Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard

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Contents 1 Are you sure that this is the page you are looking for? 2 Dispute resolution 3 Using this page 4 User:Dudedontworry 5 Unblock tennislover 6 User:Thelaststallion 7 User:Berkeley City College 8 Giano on the radio! 9 Death Threat Accusation 9.1 Solution 9.2 A suggestion 9.3 More drama 9.4 Olive Branch 10 Should admins be held accountable for false info and copyvios in user sandboxes they help move to articlespace? 11 Closing a withdrawn AfD 12 Impersonator? 13 Darin Fidika block 14 E.Shubee block 15 Believed Vandalism 16 Username issue? 17 User:John Hyams (possible botched user renaming) 18 Shyam Bihari and images 19 Editor Impersonator? 20 Inappropriate username 21 Class assignment to edit Wikipedia 22 Openserving 23 Shared IP verification 24 Category:Wikipedia protected edit requests 25 Spam surveys on talk pages 26 I reported a user for vandalism earlier but I'm not sure what happened afterwards 27 Problem with Upskirt images 27.1 Downblouse 28 HELP - I can not believe 29 Request for External link on Protected Page 30 Sysop bot proposal 31 Sanghak continuing to upload images with no source information 32 Consensus on vandalism user subpages? 33 Closing Poll: "Ryūkyū" instead of "Ryukyu" 34 Requesting admin resolution of sockpuppet/meatpuppet accusation 35 Indefinite Block of User:XP

[edit] User:Dudedontworry

Dudedontworry (talk • contribs) is creating a large number of articles about pianists, originally copyvios which have been deleted and replaced by one-paragraph stubs which rarely claim notability, and then don't prove it. No reliable sources are cited. All seem to have been the former students of Heather Slade-Lipkin, who might be notable if there were reliable sources who said so. I think that without reliable sources, most of these articles need to be removed. Opinions? User:Zoe|(talk) 20:13, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Anybody? If this isn't addressed, I'm just going to start speedying all of these articles. User:Zoe|(talk) 22:15, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

He's down to one-sentence stubs. At least he quit posting copyvios.... I can't tell whether he's a well-meaning but confused fan, or whether he's involved with publicity for this group of musicians. Sigh. FreplySpang 18:07, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Uh...

Just a guess, but this and this and this and this and this and this and this and this and this and this and this and this probably should be deleted.

I am a reliable source

Grow up Zoe. I am an academic researcher. My sources are excellent, in that they come directly from the musicians. I am the source. All information is researched by me. If you think that information can only be reliable, if it has been published elsewhere than on wikipedia, then you are insane. If that were true, then original advice a qualified lawyer provides on law would be regarded as no good, simply because he hasn't published his knowledge in a book somewhere other than wikipedia first. Equally, your attitude would also regard all previously unpublished research on AIDS/HIV as no good, simply because it hasn't yet been published by other publishers. That attitude is lunacy. Facts are facts. Research is Research, even if it is to date unpublished, my research is still valid and reliable. Wikipedia will never get anywhere if you continue to harass individuals, just because they know something that YOU do not.

Dudedontworry 05:24, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Zoe"

Contributing to Wikipedia is Futile

In contrast to Wikipedia, regular publishers are happy to publish original contributions or research, and it is also normal to be allowed to quote other sources already in existence. Given that Wikipedia neither appears happy to publish original research, nor information quoted (and referenced/sourced) from elsewhere, and the extraordinary negativity of many of its administrators, who appear to enjoy berating contributing individuals for their contributions to Wikipedia, and yet also appear to assume that it is my full time activity, when in fact I am busy with my own 'real' life of academic research, and only contribute as and when time allows, the conclusion that contributing to Wikipedia is a futile exercise, looms large. If this is how Wikipedia wishes to treat contributors, then Wikipedia's future is in doubt. I for one am appalled at User/Zoe's attitude towards my contributions, and feel deeply offended by User/Zoe's threats to block me from contributing/editing, it is not I who vandalises, it is User/Zoe (et al) who came along and vandalised many hours of my efforts to contribute in many fell swoops, repeatedly. It appears some are quick to criticise, and eager to delete the work of others, with scant regard for the time and effort that was freely given. If this continues, I will delete everything I have contributed myself, and publish elsewhere with publishers who respect the fact I am a reliable source, and where there is commercial remuneration for my work.

Dudedontworry 05:23, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Laughing_Man"

If we didn't have rules about original research, Wikipedia would be full of all sorts of nonsense. We are an encyclopedia, not a publisher of original content. It is not our task to verify what is notable and what is accurate from contributors of original research. If you want to contribute here, follow the policies that have developed over time for good reasons. All of us, including admins have to follow those same policies. You are invited to contribute here, but sorry, you can't do so under your own set of rules. Cheers, NoSeptember 05:44, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

{{db-author}}

Dudedontworry 16:20, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Laughing Man: thank you for your assistance (please ensure all my contributions are deleted, and my user accoung/page)

Laughing Man is only person at Wikipedia who seems to talk any sense. I thank him for his suggestions and aid. I would be grateful if you could ensure (as you know I am trying to do) that all articles that I wrote and contributed, are deleted from Wikipedia, and that my user account is also deleted. Wikipedia's contribution rules are just too lunatic, for an academic researcher such as myself, who is used to being able to publish his findings. I am used to having my original academic research papers received with gratitude, warmth and delight.

I am not used to a publisher suggesting that I am not a reliable source. It appears that User:Zoe does not understand the concept of original research being reliable, and if User:Zoe were in charge of all the publishers in the world, humanity's recorded knowledge would never have accumulated, as User:Zoe wouldn't even accept the first caveman to discover how to make fire as a reliable source, never mind a Phd Academic Researcher's reliablity as a source of original research.

It is therefore serendipitous that professional publishers do understand that an academic researcher such as myself is a very reliable source. Adieu.

This page may meet Wikipedia’s criteria for speedy deletion. The given reason is: This page was mistakenly created, no one other than its original author has made substantial edits, and he or she requests its deletion or has blanked the page. (CSD G7). If this page does not meet the criteria for speedy deletion, please remove this notice. Administrators, remember to check what links here, the page history (last edit), the page log, and any revisions of CSD before deletion.

Dudedontworry 16:36, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Laughing_Man"

may want to look at WP:OWN--Hu12 16:48, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

"I am used to having my original academic research papers received with gratitude, warmth and delight." What academic institution are YOU working at? :) A Train ^{take the} 17:02, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

We are an encyclopedia, not an academic journal. Journals publish original research, encyclopedias don't. It's that simple. See WP:NOR. —bbatsell ¿? 17:07, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Also Wikipedia is not a publisher of original thought--Hu12 17:09, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Unblock tennislover

An additional checkuser was performed on Tennislover (talk • contribs) at Wikipedia:Requests for checkuser/Case/Cute 1 4 u. Based on this, I would like to assume good faith and unblock Tennislover (though obviously not Cute 1 4 u). However, I would like some reasonable amount of consensus before doing so. This is a particularly difficult case and I want to avoid even the possibility of a wheel war. Given that Twister Twist appears to have been a sockpuppet of Tennislover, I may be a bit hasty. But given the situation and given Tennislover's extreme patience and civility during this process, I believe an unblock and a general-Wikipedia-apology to be appropriate. I am not asking or demanding that the blocking admin apologise, however, as policy seems to have been followed appropriately; instead, whoever unblocks this user (myself, if I do) should extend an apology to the user. --Yamla 22:01, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

It is fairly obvious that User:Sweet Pinkette and User:Tennislover are in contact outside of Wikipedia. Both have also been "cleared" from suspicion as sockpuppets of User:Cute 1 4 u, however, this connection is still suspicious overall. Since User:Sweet Pinkette is not blocked, I think User:Tennislover should be unblocked as well (pending explanations for actual sockpuppet accounts of Tennislover), but I do still hold some reservations about the character behind this account. -- Renesis (talk) 22:27, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Support the unblock on the grounds that he is not Cute 1 4 u. Not taking into account any other actions. Viridae^Talk 06:05, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

User:Sarah Ewart did the unblock already. User:Zscout370 ^{(Return Fire)} 08:31, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Yes, sorry guys. I wasn't aware of this thread until just now. I unblocked on the basis of the inconclusive checkuser. Sarah Ewart 16:28, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] User:Thelaststallion

Thelaststallion (talk • contribs) continues to add increasingly nonsensical variations on the theme "Richard Wright is cool" to Richard Wright (politician). My request for Thelaststallion to desist ([1]) was met with quite a dismissive attitude ([2]) and further insertion of nonsense, this time referencing the "Intergalactic Council on Coolness" ([3]). Could someone with a bit more patience and tact than myself help convince Thelaststallion that his additions are not, in fact, improving Wikipedia? Thanks! -- Jonel | Speak 23:59, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

I just gave him a {{test2}}. User:Zoe|(talk) 00:03, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

And now he has just been given a {{test4}} User:Zoe|(talk) 19:19, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

He seems to have brought all his friends, both to Dr. William M. Scholl College of Podiatric Medicine and Richard Wright. -- Jonel | Speak 06:20, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] User:Berkeley City College

User:Berkeley City College - is this userpage appropriate? It's pretty much an ad for BCC. S/he's converted the Berkeley City College page to the same ad for BCC, which I've reverted. Argyriou (talk) 00:18, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Appears to be copyvio of official website[4], plus copyrighted photograph cannot be used on user page, only in article if necessary and fair use, blah blah blah. Can I blank it? Can I? Please, someone tell me I can blank it, and don't anyone do it before me. KP Botany 00:32, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Go for it. I'd personally comment it out and ask the user if I thought they'd take it the wrong way, or if the opposites were true, {{db-spam}}. 68.39.174.238 00:41, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

User:Berkeley City College has replaced the article at Berkeley City College several times, also. See their talk page, and mine. Argyriou (talk) 00:43, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

I've removed two "fair use" images from the userpage and left a note on their talk page explaining my edit and the rationale behind it. Someome else may want to suggest a username change as the current one may not be legit. 68.39.174.238 00:46, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

User has reverted your edits. In comment to my userpage, s/he claims to be part of promo dept of BCC. Argyriou (talk) 00:50, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Well, don't hold this against me, but I blanked the user page, and put a note on the user talk page, and really enjoyed it. I have always wanted to blank a Wikipedia page, and, it's not that I'm scared to, it's just that it's pointless and pretty much in the top 3 of most boring acts of vandalism on Wikipedia. The user is asking for help, someone outside can explain the situation. My note did explain the copy vios, the non-fair-use of a copyrighted picture on a user page, and plagiarism issues. KP Botany 00:59, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Tey reverted it. I get to do something even more fun- the blank-and-protect. RyanGerbil10(Упражнение В!) 01:17, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

The user tried a workaround by duplicating their page at New Berkeley City College (which I redirected). I hope this isn't a trend. --Calton | Talk 05:42, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

I should have also asked if the username is appropriate, or should be disallowed. There is no evidence that User:Berkeley City College has the right to represent BCC to Wikipedia. Argyriou (talk) 01:14, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

It should be disallowed. According to the criteria on WP:USERNAME, a trademarked name with no sign of permission is not allowed. -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 01:18, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

I've issued a {{Username-Warn}}, in addition to a test3 for image removal. Argyriou (talk) 01:26, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Giano on the radio!

I have been contacted by a producer with a public radio show called Weekend America. Who is looking into a story about the ArbCom elections and was wondering if I might have a few minutes to talk about my experience in Wikipedia. Tempted and amusing as that might be, I have strong feelings on blabbing to the media and those that do it, but does Wikipedia have a policy on this? I'm sure I am not the only obe to be singled out Giano 07:14, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

I don't know whether Wikipedia has a policy already, but I don't see the harm in it and I think that openness can only benefit us. If there's media interest in the ArbCom elections, the best course of action is to be honest and forthcoming, and do what we can to ensure that the coverage is fair. Clamming up makes it more likely that it won't be. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 07:30, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Curious. Giano, did the producer explain how they came to select you? (→Netscott) 07:34, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, why not me? I actually LISTEN to the show! In any case, go for it. --Calton | Talk 08:08, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Since we have some suffrage for the arbcom voting, I do not see the problem. I would be worried if an AfD or RfA advertised in the big media Alex Bakharev 08:18, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

• I've no idea why they chose me, cos I'm more horrible than you I expect! Is it real station then, I though it may be a hoax? Anyhow, I have enough experience of these things to know than a "nice happy story is no story" They want my "experience of Wikipedia" but I expect it will be all about Kelly Martin's arbcom result and behaviour etc, and the "Giano case" Neither of which are Wikipedia's finest moments. They are hardly going to want to discuss Palladian architecture are they? (Which is what I like talking about) No I shall leave it to others - interesting to see who though! Anyway they want me to phone them, and I'm certainly not spending megabucks on transatlantic phone calls. You lot would never understand my vowels anyway. I'll forward their email to Jimbo and he can tell them how marvellous the place is - especially the architecture section etc etc etc. Giano 08:51, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Tell them to phone "the co-founder, Jimmy Wales". That should give them a story... yandman 08:54, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

• Neille i (talk • contribs • logs • block user • block log) has been asking arbcom candidates on-wiki to beinterviewed. Blnguyen (bananabucket) 09:02, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Well, I'm not an arbcom candidate - heaven forbid, so I can't immagine what they want to know Giano 09:06, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

• I have no qualms about giving interviews to the media. See for example [5], I was picked because of this I believe. Sure, go for it, and be honest in your answers. :-) Sjakkalle (Check!) 10:52, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

That is hilarious! Jimbo recreated it two minutes later, with a rather endearing edit summary: [6]. Are you saying doing the interview was a form of punishment? :-) Carcharoth 13:14, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

It is a real radio show, at least. If the story comes off it will probably be available on podcast, too. [7]. Thatcher131 12:31, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

The only concern is whether you know the questions in advance or not. I've into this before w/ David Gerard and pshapiro and that's why i am bringing this concern here. There may be tricky questions waiting for you Giano. Is it possible to check if you can get those questions in advance? -- Szvest ^{Wiki me up ®} 12:39, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Giano, I say go for it, I'm sure they'll call you for the actual interview. And yes, tell them about the architecture and how the articles are getting written. If they try to focus on the drama, just tell them that Wikipedia's internals being more transparent than their company's doesn't mean that we have to discuss our dirty laundry with outside players any more than they do. Zocky | picture popups 16:20, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

• No, They would almost certainly want the drama, not the architecture. I shall not be commenting. Eeverything I do is above board and onwiki, that way others have their chance to comment legitimately and a right of redress. It is not my style to talk about others only when I know I am safe from reproach. If asked about certain subjects I would have a problem maintaining my usual kind disposition especially as the "IRCadmin" gang are now travelling on tour in a charabang hectoring voters at [8]. I'm not sure why they are called "elections". On Wikipedia they always seem more akin to those in dodgy countries, where one cast one's vote at one's peril. Giano 08:47, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

I would have a problem maintaining my usual kind disposition especially as the "IRCadmin" gang are now travelling on tour in a charabang hectoring voters ... ah, classic Giano. It never gets old. Never. --Cyde Weys 21:04, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

• No, and it never will so long as we have "Bonnie and Cyde" to point out the error of out votes and ways. Giano 08:27, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Death Threat Accusation

[edit] Should admins be held accountable for false info and copyvios in user sandboxes they help move to articlespace?

As the topic states. Should admins be held accountable for false info and copyvios in user sandboxes they help move to article space? WP:RM says no discussion of moves. I added a general comment to one proposed move (not discussing the move itself!) that since the person requesting the move has a proven history of copyvios, the moving admin should check the article before performing the move. Is this legit? And should they get in trouble should there indeed be copyvios? – Chacor 16:06, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Please consider WP:AGF, both on the part of the author of this article and on the part of the admin. Nobody on Wikipedia has mindreading software ... if a page isn't an obvious copyvio, an admin can't be expected to magically know that it is. BigDT 16:19, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

I'm confused by all this talk of "held accountable", but a simple note saying "hey, would someone please check this for copyvio, they user has a record" seems appropriate, although I wouldn't be too annoyed if anyone missed this. Morwen - Talk 16:21, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

I meant that if admins missed it, should they be warned about copyvio just as a normal editor would be? Should they [not?] be held as accountable as an editor if that happens? And to BigDT: It's not difficult to copy and paste two random sentences from the article into google. – Chacor 16:22, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

I do not think that this is a big deal unless it is a chronic problem. Many veteran editors and admins have edited articles repeatedly without realizing that they are copyright violations, even when it is clear to anyone paying attention that it is a copyright violation. Once, a prolific editor added wikify tags to hundreds of copyright violations (I suspect that he or she was watching new pages/recent changes or went through the articles on Wikipedia:Dead-end pages). That is the kind of case where someone should be asked to be more careful. If someone misses an extremely blatant copyright violation (such as the article saying where it came from and/or the word "copyright" appearing in it) or misses several less blatant but still obvious copyright violations, I would consider leaving a message on their talk page. -- Kjkolb 16:52, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Who's warning admins about copyvios when their only edit is a pagemove? Guy (Help!) 17:04, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

No. The responsibility for adding copyvios is the contributing editor. EVula // talk // ☯ // 17:18, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Chacor, if you have a specific knowledge of a copyright violation (as you allege at User talk:Storm05/Tropical Storm Fabian (1991)), you should take it immediately to Wikipedia:Copyright problems. No one else is going to do the footwork for you. – Anþony  talk  18:40, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Closing a withdrawn AfD

Would it be possible for somebody to close this AfD as the nominator wishes to withdraw but probably either does not know how to or is unsure whether they should. I'm not sure whether I should because I am a non-admin who has expressed an opinion (or two) on the matter. Thanks awfully. :) Bubba hotep 17:24, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

I'd advise waiting for the AfD to reach its time limit; there are 'delete' !votes higher up, although it seems that many of them may now be obsolete. The withdrawal and the change in the article during the !vote should be taken into account by the closing admin. --ais523 17:42, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

OK, sounds good to me. Bubba hotep 19:12, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Impersonator?

I just noticed a user without any user page editing Red Hot Chili Peppers with account name User:Werdna101. The edits were bad, so I think it's someone impersonating User:Werdna. Not sure where to post this, so adding it here. Nihiltres 17:57, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Now indef-blocked. (aeropagitica) 18:38, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

The name "Werdna" gets thousands of hits on Google. We even have an article for it on wikipedia. I don't think this was an intentional impersonation. ---J.S ^(T/C) 19:27, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Still a valid username block either way, though. --Sam Blanning^(talk) 23:41, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Agreed. HighInBC ^{(Need help? Ask me)} 23:46, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Darin Fidika block

Darin Fidika (talk • contribs)

Just posting a notice here regarding my indef block of Darin Fidika due to his persistent and unrepentant abuse of Wikipedia copyright policy. Mangojuice and I have been cleaning up a huge mess of over 700 articles which were plagiarised from various locations around the net. Despite the magnitude, we decided to give Darin a chance to clean up his act and contribute without violating copyright. However, he has continued to upload obvious copyvio images from other sites on the web, and has been warned multiple times to stop doing so. Therefore, I've indef blocked him as it seems extremely unlikely that he's ever going to change his ways. ···日本穣^{? · Talk to Nihonjoe} 19:13, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] E.Shubee block

This editor has challenged the unblock request review of a user block I performed. The basis for the challenge is that the reviewer removed three links that the editor had provided as evidence in his unblock request. In order to be perfectly fair to the guy, I'm linking to his challenge here.[17] Durova^Charge! 21:58, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Since this editor can't post here (he's blocked), he's asked me to clarify that it's only the blanking of his links that he challenges. Durova^Charge! 23:47, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

This looks like that whoever did the unblock decline accidentally copy-and-pasted the formatted text, not the wikimarkup. Morwen - Talk 09:40, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Believed Vandalism

On the Cambridge City, Indiana page, someone has added a "not needed" paragraph on the "School Systems" part of the page. (It is underneath the school's website link.) I know this is not true and would delete this myself but don't know if there's a way to find out who did this. Thanks! MusicGirl21 22:14, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

I've reverted some vandalism. You can find the username or IP address of the vandal by looking in the history tab of the article. Read Wikipedia:Vandalism for the procedure for warning vandals; after a few incidents, you can report the vandalism to WP:AIV (rather than here). Argyriou (talk) 22:44, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

I clicked on the IP address and it looks like that same person has also done some vandalism on the Fountain City, Indiana page too, under the "Geography" section. (It is the last paragraph in that section.) Thanks for the help! MusicGirl21 23:01, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for letting us know! In the future, feel free to remove the vandalism yourself or revert to a previous version. Thanks again! Flcelloguy (A note?) 03:48, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Username issue?

User:Supervisor Wiki posted a comment on a user's page purporting to be from "tech support." The user, User:Jjohnson 55, seems to be having some attack issues on his page, too. (well to be honest, I've got *no* idea what's going on there, so someone may want to investigate further.) Tony Fox (arf!) 23:23, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

That's fascinating. I believe User:Supervisor Wiki and User:209.81.119.178 are sockpuppets (or perhaps meatpuppets) of User: Russian F, who was harassing User:Jjohnson 55 by replacing his userpage with different pictures of animals. Somehow, User:Bainer 21 is mixed up with all this, too. I'd suggest a short-term block on all except Jjohnson, but I'm not sure. I see that User:Supervisor Wiki has been indefblocked for a bad username, which is appropriate. Argyriou (talk) 23:36, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

I have idefblocked User:Bainer 21 - this is a single purpose attack acount. Alex Bakharev 23:58, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

and User:209.81.119.178 and User: Russian F for 48h Alex Bakharev 00:00, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] User:John Hyams (possible botched user renaming)

I note that an active user, User:John Hyams, has his user and user talk pages redirect to the user and user talk pages of a non-existent user, User:John hyams. This is probably a bad idea for a number of reasons (see User talk:John Hyams#User and user talk pages), and on IRC it was suggested that this was probably a botched or misguided attempt to change usernames. I posted a message about this on User talk:John Hyams but didn't get any response. I'm currently involved in an editing dispute with this user so I don't want to pursue this matter further lest it seem I'm harrassing him, but perhaps an admin could find out what the deal is and guide him through the correct process to change a user name if necessary…? —Psychonaut 00:34, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Actually, no. It looks like he mistakenly created his page under the lower case. He attempted to move it to the proper case, but was reverted by someone who thought he was trying to change his username[18]. Given that, I can understand why he stayed with his incorrect page. I have moved his pages to the correct place, but have left the redirects from the lowercase in place. I believe that the Wikipedia software won't let a new username with only case differences be created anyway and there are inbound links. -- JLaTondre 02:22, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Actually, I take part of that back. He did have his username changed. He just didn't move the page again afterwards (probably because he couldn't delete the redirect left by move revert). -- JLaTondre 02:29, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Shyam Bihari and images

I am very concerned about new administrator Shyam Bihari's work with image and copyright issues. I do not wish to start an RfC, but I would like opinions and help in reaching him, particularly from admins.

I had a long conversation with Shyam a month ago. Mostly, I pointed-out problems with his own uploads, many of which were marked with unsupported copyright tags. I didn't realize the scope of the problem then because many of his uploads had summaries indicating that he was their creator when they were actually taken from websites. Many of the mistakes were a year old, but his responses, even after my explanations, showed a continued lack of familiarity with basic copyright issues:

• He changed Image:Shyam_Bahadur.jpg, a straight reproduction of a copyrighted painting, from free license to free license without reason
• Despite the statement "changing it is not allowed", he retagged Image:SherKhanNasher.jpg as PD
• He tagged several images, such as Image:Bw_mm2.jpg, with GFDL and various Creative Commons tags based on "permission"-type statements

That was November. This past week, I began looking at his activities when my watchlist showed him changing Image:TAC SR6500 ~ Concert Audio Console.jpg to {{GFDL-self}} based on a permission statement from a third party. I reminded him about this issue (here), and asked if he would finish cleaning-up his own uploads. His response did not give me any confidence that his understanding has improved.

Now I see that Shyam has become extremely active in many areas of image administration, deleting {{no license}} and {{no source}} images at an astounding rate (a big problem in its own right as he is not investigating their issues or removing red links from articles), and rendering decisions in nuanced areas like {{no rationale}} and {{replaceable fair use}}. He deleted over 1000 RFU-tagged yesterday, sometimes exceeding 400 per hour! It looks as though he kept images exactly if a comment had been placed on its talk page.

I have suggested to Shyam that he should, at least for the time being, focus his admin work on other areas of the project. He was not receptive to the idea. If others administrators would speak to him —whatever the message— I would really appreciate it. I know we are in great need of admins to work on images, but we need ones that are familiar with the basics of copyright, who know Wikipedia policies, and who are patient enough to think before they delete. Others may also want to review his recent actions, especially the RFUs (marked "keep" in his image contributions and "I7" in his deletion log). ×Meegs 01:27, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Editor Impersonator?

I've had a user come to a board making constant changes. When I left him a personal note on his user talk, he responded to me on his OWN talk page. The only way I knew he did that was I went back to explain another edit I did. I told him that if he needed to leave me a message he needed to leave it for me on MY page, not his. He finally figured it out and posted a message on my page saying something about he would block me because he was an editor. I told him I would report him for both vandalism and harassment because there was nothing to show he was an editor. Then another user, User:Squeakbox contacted me saying that administrators would block me if I reported User:Media anthro saying he wasn't an editor because he really was. Does this sound fishy to you?Americanbeauty415 05:28, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Could you provide diffs for all of the above? It would help speed up any investigation into what exactly happened. EVula // talk // ☯ // 05:42, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Looks like a content dispute on Mulatto (edit history for interest's sake - bit of a hash, really, and is it really sprotected right now?). I think Americanbeauty415 may be confusing "editor" (which we all are) and "administrator" in his comments; there's a vandalism warning on his talk page from Media anthro regarding some of the reversions going on at the article. Also, I don't believe there's a specific policy for talk pages; some folks have notifications that they reply on their talk page, others go the other direction. The article looks to need some work, as the version it's at right now is missing a lead section, for one. Tony Fox (arf!) 06:11, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

It's common practice to respond to comments left on a page, on that same page. Use the watchlist, or just monitor the pages you've commented on. -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 06:15, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

People operate their talk pages in all sorts of ways. Some reply on the same page, some reply on the page of the person who left the comment. I reply in both places, since it avoids disjointed discussion. But it's a point of personal preference, and ultimately it's no-one else's responsibility to make sure you read a message. --bainer (talk) 09:04, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Inappropriate username

There's been a recent vandalous incident on the New Zealand page - not much worth reporting in itself, but the user has what I'd call an "inappropriate user name" - User:Niggers101. Where do I report this, or is this the right place? Grutness...wha? 09:12, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Don't worry - I've found RfC/User names. Grutness...wha? 09:34, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

A better place for such obvious bad usernames would be WP:AIV. Use RfC/User names for cases that are unclear. Jesse Viviano 04:46, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Class assignment to edit Wikipedia

Just wanted to give a heads up about this. A friend of mine considering taking the class brought it to my attention. The assignment is for everyone in the class to make an edit and then to write a paper about it. Incidentally, the teacher suggests people edit List of Oregon State University people, an article I created, so I will of course be keeping an eye out for it but it may be nice to have a few extra pairs of eyes on it just in case someone decides to make an "unhelpful" edit, or even give a few friendly tips to new contributors. VegaDark 10:57, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Well, at least they're not being told to write an article on the school (in true press-release style), which is what usually happens. yandman 11:03, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Unfortunately it doesn't tell people not to create vanity articles. MER-C 11:47, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Yes, it could have linked to WP:NOT, but I still think the overall net effect of this will be positive rather than negative. Who in the hell would vandalize Wikipedia and write a paper about it? Sounds like a guaranteed F. --Cyde Weys 20:58, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

If they would summarize the what they felt was hard, etc., and send it to us, it might be even more helpful. Rmhermen 21:05, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

• Well, this isn't the first time something like this has happened. Wikipedia:School and university projects has all the gory details... Titoxd^(?!?) 21:08, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
• The assignment looked to me to be pretty positive. Emphasis on making a contribution, fixing something up, that sort of thing. Plus you get marks for it, so there's an incentive to do a really good job. It gives examples of the kinds of things, and tells them to look around first. Where's the problem? They get more background before editing than the average newbie, I'd say. Guy (Help!) 21:42, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

• Yes, I expect it in general to be good edits. However I can forsee people adding people to the list that aren't notable enough, unsourced redlinks, etc. that will have to be reverted not as vandalism but simply as stuff we can't accept as is. I don't anticipate much if any vandalism, but it's still helpful to be aware of this, even if only to give welcoming messages to all the people. VegaDark 01:01, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

I just hope Read the policies is amongst the homework. HighInBC ^{(Need help? Ask me)} 01:03, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

If you follow the first link, it will take you to the actual homework assignemnt. I agree with Cyde, this looks like a well organized assignement. Let's add it to the list of known school projects and move on. Johntex\^talk 02:16, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Well, it is interesting to note that the professor, who is probably non-notable, has his own entry. Prodego ^talk 01:10, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Nearly all of the contributions to Timothy Budd were made by Mr. Budd himself as an IP user. 128.193.38.234 (talk • contribs) - the IP resolves to budd.eecs.oregonstate.edu[19] – Anþony  talk  01:33, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

I'm deleting it. An associate professor is rarely notable due to lack of published research and peer reviewed works. Article definitely assert any major notability. Sasquatch t|c 04:47, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

WP:PROF, admittedly a proposed guideline, says that a professor is notable if they've written a textbook that has been used in a college-level course not related to the professor. The guy's written several textbooks,[20] at least one of which I can confirm has been used at my university, unrelated to him. He's also published several journal articles.[21] He may be a borderline case for notability, but deleting it out of hand I think is a bit premature. It should go to AfD at least. – Anþony  talk  06:00, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Why the out-of-process deletion? What was so urgent it couldn't be listed on AfD? —Doug Bell ^talk 06:08, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Why "out-of-process"? Non-notable biographies are speedy deleted on a regular basis. Have you read WP:CSD? User:Zoe|(talk) 16:36, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Have you? "If the assertion is controversial or there has been a previous AfD, the article should be nominated for AfD instead." Agree that the deletion was unnecessary at this point and AFD would be better. – Chacor 16:38, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Openserving

I recently deleted the article Openserving, created by Shemshak (talk • contribs), as WP:SPAM. A few excerpts from the articles: "Openserving extends the essence of the open source model", "You can set up your own collaborative blogging site", and "users can keep 100% of the ad revenue for yourself." I therefore fully stand by this deletion. The reason I'm bringing this up here is that User:Shemshak has written a new article, which again borders on spam. Another issue is WP:WEB. The article doesn't seem to meet it, but I vaguely recall somewhere that wikimedia projects are exempt from the notability criteria. Is that correct? Aecis ^{Dancing to electro-pop like a robot from 1984.} 12:40, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

It's not a WikiMedia project, it's a Wikia project. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 12:44, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Well so far from googling it I have lots of blog chatter, and one article on tmcnews...but I don't know how rigorous that is for meeting the news site criteria (ie is it just another blog too?). I'd like to see more feedback, but I wouldn't object to making it a redirect to Jimbo Wales and put as a note in that article if we can't find anything more substantiative. Syrthiss 12:54, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

I'm redeleting, definitely doesn't meet WP:WEB. Sasquatch t|c 04:42, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Shared IP verification

A quick look at the talk page of 212.219.94.115 (talk • contribs) reveals a lot of vandalism warnings. I've checked the IP, and it is probably registered to Oldham Sixth Form College. I wanted to place a {{sharedip}} template at the top of the talk page, but I wanted to be 100% sure the IP indeed belongs to Oldham Sixth Form College. Where can I verify the IP whois? Pardon my ignorance. Aecis ^{Dancing to electro-pop like a robot from 1984.} 14:13, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

I don't think you can ever be 100% sure. If you're reasonably sure per WHOIS and/or reverse DNS, that's about the best you can do. --Nlu (talk) 14:17, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Incidentally, there is a {{SharedIPEDU}} specifically for schools, if that's what it turns out to be. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 14:19, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

I've now run about five checks, and they all resolve to Oldham Sixth Form College, so I've added the {{SharedIPEDU}} template. Thanks for the help. Aecis ^{Dancing to electro-pop like a robot from 1984.} 14:33, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Category:Wikipedia protected edit requests

CAT:PER has 12 entries, and has been backlogged for ages. --ais523 18:41, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Spam surveys on talk pages

• Sharlene Thompson (talk • contribs • logs • block user • block log) Spamming surveys on talk pages, 16+ so far..

Example:

Health Wiki Research

A colleague and I are conducting a study on health wikis. We are looking at how wikis co-construct health information and create communities. We noticed that you are a frequent contributor to Wikipedia on health topics.

Please consider taking our survey here.

This research will help wikipedia and other wikis understand how health information is co-created and used.

We are from James Madison University in Harrisonburg, Virginia. The project was approved by our university research committee and members of the Wikipedia Foundation.

Thanks,

--Sharlene Thompson 19:41, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

thanks, --Hu12 20:07, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Someone should give her a phone call (number on link provided) and find out if it's legit... ---J.S ^(T/C) 20:32, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

In particular, we should ask what members of the Foundation approved and then confirm. If it was explicitly approved by the Foundation, I personally have no problem with it. —bbatsell ¿? 20:34, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

OTRS ticket #2006073110013565 - Corey A. Hickerson, an assistant professor with JMU, wrote asking if he and Sharlene Thompson could conduct this research, and a member of the Communications Committee approved their request. Raul654 20:39, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Ummm ok then. ---J.S ^(T/C) 21:10, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Sorry for the unwanted messages. I've made a request to the OTRS thread for a review of messages left on user_talk pages. Raul654, who on the Communications Committee approved it? -- Jeandré, 2006-12-15t11:36z

This must be the colleague of Hickerca (talk • contribs • logs • block user • block log), who started out by spamming article talk pages before I advised her to only target user talk pages. For the record, I don't agree with any spam, however well intentioned. But it doesn't look commercial, and if the committee accepted it, so be it. However, I don't think they need two accounts to do this. yandman 07:42, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

My concern is that if the editors targeted for this survey agree. Makes more sense if the sampling group of articles had a survey template so participation can be voluntary, rather than directly soliciting off article edit historys'.--Hu12 12:00, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] I reported a user for vandalism earlier but I'm not sure what happened afterwards

I posted a message at WP:AIV earlier regarding 24.151.106.196. I can see that (aeropagitica) removed my report with the comment "IP vandals blocked. LIST CLEAR." but I can't see any record of anything on the IP's page. This is the first time I've reported someone for vandalizing articles, I'm just wondering if I've missed something. 172.143.63.173 23:42, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

• The block log says they were blocked for 1 hour on Dec 12. ---J.S ^(T/C) 23:49, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

I noticed that previous block by Deville from 2 days ago, but I couldn't find any record of (aeropagitica)'s action today though, as they've vandalized again since the original 1 hour block. 172.143.63.173 00:00, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Put a note on aeropagitica's talk page. Seems like a honest mistake. ---J.S ^(T/C) 00:23, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

OK thanks, I've done that. 172.143.63.173 00:34, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Problem with Upskirt images

I've agonized for a day about what to do here:Upskirt. Please see User talk:Jerkface for details. I would go to a single admin, but it's the second time it's happened. I'm afraid if it's not settled, it's going to go on and on. ThanksNinaEliza (talk • contribs • count • logs • email) 04:44, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Details on this: User:Jerkface has uploaded (and User:CommandoM reposted) several pornographic images to Upskirt. The current set are a bit less explicit than the original offerings, but they seem like probable copyvios. When asked to verify that these pictures are taken by User:Jerkface (as claimed) and posted with the subject's permission (as claimed) the answers are not assuring. Details on User talk:Jerkface. — edgarde 05:39, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

They are not pornographic images, but anyway it doesn't even matter. Because wikipedia is not censored, and as such images should be added where they would be of benefit to the article. Such as is obviously the case with upskirt. The user cooperated with your requests as much as is reasonable, and to claim the answers where not assuring is only true in your own mind. Mathmo ^Talk 05:58, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Given that more than one editor has removed such images -- for more than one reason, I might add -- snarky nonsense about how things are "only true in your own mind" aren't really called for. Not to mention that "wikipedia is not censored" is not an all-purpose carte blanche, either. --Calton | Talk 07:20, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

hmmm... true, perhaps somebody could mis-read what I wrote and take it too seriously. Whatever.. now I'll might add that more than one editor has also added in images to that article. Like the saying goes, a picture is worth a thousand words, and would be very handy in that article for the greater clarity of it. Shouting out OMG look look somebody put "pornography" in that article is also not an all-purpose carte blanche for deletion. Mathmo ^Talk 07:42, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Hmmm, so you didn't write the insulting phrase "only true in your own mind"? My mistake, but that's how it shows up on my computer monitor. How does it show up on yours? --Calton | Talk 08:09, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Heh, going to be picky with one phrase and take it out of context to turn about the meaning? If you are easily insulted then fine, be insulted. I can't do anything about changing your overly sensitive sensitivities. Am not one either to go out of my way to offend people, at worst you might just want to accept I at times state things a little too frankly of how see the world for your likings. Mathmo ^Talk 09:49, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

How exactly is it out of context? It's exactly what you said and it's exactly how you meant it. The reality is that there are laws (not to mention moral issues) regarding taking photographs of someone in a... "compromised state" (whether or not you think it's pornography is irrelevant) and providing the general public with access to them. The truth is that AGF doesn't work in some situations, including ones like this. It's far too easy for someone to take such a picture without the subject's knowledge (or to obtain it from another source) and claim that they have the right to take and publicly post such a picture. This is a legal issue; anything else you throw at it is a straw man. —bbatsell ¿? 16:39, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Downblouse

A similar controversy may exist on Talk:Downblouse. Apparently User:CommandoM is uploading over objections there. I have not been involved in that discussion. — edgarde 05:57, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

If you read the page you will see there is no problem there, as HighInBC said: "The picture was requested, it is topical, it is legal, it illustrates the article, information should not be removed without reason". Mathmo ^Talk 06:03, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Yes, well, I've commented there, but just because there is a request, that does not mean there is a need. I might want to see Julia Stiles with a look of love in her eyes in my bedroom, but that doesn't mean that such a photograph would help the encyclopedia in any way. Geogre 14:38, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

That information is old, I had the image removed after several rude comments, and the whole publicgirluk cufuffle. That was a while ago, so any picture there now needs to be considered seperately. HighInBC ^{(Need help? Ask me)} 16:49, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] HELP - I can not believe

that the picture on the Main Page is supposed to be there. Carptrash 06:38, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Disgusting. How did it get there?! --²¹⁰physicq (c) 06:39, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

am guessing you are refering to treecutoff.jpg? Is deleted now anyways... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Mathmo (talk • contribs) 06:43, 15 December 2006 (UTC).

lol, thanks bot! Was just about to do that myself... Can't fix the main page for you anyway, took a look but you need to be an admin to edit the mainpage. Odd that, remember when that didn't used to be the case... Mathmo ^Talk 06:50, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks. It almost cost me my dinner. Carptrash 06:45, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

I hate to say it, but maybe it's time to completely lock down all high-use templates until our template vandal goes away or we figure out where they're coming from and block the hell out of them. The featured article is one thing, but the main page is very much another. Tony Fox (arf!) 06:47, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

It's still there. Somebody screwed up? I thought the main pages and images it links to are protected. - Merzbow 06:47, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

It was in Wikipedia:Selected_anniversaries/December_15. Dragons flight 06:49, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Calm down everybody, take a deep breath in and out. Is all gone now. Mathmo ^Talk 06:54, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Request for External link on Protected Page

Hi, I am User:Xunit5ive, and I use the online tag reis_lover in the Tenku no Rakuen RPG and I was wondering if you could put the site as an external link in the Naruto and Bleach articles. I am still a beginner, so I have no understanding as how to do it on Protected Pages yet.

one of them is not protected, the other one is only semi-protected. so once you have been around a little longer you will be able to edit both of them regardless. Mathmo ^Talk 09:51, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Sysop bot proposal

Wikipedia:Bots/Requests for approval/Jmax-bot is the URL. Seeing what happened last time anything like this was proposed, I figured an AN post might be a good thing. No comment, just bringing attention to it. -- Tawker 07:54, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

I think you're jumping the gun here. There's alternatives besides sysopping the bot, as I have mentioned in my most recent post at Wikipedia:Bots/Requests_for_approval/Jmax-bot --Jmax- 08:40, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Sanghak continuing to upload images with no source information

Despite receiving numerous warnings and being blocked for 24 hours, Sanghak has just uploaded yet another image with no source information. (More information about this user in IncidentArchive155) -- Sakurambo 桜ん坊 12:21, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Blocked for 1 week.Geni 12:41, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Consensus on vandalism user subpages?

I am trying to build a consensus on vandalism user subpages. I do not think they are acceptable according to Wikipedia's policies, and should thus be done away with accordingly. But first, some background information.

For those of you not aware, a vandalism user subpage is a page created with the sole intent of being vandalized. Typically users will transclude these onto their user pages and leave some text along the lines of, "Vandalize this". To me, these are obviously a bad idea, as they encourage vandalism. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a vandalism warehouse, and I don't think it's an appropriate use of WMF's servers to be hosting places for vandalism.

One major problem with the vandalism subpages is that they create a bit more work for admins. By their very nature, they attract vandalism, and often a bad kind of vandalism. I've seen some pretty vicious personal attacks in these subpages, which creates even more work for Wikipedians and admins, who have to patrol these abominations and remove all of the vandalism that is too bad to be displayed (like the aforementioned "He also masturbates while thinking about his mother."). It's a terrible misuse of admin resources to have to patrol pages that are vandalism magnets; it's much better simply to get rid of the magnets themselves.

Let's look at the kind of culture these subpages promote. They encourage the notion that vandalism is acceptable. Per WP:BEANS, this is a bad idea. They dilute Wikipedia's encyclopedic mission by saying "Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, but also a graffiti wall." Just look at the risk-to-benefit ratio on vandalism subpages; there's all negatives and no positives. Userspace was not created to give users total freedom to create anything they want on Wikipedia, and I do believe vandalism is beyond the pale. Also, they create the tricky issue of somehow trying to determine when someone has crossed a line; obviously if someone posts "You're a stupid cunt" on a userpage, they can be blocked for a personal attack, but if they post this on a vandalism subpage, they have some measure of defense by rationalization: "Ohh, but they wanted vandalism, I didn't really mean it." I can only see this leading to more problems and friction between users. Personal attacks should never be acceptable, and we shouldn't give the people making them any sort of excuse to try to make them.

If you go look over at WP:CSD, you'll see that global criterion for speedy deletion #3 is: "Pure vandalism, including redirects created during cleanup of page move vandalism." Thusly, vandalism subpages fall under a criteria for speedy deletion, unless and until we come up with some inane policy that "Vandalism is never acceptable, unless the user wants it." Since I really don't see that happening, I will be deleting all of the vandalism subpages that I come across, and I would encourage all of my fellow admins to do the same. --Cyde Weys 14:53, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

I've had the same position since I first saw one of these: they don't help the encyclopedia and as you point out can cause extra work and/or harm. I would support a move to delete them all, adding appropriate verbiage as necessary to Wikipedia:User page or other policies and guidelines as appropriate. While normally I am opposed to rules creep, this is not rules creep per se but a clarification of what Wikipedia is not, and of the exisiting rules. One puppy's opinion. KillerChihuahua^?!? 14:59, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Concur: I fail to see why WP:CSD#G3 fails to apply. HTH HAND —Phil | Talk 15:14, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Nuke'em. Thatcher131 15:15, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

• Even mentioning vandalism on a user page - or any page - violates WP:BEANS. What encyclopaedic purpose do these pages serve? Anyone? Guy (Help!) 15:01, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
  • None…but I think you need to provide some context for your first comment. "My main activity on Wikipedia is fixing vandalism" is hardly an egregious beanstuffing slogan. HTH HAND —Phil | Talk 15:14, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
    • So vandalism subpages don't harm anyone, but don't help the encyclopaedia and encourage trolls, therefore should go. Yet subpage galleries of all the pictures on Commons containing nudity don't harm anyone, but don't help the encyclopaedia and encourage trolls, but should stay. I don't get that. Bafflement at double standards aside, any and all "vandalism subpages" should go. Userspace subpages should either help the encyclopaedia, or be deleted. Wikipedia isn't free web hosting. Proto::► 15:27, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
      • • Are you referring to user subpages like this? (warning: not work-safe). FWIW, before I posted that, I commented on Cyde's talk page in support of nuking the vandalism subpages, and I still support nuking such subpages. Carcharoth 15:35, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
• I think Cyde's policy will create more work for admins (now we have to check all userpages if they have a vandalism section??), and is completely unnecessary. Like most policing of userspace, it creates unnecessary drama in the name of "but this does not help building the encyclopedia" without actually helping to build the encyclopedia. Most of the "vandalize this section" sections I have seen on people's userpages were not used for real vandalism, but by usually vandal-fighting Wikipedians having some fun. Keeping Wikipedians happy builds the encyclopedia. Kusma (討論) 15:30, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
  • Please don't try to turn this on its head and suggest that I am calling for more work. It's clearly less work to simply remove these vandalism subpages than to have to continuously patrol them and clean up the nonsense they inevitably generate. I'm not suggesting that we patrol through every single userspace, looking for these things to delete; merely that we delete them as we run across them. --Cyde Weys 15:46, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
• (posted after edit conflict) I think these pages should be covered specifically by a mention among the speedy deletion criteria at WP:CSD if they are not already. My feeling is that these are like the blank concrete walls of a highway underpass - taggers will fill any open space with graffiti and there are some who would argue "better there than on the building next door to my home"; the analogous argument here would be "better to provide an out-of-the-way place for scribblers to do their stuff than in article-space". However, I don't agree with that argument - these should be done away with, not necessarily only based on their falling under 'vandalism' but also because they are explicitly (when invitations to vandalize are involved) for social networking through shared contributions aimed at a goal other than improving the encyclopedia and therefore fall under part of WP:NOT ("Wikipedia is not a blog, webspace provider, or social networking site"). --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 15:39, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
  • I think some social networking "vandalism" can be good for the atmosphere, see the sonnet section of User:Geogre. Kusma (討論) 15:41, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
    • It sure as hell shouldn't be called vandalism then. Call it a "sandbox" or whatever. --Cyde Weys 15:43, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
      • Certainly not all social networking involves vandalism and not all social networking is banned from Wikipedia; that networking that facilitates creation of the encyclopedia should be preserved and in moderation encouraged. Let's put it this way - any speedy deletion criterion needs to be applied using common sense and any page that is deleted under CSD can be taken up for undeletion - including 'valid networking exercises' where they can be considered for preservation in the Wikipedia environment. CSD is a broad, fast and crude instrument - which is why it shouldn't be applied letter-of-the-law style and notifications of CSD action need to be put on user talk pages so that remedies for recovery can be applied. --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 15:49, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
  • I think we are ignoring the big problem here, and is those fake You have new messages things... GRR! Ummm, oh ya, the vandalism thing, a sandbox is for learning, practicing, and testing wiki markup that is fine. But if it does not serve the encyclopedia and causes extra work for the community then it cannot be justified. HighInBC ^{(Need help? Ask me)} 16:56, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
    • "Fake You have new messages things" ... huh? I'm not sure what you mean. 'New message' notices generated as the result of vandalism to your user talk page, perhaps? --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 17:07, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
      • No, some people actually write fake "new messages" banners and put them at the top of their pages. When you click on it, it doesn't take you to your own talk page, but to somewhere like Practical joke ... though I've seen some trolls making it go to much worse places. And yes, I have been removing those on sight. They're just plain annoying. --Cyde Weys 17:16, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
        • Oh, ok. Sorry for making you spill some BEANS to educate me. --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 17:27, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
  • Lol, fergot about the beans. HighInBC ^{(Need help? Ask me)} 17:30, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

I agree that vandalism subpages fall under CSD 3 and should be speedied. There's no valid reason to have them here. If people want to goof off, they can use the sandbox. ···日本穣^{? · Talk to Nihonjoe} 20:07, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Closing Poll: "Ryūkyū" instead of "Ryukyu"

Can some admin please look over the following 2 recently closed polls, related to WP:MOS-JA, and determine if I conducted them properly?....

1. Poll: "Ogasawara Islands" instead of "Bonin Islands"
2. Poll: "Ryūkyū" instead of "Ryukyu"

We have exhausted the regular list of impartial admins in WP:MOS-JA, because many of them voted on this issue.

Although I went ahead and closed these 2 polls myself, can some admin look over the final results there, and either endorse or revise these final results? The 2nd poll is particularly controversial. (For full details on the controversy and background information, see Ryukyu vs. Ryūkyū (in the WP:MOS-JA talk page) and Talk:Ryukyu Islands.) If the results should be "no consensus" instead, there's also the qustion of what the status quo was to begin with, because there were massive undiscussed page moves and changes at around October. (See page histories of Ryukyu Islands, Ryukyu proper, Ryukyu Kingdom, Ryukyuan language, Ryukyu Trench, Ryukyuan history, Category:Ryukyu Islands, etc.) Thank you for your cooperation.--Endroit 15:55, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Husond has requested me to reopen the 2nd poll in my talk page, and I quote him below, but I believe a reanalysis (and possible change of the final results) by an impartial admin is sufficient.--Endroit 15:55, 15 December 2006 (UTC)....

"Endroit, it is very unorthodox for a poll nominator to close his own poll, especially after actively participating in it. Please reopen the poll an wait for an administrator that did not participate to close it. Furthermore, the result was clearly not "oppose" but rather "no consensus". Regards --Húsönd 15:05, 15 December 2006 (UTC)"

I too would appreciate it if a few administrators would comment on this poll. I can not claim to be impartial, however I think it is clear that the poll was "no consensus". Regardless of the result, I also question the conclusions drawn from the poll. I have left more specific comments after the poll. Thank you. Bendono 16:11, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

I contacted Tariqabjotu asking him for a second opinion regarding this issue. In his reply, he agrees that Endroit should've not closed the poll in his favor. However, Tariq reckons that Endroid chose the right output ("oppose"). I am very reluctant to concede "oppose" as the outcome from a discussion with this result (regardless of my bias in this particular one). The borderline of consensus is of course at each editor's discretion, thus it would be pertinent if more administrators state whether they would close this discussion as "oppose" or "no consensus".--Húsönd 17:11, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Requesting admin resolution of sockpuppet/meatpuppet accusation

I've been accused of being a sockpuppeteer by User:BenBurch. This sockpuppet accusation is false. There has been no request for Checkuser; instead, the false accusation has been used as a vehicle for interrogating me, with varying degrees of hostility and incivility, for the past five days. On his own Talk page, this individual has addressed me with the sentence, "Fuck you and the horse you rode in on." I am asking whatever administrator reads this first to resolve Ben's accusation. Declare me guilty or innocent, and let's move on. I've been editing without registering an account for about three years; most of my edits have been for errors in spelling, grammar and punctuation. This practice has two significant features: it's never led to any arguments or animosity before, and it is a much needed service. I continue to have a lot of work to do. -- 68.253.133.63 04:50, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

• Are you User:BryanFromPalatine? Alex Bakharev 05:18, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
• Yes, I am. And I would venture to say that the only "bad" thing that 12ptHelvetica and I have done is to express opinions that differ from those of BenBurch. I would add that he has posted the sentence, "Fuck you and the horse you rode in on," addressed to me, then quickly deleted it because he knew I had seen it. I'd appreciate a prompt and amicable resolution of this issue before proceeding with any more edits. -- BryanFromPalatine 13:15, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
  • Could you specify where that message was left. I don't see it on your talk page. I did see some edit warring over the sockpuppet investigation notice, and civility and AGF warnings to you from User:Fairness And Accuracy For All. -- Donald Albury 18:37, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Indefinite Block of User:XP

User:XP has been involved in a heated, but polite, discussion in a Request For Arbitration [22] discussion. This discussion [23] is followed by dozens of Admins, the majority of whom disagree with User:XP's opinion. [24] Admin User:Chairboy has blocked User:XP as a sockpuppet of a banned user, User:Rootology. No rationale was given for how these users were determined to be the same. User:XP had a multi-month long edit history [25], and denied being User:Rootology when asked. [26] I am concerned a legitimate user may have been silenced by hasty admin action. I request admin's not associated with the Request For Arbitration [27] User:XP was commenting on ask Admin User:Chairboy for his rationale in blocking User:XP. If inadequate rationale exists, in my opinion the user should be unblocked. Abe Froman 18:47, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

I'd be more than happy to discuss the methods used to support the block, the evidence is square, solid, and the identity of the user as a sock puppet is not in doubt. I appreciate Abe's interest in the matter, and his concern for a fellow editor is both commendable and in the best spirit of Wikipedia. Because of the sensitivity of the issue and the history of the blocked user (Rootology), I invite any administrator who is interested to contact me off-wiki. Best regards, CHAIRBOY (☎) 18:56, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

I can't call myself completely uninvolved, because I have commented in the Wikipedia:Requests_for_arbitration/Seabhcan arbitration case, although I have no experience of editing in the same articles as Seabhcan, MONGO, or XP. I will say, though, that I'm satisfied in this case. Sockpuppetry evidence is never made public, as it would teach people how to avoid detection. In public, I'll say that Rootology was known to be using sockpuppets, and that it was fairly obvious that XP was a sockpuppet of somebody. Regarding the specific evidence that linked the two accounts, let's imagine we had an abusive user who constantly made the same spelling mistake — one of which he was completely unaware — and who was known to use sockpupets. Abe, do you think that it would be a good idea for the administrators who knew about it to post here exactly what that spelling mistake was? Chairboy seems, as far as I can tell, to be completely uninvolved in this case. On his talk page, he has said that administrators who would like to know more may contact him. As one who has dealt with this kind of thing before (detecting sockpuppetry, circulating the evidence privately to other admins and to the ArbCom mailing list, and accepting that uninvolved administrators could carry out the block or not, according to their judgment), and as one who has seen some of the evidence in this case, I'd like to say that I'm completely satisfied. AnnH ♫ 19:11, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

I am a regular Wikipedia contributor, and have not before seen secrecy cited as an integral part of how this project conducts business. Perhaps I am naive, but I would still like an admin uninvolved with Wikipedia:Requests_for_arbitration/Seabhcan to investigate the rationale behind User:Chairboy's indefinite block of User:XP. That is all I am asking for. Abe Froman 19:20, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Perhaps Chairboy could e-mail his evidence to me. I'm willing to review it. Would that do? Thatcher131 19:57, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

That's great, thanks. Abe Froman 19:59, 15 December 2006 (UTC)