Talk:Albinism

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[edit] Search problem

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Can anyone tell me why this entry doesn't come up in the Wikipedia search engine for 'albinism', although it seems to be linked okay to the other four entries there?

It just means that the search index hasn't been updated since the Albinism article was created. By the way, is this article just about human albinism? If so, it should say so. If not, then it needs to make clear which things are general and which apply only to humans. --Zundark, 2001 Dec 16
Clarified point re albinism in humans. --Berek, 2001 Dec 16

[edit] Red eyes?

I was under the impression that albinos can have red eyes (or, perhaps more accurately, eyes that appear to be red). That seems to be supported by the William Blake quotation in this article (assuming it is indeed a reference to an albino): His head and hair were white like wool, as white as snow, and His eyes like a flame of fire. --[anon]

If this is true, it should be mentioned and explained. (Is it perhaps related to the red-eye camera phenomenon; i.e., too much light reflected from blood-rich retinas of relatively-pigmentless eyes?) -- Jeff Q 00:31, 3 May 2004 (UTC)
As of today, no one appears to have responded to my query here (which was, note carefully, whether albinos can have red eyes, not whether all of them do, and why their eyes would be, or at least seem to be, red). Someone added the following line:
The myth that all persons with albinism have "white hair and red eyes" is NOT true.
but this statement, besides being redundant (myths are inherently non-factual), merely claims that not every albino has "white hair and red eyes". It would be still be a true statement if 99.99% of albinos had both these conditions, but no other useful information can be extracted from it. -- Jeff Q 23:45, 17 May 2004 (UTC)
I have seen an albino human with red eyes. And another whose eye irises were pale blue with red meandering radial streaks (likely along large blood vessels in the iris). Anthony Appleyard 16:19, 23 May 2005 (UTC)
Recently, on my twelfth birthday, my aunt presented me with a copy of Dan Brown's 'The Da Vinci Code'. Consequently, I became rather interested in the subject of albinos, as one of the characters - Silas, was one. I heard tell somewhere that albinos can also have purple eyes. Is that true? I am not convinced, as I think it would have been mentioned in the article if it had. 202.156.6.54 00:04, 24 November 2005 (UTC) Autumn's Whisper
I'd like to clear this up, albinos do not have red eyes. I myself and am albino, and I've doen some research on the topic. The reason it seems like we have red eyes, especially in pictures, is because in a certain light, the eyes look red. Most albinos have blue eyes, liek me. Sorry I don't have much more ifnormation, but the myth is false. - 24.62.38.186 21:40, 13 December 2005 (UTC)
Whoever stated above that they are albino and that albino's can't have red eyes, I highly doubt is an albino. To the person below, much agreed, but blue eyes are eyes that lack pigment. The people with red/pink (purple eyes, not violet, let's not get romantic, but by some it can appear purple) actually have a lack of muscle tissue to produce pigment that did not FORM/form entirely. These people you can shine a flashlight into their eyes and have the inside appear hallow and glow. These people are usually blind or nearly.
http://www.campbell.k12.ky.us/programs/gtservice/Thingsforweb/albino11.JPG
[--anon.]
Do you have any citable sources for this information? PS: "violet" is a perfectly appropriate word to me; "purple" to most people means a much darker hue. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 08:06, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Answer regarding red and purple eyes in albinos

Hey fellow albino up there, you're mistaken. I have albino friends who do have red eyes. It's very rare because it means there is almost ZERO pigment in the iris, but does happen. And to the other guy, yes, if the iris are a sort of see-through blue (little pigment) then they can be purple, because the red from the blood vessels and the blue from the iris makes them appear purple. I have also seen one with such eyes, so I have proof (at least for myself). I myself have blue eyes with whiteish radial streaks Allyddin Sane 23:03, 11 January 2006 (UTC)Allyddin Sane

Fully red? I've done a bit more research and have read that some of slightly pink eyes, but I've always heard that the redy eye thing is a myth (And being an albino with blue eyes, it'd be pretty odd to believe it in the first place) Albinos do appear to have red eyes in certain light, like the flash from the camera, explaining the picture (My eyes look very much like that when a picture is taken of me) But, Allyddin, if you saw it, I really can't argue with that.
By the way, albinism.org is a good source on this subject --24.62.38.186 01:08, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
Some persons with albinism lack iris pigment to such an extent that the eyes can look reddish or pinkish under certain lighting conditions, due to light reflecting off the retina. They do not have red- or pink-colored eyes. Likewise the occasional purplish or violet appearance is due to the same effect, but showing though the more common light blue OCA irises (dig around in Google Images for photos of fasion model Connie Chiu for some pics that show this effect.) But again, such people don't have purple-pigmented eyes. I can't speak as to any of the other details mentioned above like the whole eye muscle connection. I agree the article should cover this in more explanatory detail cited from authoriative sources. See #Good news with regard to pics below; hopefully we'll soon have usable photos that show the different eye appearance effect of human OCA. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ
Do the eyes of all albinos shine red in the light? -Ruth-
Everyone's eyes do (cf. the "redeye" effect in flash photography). If you mean do albinistic people have reflectively red eyes under normal lighting conditions, definitely not. I'm not albinistic myself but know two people who are, quite closely; their eyes simply appear reddish pupiled and pale blue irised in one case, and reddish pupiled and kind of pink (or very, very pale blue depending on the lighting conditions) irised in the other; the former has mild nystagmus but not-too-bad vision, the latter has quite poor vision, marked nystagmus and slight lazy-eye. Both require sunglasses outside in the daytime or are very uncomfortable. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 08:00, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Statistics; famous albinos

  • I'd like to see some statistics here on the frequency of albinism, and whether it's more common among particular ethnic groups. Also, are/were there any famous albinos? If so, could we have a list? User:Palefire
I added a bit about what I know... Yellowman is albino. Tuf-Kat 22:58, Aug 18, 2004 (UTC)
I forgot Piano Red was albino too. Tuf-Kat
Frequency info has now been added, but not enough on ethnicity (even if just to say it isn't a factor, but I don't believe that is actually the case; it clearly is a factor with some of the rarer types. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 07:51, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] White cats & Deafness

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There are three ways that cats can be white. Albinism (recessive) is one way and is not linked to deafness. Deafness in white cats is linked to the other two versions, "complete white spotting" (Spotting gene (S), multifactorial inheritance) which can cover the ordinary coat color and the dominant white (W) which also produces blue eyes. Therefore, this article probably shouldn't say that albinism in cats is linked to deafness, as it is the only white cat genetic variant that does not produce deafness in and of itself. aec 22:17, 9 Dec 2004 (UTC)

The counterfactual text is no longer in the article. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 07:50, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Culture

I'm personally thinking that the section on albinism in culture is rather lacking, to say the least. There's plenty that could be written on the subject, fro mthe occoaisional heartless joke in The Simpsons to the way albinos are treated in different countries (revered in some, outcast in others). There's also the current Hollywood trend of making bad guys albino for shock value. There doesn't seem to be much by way of positive portrayal of albinos in popular culture but if any of you guys know of any then that would make a nice addition too.

I agree, the only not-entirely-negitive albino characters I can think of is the character UV from the movie Disturbing Behaviour, and Powder from the movie of the same name. And I am far from happy with Powder. There are also some characters from anime that may deserve a mention. I beleive that Rei from Neon Genesis Evangelion is supposed to be an albino. Also, the character Quatre from Gundam Wing is supposed to be of Arabian descent but is extremely pale.
I agree as well, and there WAS a section about that, but someone has deleted it. This is the entry: 09:27, 28 December 2005 24.24.185.210 (→In the Media - Give me a break, Albino Bias?) I don't know exactly why it was deleted, and I'm not sure whether to put it up again, because this could go back and forth for a while. I'd rather know why it was deleted. Allyddin Sane 23:23, 11 January 2006 (UTC)Allyddin Sane

[edit] Albino bias???

Why was the section about albino bias deleted? Is it NOT true that many movie villains have white or light blonde hair and pale skin? Some even are called "the albino" or "whitey"--is that NOT discrimination against people with albinism??? It wasn't my contribution initially, but I think it's existence was valid and important. Allyddin Sane 11:14, 7 January 2006 (UTC)Allyddin Sane

I agree. The bias section needs to come back, espicially because it discusses albinism in movies. The movie protrayls of albinism is almost universally negitive, from insults hurled at albino characters in Me, Myself and Irene and Wayne's World 2 to portraying them as murderous psychopaths in far too many movies to list. Most people only know of albinism through characters in movies and there is in fact tremendous anti-albinism bias.
Put it back, it's important, especially in the light of The da Vinci Code and Silas. Probably just a hit-and-run anti-"PC"-person. --Hugh7 04:49, 29 May 2006 (UTC)
Also the fact that most albinism suffers have vision problems that preclude driving it can make it difficult for them to find a job. While this is not discrimination against albinism par se but rather discrimination against people with poor vision, it is nontheless an extremely frustrating experience to be repeatedly turned down for jobs you are qualified for on account of it. [-- anon.]
Someone with some time on their hands should go look at that old version and make sure that the restored list isn't missing anything that got deleted (other than negative portrayals, which are covered by their own article, linked to from this one.) And just generally keep an eye out for vandalism of that sort. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 17:21, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "This article is intended to cover mainly human albinism" why?

I am thinking we should have an article called "Albinism in Humans". Or "Albinism in human culture". [--anon.]

why not focus on albinism in general? from an objective point of view, what's so important about human albinos? [--anon.]

Good question... I would think that the article would focus on it in general, and then human an nonhuman being the specific examples later. Beinh human-focused seems bizarre. DreamGuy 03:18, August 25, 2005 (UTC)
Yes, I like this idea. One other thing, the article does not mention how the albinism traits are inheritted, via autosomal (non sex chromosomes) or sex-linked.
This would be very important information to someone that has a biology exam tomorrow :P [--anon.]
For real, I came to this article looking for information about Albinism in animals, and the article is disappointingly sparse on that subject. i.e. does albinism happen in all animals? just mammals? I've heard of albino snakes, are those true albinos? -- GIR 06:16, 10 September 2005 (UTC)
Who cares about albino animals, when was the last time you saw a black person with white skin and blonde hair? I personally find albinism cool (of course sadly they suffer discrimination, medical problems ect..)--King of the Dancehall 02:38, 6 December 2005 (UTC)
Directed towards 'King of the Dancehall'... It's not exactly about whether you care about albino animals(seeing as, obviously, there are others who do care), but that the article should, in a logical and common-sense POV, cover albino animals and plants as well as albinism in humans, seeing as the article is titled 'Albinism' with no mention of the article covering only/mainly albinism in humans. Hm, I hope I'm posting this up right, this is a rather unique way of 'discussion'... XOSAF 03:00, 28 December 2005 (UTC)
Perhaps this results from the fact that affected animals and plants cannot contribute to this page??? I have albinism myself and am interested in spreading knowledge about it in order to MAKE LIFE BETTER for people with albinism and their families. I hope with the info in this article, we can reduce discrimination against people with albinism! Of course, albinism in animals and plants is interesting, but only from a scientific point of view, as there is no discrimination against them. In fact, many people find albino animals "cute", but treat people with that condition very badly.

Allyddin Sane 10:57, 7 January 2006 (UTC)Allyddin Sane

Citing the fact that animals and plants can be albino means that it's something natural for all life, which seems like the sort of understanding which would lead to less discrimination.
Either way, though, the article should discuss all forms of albinism, unless you want a seperate article for *just* human albinos.
ThatGuamGuy 17:38, 27 June 2006 (UTC)sean
I agree, some info would be nice. Albino animals are disproportionately used in research. I don't think it's a coincidence. I'm not saying that albinism itself is the desired trait, but perhaps albinism is a by-product of getting traits desired in mice, rats, etc. And yes, albino snakes are true albinos.
I for one wouldn't mind seeing this split into two or more articles: Albinism, human alibinism, mammal albinism (including human, but not focused on such), and reptile/amphibion albinism. --Hakusa - Wiki addict: 04:24, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
FWIW, I generally concur, but would suggest:
  1. Albinism: general - most of the science should go here, along with the animal pics; it would have a tiny subsection on human albinism and a small pic, and a "See main article at Albinism (human) cross reference. Should also link to leucism, "albino" plants (see next Talk topic below) and other pigment-related stuff, without going into them in detail (should be separate articles).
  2. Albinism (human) - the bulk of the present article, with improvements. Focus on the human element - discrimination, culture, medical advancements, etc.
I empathically do not think we need redundant articles on mammal, amphibian, etc., albinism - there is nothing special or different about the condition in cats vs. frogs. The human aspect of the article needs a lot of work though. There's pretty much no discusson of things like nystagmus damping surgery, the "extreme glasses" (I do not know the technical term) that some OCA suffers can use to legally drive a car, etc., etc. The "world" of the human albino is poorly explored here (I don't mean anything negative about the current content; rather there simply isn't enough of it yet, on enough subtopics).

— SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 17:21, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

what about people that are albinos or mothers who have albino children that know nothing about albinism? i think that there sould be a section about just human albinos.The reson i think this is important is because i have a 1 month old baby and i just found out he is an albino and have no clue on what albinism is or the special care i am probably supose to be giving my child or what to expect in the future. -Ruth-
Ruth, I think you will find http://www.albinism.org very helpful, especially their message board. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 08:18, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Albino squirrel?

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The photo of the brown squirrel jsut looks like a light brown squirrel to me, what exactly about it is supposed to be albino? DreamGuy 03:18, August 25, 2005 (UTC)

Photo has been removed, so this is a moot topic, but to answer the question: Not all albinistic organisms are totally white; read the article. :-) — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 07:48, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Plants?

I was actually looking for information on albino plants (plants without chlorophyll, usually caused by a genetic mutation). Is there another term which is used for this? --68.198.246.166 13:29, 9 September 2005 (UTC)

If you type "albino plants" into Google, quite a bit of information comes up. There are no other terms that I'm aware of, and research on the subject is pretty limited. Since there is no chlorophyll, an albino plant dies shortly after sprouting and there doesn't seem to be a reasonable method of keeping them alive. Supposedly there's a photo of a man keeping albino corn alive, but since it's a black and white picture I don't feel confident in the credibility.--Meghan Dornbrock 18:23, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
If you look at cacti, lack of chlorophyll isn't uncommon in cultivation, although I think the term albinism isn't always applied to it. Some Gymnocalycium and Echinopsis species cultivars without chlorophyll are or have been very popular; keeping them alive by grafting onto some other cactus is easy. Note though that these plants are bright neon red, pink or yellow, since the other pigmentation is still present, and not hidden by all that green.
Come to think of it, plant species without chlorophyll are not that uncommon: Neottia, Orobanche, Monotropa, Lathraea and so on all lack the green, and some of them are wax-colored, indicating no particular pigmentation at all. I don't think the term albinism covers this — "lacking chlorophyll" is the term you usually encounter. -- JöG 20:56, 27 July 2006 (UTC)
I would bet money that "albino plant" is just an imprecise shorthand term that some sloppy webwriters have been using; given that albinism is a disorder of melanin production, it's impossible for plants to be albinistic, because they don't have melanin (as far as I have been able to determine), but use completely different biological pigments. However, if the "lacking chlorophyll" trait/disorder has a name I think it would be a good addition of the article as a disambiguation, after leucism, axanthism, etc. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 07:46, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "Albino": PC or not?

While the most common term for an individual affected by albinism is "albino", most of them prefer "person with albinism"
Could anybody cite the testimony of a real one to back this up? To my knowledge, the only people who claim that "albino" isn't politically correct aren't albino. I'm albino myself, and I believe we have the right to self-determination. —Saric (Talk) 22:40, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

I am an albino, and I call myself albino. Many of my friends, however, dislike that term because they hear it on the streets as in "Hey look at that albino freak over there." We can change it to "some of them" if that's more to your liking, but I think it should stay there because there's no harm in making people aware of possibly hurtful comments. Allyddin Sane 22:50, 11 January 2006 (UTC)Allyddin Sane
There isn't another term that's widely used for albinos (I've never heard one at all, ever). Souns to me like a case of your friends being overly protective. Durahan
All right, I changed "most of them" to "some of them", and "most often used" to "often used". I'm just afraid that the word "albino" might become really taboo. If that happened, English speakers would be left without a one-word phrase to describe people with albinism. That would be bad. —Saric (Talk) 00:46, 13 January 2006 (UTC)
Nah, we'd just use "albinistics" (cf. "bulimics", "paraplegics", etc.) — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 10:31, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
I don't want to make it taboo, but I want to make people aware of what this word can do when it's used thoughtlessly. What's so bad about "person with ablinism"? I will continue to call myself an albino, but when I'm talking about albinism, I say person with albinism. 80.120.193.82 11:24, 16 January 2006 (UTC)Allyddin Sane
I have albinism and I utterly detest the term "albino" partly due to experience in high school, but mostly because it's dehumanizing. I'm a person, not the albino. [--anon.]
Hey I'm sorry, but so few people have albinism that "the albino" is the way many casual acquaintances who don't know you very well are going to know you. It shall be your defining characteristic until or unless they get to know something more unique about you than your albinism and that's all there is to it. [--anon.]

[edit] Women with albinism raped

In any case, what was NOT PC was the phrase in the myths section on Zimbabwe, "this has led to many albino women and even some white women without albinsim in the area being raped." There's no evidence provided to back that up, I never found any information about rampant sexual assault against white women, leading me to beleive this is just some lame bigotry. Durahan

Hey Durahan, just google "albino Zimbabwe" you should get some news articles about it. I didn't want to link or quote it because who knows how long the info stays on these sites. 80.120.193.82 11:32, 16 January 2006 (UTC)Allyddin Sane

[edit] Infertile?

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I was told that albinos are infertile. Seeing as there are several albinos posting here, and that didn't appear to be in the article, I'm starting to think it's false. So: 1) Is it false? 2) Is it, if true, common, rare or absolute? 3) Or is that a myth. And please add your answer to the article.

A while back this was added (and almost immediately removed again): "A common misconception is that albino individual of a species is sterile. This was originally forwarded as a prejudiced myth brought about to incur hatred against albinos(see sections further down). Albinos are fully capable of reproducing, and some reports of abundantly fertile albino individuals have been recorded." Probably for lack of sources. I've added an 'excerpt' of this to the Myths and superstitions paragraphs. -Shai-kun 23:22, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
Thanks. --Hakusa - Wiki addict: 23:56, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
It (the original) was also grossly non-neutral. Anyway, more info on the topic of overall health and stuff (with sources) has also been added now. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 07:41, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "Blondes are albinos."

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Cross posted from the blonde discussion forum:

"WTF?! who deleted the picture of the boy with platinum blond hair that I had?-busboy 03:12, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

"I wasn't the one who deleted it but I can imagine it was due to the fact that the boy did not have platinum blonde hair, but white hair due to albinism. The picture was also featured on the page for albinism in humans. Despite that someone said in here that they think light blonde hair/people are a type of albinism, albinism and being blonde are two VERY different things. A blonde person lacks pigment ethnicically and can pass down these colors. It is very possible for a person of northern European descent to be born so extremely fair that they have pale skin, white hair and blue eyes and NOT be albino. Albinism is a genetic defect that both normal colored parents must have and pass on to a child. If that child has children one day, unless they have children with someone else carrying the albino gene, their children have normal coloring. Same can not be said for the pale blonde person. So I can only imagine that was the only reason the picture was taken down, but I'm NOT possotive on the motive because I didn't remove it.
But I do stand by albinism not being the same as being born blonde. ;) Being blonde is not a form of albinism."

"Actually, depending on which type of blonde you are talking about it is. The yellow-haired toddler on this page has OCA2 or a subtype of OCA1 in conjunction with ocular albinism. It is even said on the albinism page that, people with albinism can have dirty blonde or light brown hair. Various subtypes of OCA1&2 exist mostl among whites, scince all blondes are some type of albino."busboy 16:50, 3 May 2006 (UTC)

"No, not depending on what type of "blonde" I am talking about, being born ethnically blonde and being born ALBINO are not the same thing. There is a difference between a "blonde" person and a "person with blonde hair." A person of African ancestry can have albinism and have blonde, or even white hair, (and rarer cases of red) and still not be a "blonde". And there is a HUGE difference between occular albinism (the dirty blonde/light brown hair you're talking about which only affects their eyes and not their skin and hair) and occulocutaneous albinism. Having blonde hair means you have Scandanavian ancestry, no matter what nationally you are, even if your family has lived in Japan for x amount of generations and you consider yourself Japanese. Albinism is a condition. No, all blondes are not some type of albino, please understand the difference between pigment (think of it as contrast) and melanin (think of it as hue/saturation, what makes red hair red and blonde hair yellow), and that albinism is a condition which must be diognosed by an eye doctor (sometimes even as late as 18 people are diagnosed). I know a few blonde people I can take to an eye doctor and they can have perfectly normal eyes, no matter what color, or even if they are near/far sited and still not have the condition known as albinism." [--anon.]
Busboy, you are definitely incorrect on this topic ("all blondes are some type of albino"), and bordering on trolling. See [1] for some facts. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 17:21, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] History

I have a question. Why is there no information on the history of albinism? I know it may not seem that important but you should have some form of a brief medical history on albinismit comes in handy when doing reports. [--anon.]

Might be an interesting addition, but sourceable information on the topic is pretty sparse. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 07:34, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Category?

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This article appears to be uncategorised. Category:Congenital genetic disorders could be appropriate here? --apers0n 09:17, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

I've changed it. :) NCurse work 06:43, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] White ppl

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Dont they come from albino blacks thousands of years ago? — Deananoby2 (Talk | contribs)

Um, no. See Human genetic variation. While the core human genome almost certainly derives ultimately from Africa, the origin of the so-called "races" doesn't have anything to do with albinism, and "white people" are largely a western-migratory split-off of central Asians mingled with older Pre-Indo-European populations who may have been in Europe since the last Ice Age (depending on which theory you prefer, both Asians and indigenous paleolithic Europeans were descended from different groups migrating out of Africa, or even the "native" Europeans may have been descended from an earlier west-moving group of Asians). "Caucasian" people are, like the Japanese and other north Asians, lighter-skinned than equatorial peoples apparently because they simply don't need the sun protection, and thus over a long period of time evolved away from producing what for them would have been excessive amounts of melanin pigment. Cf. genetically caucasoid populations in southern India, who are much darker than Europeans generally and even than many northern (cooler climate) Indic populations. Compare also the skin tone of Polynesians, ethnic Filipinos and others farther east and south to that of central-east Asians in China; the complexion of Amazonian Natives to that of North American First Nations, etc. Basically, the closer you get to the equator (when speaking of populations who have been indigenous since prehistory), the darker the skin tone is, to protect against the more direct UV radiation of the sun (there are always exceptions of course - Australian Aboriginals are quite a bit more southerly than equatorial Africans but quite dark when not hybridized with European genes; but they also colonized an area that is basically a desert, with little cloud cover for most of the year). Personally I don't think anyone has an adequate theory yet why certain populations become much paler than others, such as Scandinavians and true Russians (by which I mean ethnic Russians in the area historically known as Russia, not Soviets or Russian Federation citizens in general, who are from a wide variety of ethnicities) - despite being commonly thought of as "extra-White" they have even more definitively Asian genes, on average, than most other Euopeans due to historical invasions of Huns, Avars, Tatars, etc. See also the Japanese who on average are paler than Koreans at roughly the same latitude (and especially see the Ainu, a unique and even paler ethinicity that lingers in a few places in modern Japan). Native North Americans have lived at climes just as temperate-to-cold and northerly as the aforementioned groups for seemingly about as long a period of time, but are uniformly darker than the Old World populations. The climate effect is clearly just one factor among many, with gene dominance being the prevailing one. If you sent a million Irish to a desert-and-jungle planet and a million Congolese to an ice planet, I do not believe that if you returned in fifty thousand years you'd find they'd traded skin tones. Rather, they'd probably both be a medium color, on the way to evolving to suit their environment better, and most of their non-hue-related ethic features would remain unchanged (though probably not all of them - some traits are probably genetically linked to others.) And to come full circle, the albinism gene woud not have helped those on the ice planet in evolving toward producting less melanin - the albinism gene almost certainly causes too many problems for it to be naturally selected for - the vision deficits easily cancel out, in surivability terms, the benefits of not wasting bodily resources generating unneeded pigment. Would an "anti-albino" hyperpigmentation gene do well on the hot planet? Dunno. I have not read up on hypermelanism at all, so I don't know if comes with any negative side effects the way albinism does, and it is (as a genetic disorder; I'm not speaking of an ethic tendency toward a darker shade that some other ethnicity) very rare in humans anyway, much more so than albinism. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 10:50, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
Well if it was about the equator at all than how come eskimos are darker than USA native americans? and how come Sami ppl are darker than germans? — Deananoby2 (Talk | contribs)
[Replying on Deananoby's talk page] — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 19:12, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] PIC????

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I've always wondered, what caused the people in the family in that poster to have such incredibly huge hair? Was it done up that way as part of a stage performance or something?

Yes. Albinistic people don't naturally have bigger hair than normal! — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 22:05, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

This article needs a photograph of a person with albinism. The dumb old drawing seems like a curiosity and more appropriate to a freak show page or something. I say this because it tells me more about a certain historical family and the way they dressed and grew their hair, the way old drawings look, etc. than about the way albinism looks. The initial picture should be as narrowly informative as possible about the subject at hand. This drawing is not only off-topic it also does not get across well what albinos look like. I think from this picture albinos are identical to regular humans only they have copious amounts of white hair which a long time ago at least they styled in outrageous fashion.172.129.224.17 10:26, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

Should we put this image in the article: Image:Queen Two on TunHwa S Rd Taiwan Pride 2005.jpg? NCurse work 06:45, 15 July 2006 (UTC)
Yes but, a cropped version showing our intended main subject centrally; the foreground parade stuff is of no relevance, and turns the pic into a "Where's Waldo?" excercise. I'd keep some of the people next to her, for contrast, of course. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 18:24, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
Done. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 09:56, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Good news with regard to pics

I'm working with photographer Rick Guidotti of PositiveExposure.org to get some of his images up here on Wikipedia or better yet Wikimedia Commons. For those unaware of him, he's by far the most proflific photo-documentor of albinism (and vitiligo, etc.) Some of his work is in a fashion vein, but he also does a lot of more documenary-style work. We should pretty soon have some properly licensed photos to use in this article showing various phenotypic effects of albinism in a variety of ethnicities, if all goes well. That embarassing 1800s painting can go away! — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 17:21, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

Update: Still working on this. Guidotti is receptive; we've both just been busy with real, non-WP life. Delayed but not forgotten. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 09:53, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Rei and Kaworu listed as albinos?

Uh, last I checked anime characters could have weird hair/eye colors without being considered albino. Rei Ayanami and Kaworu Nagisa of Evangelion are listed as being albinos in pop culture, but I'm pretty sure that's not the case.

I agree. I've never heard anything about that. I'll remove them. --Gero 12:53, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
Hold on. Quote from the Talk:Evil albino page: "About Rei Ayanami, I think that she can be considered an albino because she haven't only white hair and pale skin, but also red eyes, a tipical color of albino's eyes in movies." [sic] I'd keep Rei here, then; clearly intended to exaggeratedly represent someone with albinism. No opinion on Kaworu. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 10:49, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Research

I'm an author doing research for a vampire book, and I have to ask: Is there some kind of super-extra-strength sunscreen that some people with albinism use for extended periods? Cam 05:28, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

Sunscreen comes in various SPF ratings, some of them pretty high. But, eh, what do albinistic people and their sunscreen have to do with fictional undead things? Legendary vampires are supposed to be unable to stand the light of day because they are "creatures of the night" in a deeply metaphysical way, so it's kind of silly (even aside from the idea of vampires in the first place) to suppose that they could use some kind of prescription albino or photophobiac sunscreen to escape their banished-from-the-daylight fate. JMO... — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 09:51, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Famous people

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Why was the list of famous people with albinism removed? --buck 19:11, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

I could find no reason why this section was deleted on 28 Oct 06, so I've restored it. --buck 04:45, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Popular Culture

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I'm adding a weasel words tag to that section. It seems that almost everything listed is accompanied by something talking about how "some consider it a positive portrayal because of so and so" followed by "Some consider it a negative portrayal because of so and so" without citing any sources. 199.126.137.209 02:17, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

That's a misuse of the "weasel words" template. What you are concerned about is assertions of fact about what "some people" think and a lack of citations supporting those assertions, not abusively and sneakily non-neutral language, which is what the "weasel words" template is for. If you want to be lazy :-) the template you want is "fact", not "weasel words". Better yet, just re-word the passages to get rid of the "some people"-type of phrasing without losing the information, e.g. "The portrayal could be construed as negative because... yet as postitive in that..." — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 09:47, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
I've restored the {{weaselwords}} template here. The meaning of this template has changed significantly since I last looked at it a long time ago; it does cover "some people think..." language, so it was the appropriate template after all. My bad! — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 19:14, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
I've edited the section substantially to get rid of "some people think" language, yet still convey that opinions can be divided in some cases. I've consequently removed the {{weaselwords}} template, though of course someone else can re-add it if they don't feel that the edits resolved the issue sufficiently. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 00:18, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] A controversial vandalism solution proposal

Wikipedia:Semi-protection policy could protect this page from the kind of "ALBIONOS LOOK FUNNIE!!!" vandalism this page gets hit with regularly (most of you probably don't see it "in your face", because it gets reverted fairly quickly, but it happens on a very regular basis, and you can see the reversions of it in the article History.) Applying for this protection would mean that anonymous (IP-address-only, and non-logged-in registered) users, and brand-new registered users, would not be able to edit the page. I'm opening the question of whether others here feel that this article is of enough value, and approaching "good article" status enough, to warrant such a semi-protection request and whether the disabling of anon/newbie edits would be a price worth paying for that protection. (Disclaimer: I am not a WP admin, just an anti-vandalism patroller and regular editor of this article who is tired of seeing it vandalized, and one who has no problem with the idea of disabling or restricting anonyous edits — a "wikipolitical" stance that others may disagree with.) — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 05:48, November 25, 2006

Well, after a few weeks and no issues being raised, it is done. This article is now "semi-protected", which should bring an almost total halt to wiki-vandalism here. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 16:37, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Merge with Evil albino

I'm about to propose a merge of one subsection of this article with another article that is more about the topic in question (though from a negative p.o.v.) I propose that the fictional characters list here be merged with the one at albino bias which is also being merged from evil albino; both of these articles have been the targets of deletion attempts, mainly because the lists in them overlap too much (including with the one here) and no one is "policing" them, e.g. to cite sources. I'll do what I can to merge and cite them into a defensible article. It may eventually fail AfD anyway, but if so, it will be good that this list is no longer in the main albinism article or it too will simply come under attack. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 02:15, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

Update: The "evil albino" article was pre-emptively deleted in an either improper or amazingly coincidental AfD immediately after I unprod'd albino bias and started doing the merge. I have moved for the article to be restored at least until the merge is completed. Please see this undeletion request and add support for having it temporarily restored. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 03:31, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
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