Talk:Al Karak

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[edit] Conflict of Information?

There is a difference between the city and area of Karak and the castle of the same name. This article seems to mix the two. Perhaps two seperate articles or an article clean-up would avert any confusion?

  • Those in Jordan pronounce and spell the name with two a's, as in Karak.
  • Jordanian sources claim that the castle was built in AD 1136 by Payem, the Crusader lord of Karak and Shoubak.

Could someone verify these irregularities? - Cybjorg 13:41, 13 October 2005 (UTC)

Are the city and castle distinct enough to warrant two separate articles? "Payem" is the same as "Paganus" (or Pagan, or Payen), but I'll check on the date...I assume no one really knows exactly when it was built, aside from "sometime during Fulk's reign." Adam Bishop 15:48, 13 October 2005 (UTC)
Which is why I kept the article combined and just separated the information within the article. - Cybjorg 16:04, 13 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Incorrect Spelling

In Jordan the English Spelling is Karak with two a's. In reference to the modern city and governate, it should be spelled this way on wikipedia.

Roc

This is an issue, which is why I added the alternative spelling (with two a's) to the article and the disambiguation page. The article already existed and I didn't feel like moving the article in order to change the title. The spelling that you suggest, however, makes the most sense, as the Arabic language doesn't contain an "e" vowel, and neither should any transliterated word from Arabic. - Cybjorg 05:17, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

Yea I have actually spent extended amounts of time in Karak myself and I know its written "Karak" on all the English signs there. Forgive me, I'm rather inexpirienced with wikipedia or I'd change the title myself.

Roc

Well, it's not really a pure transliteration from Arabic, since "Kerak" is what the (French) crusaders called it and that's where we get it from (although they usually pronounced it as "crac", actually). I'm not sure what to do here since Karak is a disambiguation page, but I think it is usually spelled "Kerak" in English literature, at least literature about the crusades. Can the district in Jordan and the castle be separated into different articles? Adam Bishop 03:08, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

I don't see anything wrong with that. Please take my word that it is spelled "Karak" on a vast majority of the signs in Jordan. Roc

Personally, that's why I added the alternative spelling and created a disambiguation page. If one searches for "Karak" or "Kerak", they will arrive here. - Cybjorg 05:47, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

Thanks -Roc

Doesn't it need a hyphen, al-Karak? Adam Bishop 03:07, 21 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Map

Does someone have a map showing where this is? The Jade Knight 20:45, 23 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] The correct spelling for both the city and the castle

I am coming originally from the KARAK city in the southern part of Jordan.

The offecial name of the city is "Al Karak" or "Al-Karak". In Arabic the phrase "Al" is an article (similar to 'The' in English, or 'Der, Die, Das' in German), thereofor it is quit common to refer to the city with/without the article "Al".

You defenitly need to know that the name of the modern city is always written with two a's.

The castle name is "Kerak Castle", or with the article "Al-Kerak Cast", notice the 'e'.

For further information check http://www.jorgetutor.com/jordania/karak/karak1.htm

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