment and then we can go throught the renaming process. -- Kjkolb 12:11, 19 December 2005 (UTC)
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- Why not call the article "Engine Coolant", since that is what we in the business call it? --Bearfoot 00:12, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
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- It's apparently used interchangeably, but in my understanding one is the additive and one is the resulting mixture: antifreeze + water = engine coolant. "Antifreeze: a substance, often a liquid such as ethylene glycol or alcohol, mixed with another liquid to lower its freezing point." - American heritage dictionary (there's no entry on engine coolant). Femto 13:07, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
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- Water alone could cool the engine, but antifreeze is added so that the coolant doesn't freeze during cold weather. Once the mixture is in the car, I think calling it engine coolant would be appropriate. -- Kjkolb 10:55, 21 December 2005 (UTC)
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- It also protects against overboiling, however. I think "engine coolant" is more appropriate. — Omegatron 16:00, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
- I like Engine coolant better too, but ........ whatever. H Padleckas 00:03, 15 September 2006 (UTC)
- It also protects against overboiling, however. I think "engine coolant" is more appropriate. — Omegatron 16:00, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
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[edit] Requested move
antifreeze (engine) → antifreeze — primary topic move per talk above Femto 11:00, 8 May 2006 (UTC)
- Support, obviously. Femto 11:00, 8 May 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Photo
In the photo it looks like someone filling his windshield fluid tank with washer fluid (usually blue). It should show someone filling his radiator spillover tank with antifreeze fluid .
- I took the photo. I actually this the man is filling his windshiel fluid tank, now that you mention ir. I asked him, and he said it was antifreeze windshield fluid, so which article should it go into? --HamedogTalk|@ 11:34, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
- It is a form of antifreeze, but not what we're talking about in most of this article. It should go in an article about windshield washers, and we should get a similar picture for here. I can take one if you want. — Omegatron 15:48, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] More on the photo
There is a type of windshield washer fluid that is freeze resistant, most available in the USA are now of that type. The photo should go under "windshield washer fluid" more appropriately than here.
This article deals with fluids that are used in an engine's cooling system.
- I think all washer fluids are freeze resistant. — Omegatron 16:00, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
- Not all vehicle windshield washer fluids are freeze resistant. In the far south, soapy solutions of water are often used. Maybe that cleans the bugs off better. In the north, windshield washer solutions of methanol must be used so the fluid does not freeze in winter. H Padleckas 00:03, 15 September 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Mixture melt temperature
I don't think -40ºF (-40ºC) is the right melting temperature of a 1:1 mixture of ethylene glycol and water, as the article says. In its pure state, ethylene glycol melts at 8,8ºF (-12,9ºC) and water at 32ºC (0ºC), so how come a mixture of both melt at -40ºF (-40ºC). Assuming someone made a mistake with the sign and unit conversion between ºF and ºC, I would say (I have NOT checked it, though) the mixture melts at -4.4ºC (24ºF) (note 40ºF are 4.4ºC).
[edit] Mixture melt temperature - I reply myself :p
Yap, the figure was right( -40ºF). Interesting indeed!!
http://www.gi.alaska.edu/ScienceForum/ASF6/680.html
Maybe a graph like that one should be included here... I think it is very explicative!
[edit] Tasty?
Is antifreeze actually tasty? I find it difficult to fathom something so hopelessly toxic being so wonderfully delicious.
[edit] Melt temperature & tasty
Not many chemists here! There's nothing unusual about a mixture having a phase transition temperature outside the range of its individual components; after all water melts at 273K and sodium chloride at 1074K, but added sodium chloride depresses the melting point of water (see Raoult's Law). Reportedly MEG is very sweet tasting; it is chemically similar to the sugars. --Bearfoot 21:54, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Lots of different colors / Dex-cool
There are apparently a lot of different colors. It would be best if we could make a chart of them all and what they represent. I know the Prestone extended life stuff is a yellowish green and the Dex-Cool is a red/pink/orange. We should try to find what the company calls the color themselves and use that in our description.
I'd also like to see something about Dex-Cool, either here or in its own article, as there were all kinds of class action lawsuits claiming it turned to sludge after a while, didn't work for the time it was said to, ruined components, caused corrosion, etc., but they all seem to be abandoned now. (I'm trying to figure out what the film in my coolant is, which has a mixture of several types and is supposed to have only Dex.) It's impossible to find unbiased, accurate information online. — Omegatron 16:15, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
